What happens If its a No Result

[mucker]

Last years strike was about stopping them and reaching an agreement which introduce change by agreement , with safeguards and a better reward package that was what every member was balloted on. If the deal is not good enough then we will have to fight for a better deal.

indeed i couldnt agree more,the deal is not good enough simple as.it's a shame we are having to vote on the aggrement,everything we gained by taking action, was lost when we went back to work.we had them by the balls,and have waited for 4 months for in your words "negotations have reached a point where Royal mail have made their final offer"that offer would have been IMO far better if we continued with with the strike action(or threat of action)

[stuart clark]

if we get a no vote,which we surely must can anyone tell me why , we have to be balloted for strike. why cant we be balloted for another form of industrial action, as in work to rule or do your job properly. surely everyone knows this would cause chaos. nobody likes losing money and this way we'd still get paid and i know my office would come to a grinding halt.my rep allways spouts some rubbish when asked this so can someone tell me why not?

[dvbuk55]

If after 4 months of negotiating and and Royal Mails final offer, and I would still like to know what their INITIAL offer was if this is the final offer, there may well have been negotiation but it wasn't for us. It wasn't negotiation it was capitulation.

If after 4 months we end up with the same things we are going to end up with anyway why bother to vote at all when all that is happening is that the CWU end up being the milk monitor for Royal Mail - you know the old adage, give someone a little bit of power to make them feel important.

A deal that lasts for THREE YEARS - so in that time the CWU has nothing to do but collude with Royal Mail to produce the results they want, and if there are any problems step out of the firing line and hand them to ACAS - well it does seem a good deal for some.

Now lets hope against hope and we get a NO vote, then Royal Mail will, as Dingo says, bring in change wherever it can at a pace much slower than they anticipate with a workforce that opposes that change. D2D, dead in the water, if they give you more than the agreed 3 lots as per the 1996 agreement, you won't have to take them and if they don't pay you the CWU would have to try to make them adhere to the agreement and if they try to sack you then a tribunal would have to uphold that they had acted outside the agreement.

You have people on here saying there isn't an option and truly the option isn't a pleasant prospect BUT it is an alternative that at least leaves us with some dignity.

[Big Daz]

Utilise all paid work hours, I think it would be safe to say RM legal bods would roll that one out.

Rather than refuse stick to 20% a day and cut off/book OT, then the case against RML from a legal perspective would be stronger.

[dvbuk55]

Utilise all paid work hours, I think it would be safe to say RM legal bods would roll that one out.

Rather than refuse stick to 20% a day and cut off/book OT, then the case against RML from a legal perspective would be stronger.

But there is an alternative and we SHOULD, and we DO work all paid hours NOW.

[Eric]

The reason Royal Mail is not in a better financial position is because of DSA. Sort that out and there would be far more in the pot.

I reckon about two thirds of the mail I deliver these days is DSA. If that is the case nationwide we are delivering 50 million DSA items a day at, according to Billy, a loss of 2 pence each.That means a loss of £1 million a day on DSA. By just delivering at cost we would be £300+ million a year better off if we dared to make a profit on these items we could be talking an extra billion or so profit!

That is where the union should be focussing its efforts. Why is Roy Mayall the only voice that we hear in the media talking about DSA?

If we are to strike again let's tell the general public that we are subsidising the banks and utility companies through DSA and let them decide whether that is fair or not. I genuinely believe that the country is sick to the back teeth of the fat cats creaming off the profits at the expense of the working man and always with the connivance of our government.

[Big Daz]

Utilise all paid work hours, I think it would be safe to say RM legal bods would roll that one out.

Rather than refuse stick to 20% a day and cut off/book OT, then the case against RML from a legal perspective would be stronger.

But there is an alternative and we SHOULD, and we DO work all paid hours NOW.

If only that were true of each and every single D.O

[axeman]

dingo & co are on a mission.... one that involves rolling over for royal fail and his superior clansmen in the forefront of the cwu never has such an uncaring union been seen if this is the way the cwu thinks it should protect the workers then god help us
It's plain to for all to see that the agreement is a fudge beetween the cwu and royal fail i can only wait in anticipation when the deal is rejected for all the spin
hayes & ward etc have put on it.
The only worrying thing is if all these memebers do leave and royal fail do what was said at a meeting and bank roll cwu finances how much our working lives will change under a union funded by royal fail ....time methinks to oust hayes & co and get leaders who are not subservient to royal fail

[dvbuk55]

dingo & co are on a mission.... one that involves rolling over for royal fail and his superior clansmen in the forefront of the cwu never has such an uncaring union been seen if this is the way the cwu thinks it should protect the workers then god help us
It's plain to for all to see that the agreement is a fudge beetween the cwu and royal fail i can only wait in anticipation when the deal is rejected for all the spin
hayes & ward etc have put on it.
The only worrying thing is if all these memebers do leave and royal fail do what was said at a meeting and bank roll cwu finances how much our working lives will change under a union funded by royal fail ....time methinks to oust hayes & co and get leaders who are not subservient to royal fail

One way for the Union to distance itself from Royal Mail financially, and lets face it the current situation is a recipe for abuse and it has been, is to contact each member for a request to have the subs paid by direct debit and stop the deduction from pay. They won't because they are afraid that without RM support they would not be financially viable and if that is the case then we are, as a union, beholden to Royal Mail and cannot possibly be autonomous.

