Manchester roadshow propaganda

[fishtank]

And so much for conference policy

Conference agrees that if Royal Mail does wish to introduce a new delivery model then this must be subject to national negotiations and a national agreement. Conference further agrees that any such agreement must ensure that if delivery attendance times are significantly altered that the current early shift allowance is protected on permanent basis by incorporation into basic pay for delivery members.
The Postal Executive is instructed accordingly

I am sure we have had this debate before however the bottom line is for the majority of delivery members this delivery supplement means a pay cut at least until the increasingly dubious looking 3.5% kicks in during 2012 by which time they will have suffered for 4 years.
Not good enough Daz,not even close.

[pickaname]

Dont even bother reading Dingos post's anymore.

The CWU are just an arm of Royal Mail management now.

[Big Daz]

And so much for conference policy

Conference agrees that if Royal Mail does wish to introduce a new delivery model then this must be subject to national negotiations and a national agreement. Conference further agrees that any such agreement must ensure that if delivery attendance times are significantly altered that the current early shift allowance is protected on permanent basis by incorporation into basic pay for delivery members.
The Postal Executive is instructed accordingly

I am sure we have had this debate before however the bottom line is for the majority of delivery members this delivery supplement means a pay cut at least until the increasingly dubious looking 3.5% kicks in during 2012 by which time they will have suffered for 4 years.
Not good enough Daz,not even close.

I imagine it will be argued by that ESA is still in the overall pay bill even though it is not in basic pay.

By delivery members is it meant those who do delivery and have a start time that triggers ESA or work in a delivery office doing any job on any attendance time? If that was in a national greement this site would be up in arms about vaugue wording would it not? That motion reads to me that ESA will be spread around more widely as there is no mention of new money.

Of course the proposals we have at the moment spread the ESA more widely do they not just like the conference motion implies.

[Big Daz]

This motion from last year WAS NOT PASSED BY CONFERENCE

7 CATEGORY A: Composite Motion This Conference instructs the incoming Postal Executive that Royal Mail have continued to discriminate against part time employees by only paying them pro-rata of shift and skills allowances when they have commenced or finished duty at the same time or performed the same tasks as full time employees .

The PEC are instructed to achieve an agreement that ensures that part time workers within Royal Mail receive the full allowance payment for any shift/skills payments and not pro-rata as it currently stands within the business.If Royal Mail continue to pay allowances on a pro-rata basis then the PEC are instructed to write to Branches and ask for volunteers so we can take a number of cases up legally on the grounds of discrimination against part time members by no later than September 2009.

York and District Amal

Leeds No1 Amalgamated Branch

North East Divisional Committee

North East No1

Durham County Amal

Cleveland Amal

Newcastle Amal

Fell

[fishtank]

This motion from last year WAS NOT PASSED BY CONFERENCE

7 CATEGORY A: Composite Motion This Conference instructs the incoming Postal Executive that Royal Mail have continued to discriminate against part time employees by only paying them pro-rata of shift and skills allowances when they have commenced or finished duty at the same time or performed the same tasks as full time employees .

The PEC are instructed to achieve an agreement that ensures that part time workers within Royal Mail receive the full allowance payment for any shift/skills payments and not pro-rata as it currently stands within the business.If Royal Mail continue to pay allowances on a pro-rata basis then the PEC are instructed to write to Branches and ask for volunteers so we can take a number of cases up legally on the grounds of discrimination against part time members by no later than September 2009.

York and District Amal

Leeds No1 Amalgamated Branch

North East Divisional Committee

North East No1

Durham County Amal

Cleveland Amal

Newcastle Amal

Fell

Two years in a row and still not passed,i wonder if three is the charm.

[gb93]

Notice it is all North of England branches which has high part time ratios that supported motion.

Wonder what branches did not.And what was there reason for doing so.

Also might explain why negotiaters thought it