It would mean that the finances of the union would have to be brought into line with income and expenditure being balanced and that would mean like you and I the union would have to live within its means. Salaries would need to be looked at, loans called in or brought into line with current loan rates, offices that had a value remortgaged or sold.

Do I think that is going to happen - no of course not, too many people have a vested interest in maintaining things as they are and it doesn't include looking after the interests of the members who pay a weekly subscription.

[Martin Walsh]

dingo & co are on a mission.... one that involves rolling over for royal fail and his superior clansmen in the forefront of the cwu never has such an uncaring union been seen if this is the way the cwu thinks it should protect the workers then god help us
It's plain to for all to see that the agreement is a fudge beetween the cwu and royal fail i can only wait in anticipation when the deal is rejected for all the spin
hayes & ward etc have put on it.
The only worrying thing is if all these memebers do leave and royal fail do what was said at a meeting and bank roll cwu finances how much our working lives will change under a union funded by royal fail ....time methinks to oust hayes & co and get leaders who are not subservient to royal fail

No one is rolling over for anyone. I have been in more disputes fighting for terms and conditions then i care to remember. However simply adopting the mantra of lets get rid of downstream access well yes its popular to do that but at the moment you would need to change the Postal Services Bill and you would need to change the european directive on opening up postal services.

In addition asking for a work to rule achieves nothing, on one hand members defy it and on the other it allows managers to take indivuduals off pay which in the end causes unofficial action.

Look I will accept the members decision and if we have to go out on strike do my best to get the members out. However can some of you who constantly hide behind the keyboard and slag everything off say the same.

Its easy to moan , its a lot harder to find solutions.

[fishtank]

Its easy to moan , its a lot harder to find solutions.

Yes dingo it is but there are those who are paid a great deal of money to find solutions........our money.

[mucker]

Its easy to moan , its a lot harder to find solutions.

Yes dingo it is but there are those who are paid a great deal of money to find solutions........our money.

spot on fishtank,dingo you appear to take things to heart.we pay a fair ammout of subs each week and expect more than what you guys have come up with.remember it's hard work being a postie,and we deserve better from royal fail....

[dvbuk55]

Moan moan moan moan - hey that was really easy - however, we also provide suggested solutions - vote NO and get back to the table.

Drop the pro rata for D2D payments for part timers, pay the full amount for colleague share for part timers, withdraw from financial arrangements with Royal Mail - I have heard suggested that some Branch's actually have more available funds to hand than HQ. If that is true then those monies paid to branchs needs to be brought into line with current national financial stringency.

There is no point in harping on past glories, this is the here and now and the one statement you have made is that this deal will be life changing, well for delivery postmen that was never more true, for others not quite so life changing and for a very privileged few definitely more amenable - finances put on a more consistent footing, 3 year deal with no more negotiating to do and ACAS to sort out the problems - now there is a deal of the century - pity it didn't encompass the membership in general.

Oh and as a form of credentials dingo I have been a member of and a supporter of a union for almost forty years and been on strike many many times and manned every picket line - it doesn't make me special.

[Big Daz]

The solution to DSA is to make it truly reflective of cost and legitimate desire of RML to make profit on it.

Parliment could stick two fingers up at Europe and re insate the monopoly, but the political will is not there.

CWU have campaigned for that and made submission to the Hooper report.

Have a re-read of the regulation section of the PSB, much better than the current set up, it even includes a clause that allow DSA companies to pay towards the upkeep of the universal service if need be. CWU belive and have stated this point to the political community many times that DSA comapnies should pay anyway. Sadly the political will does not exist in enough quanity at westminster.

[dvbuk55]

The solution to DSA is to make it truly reflective of cost and legitimate desire of RML to make profit on it.

Parliment could stick two fingers up at Europe and re insate the monopoly, but the political will is not there.

CWU have campaigned for that and made submission to the Hooper report.

Have a re-read of the regulation section of the PSB, much better than the current set up, it even includes a clause that allow DSA companies to pay towards the upkeep of the universal service if need be. CWU belive and have stated this point to the political community many times that DSA comapnies should pay anyway. Sadly the political will does not exist in enough quanity at westminster.

Yes! Ungrateful bastards and all that money we have given them over the years I thought they wuz in our pocket or have I got that the wrong way round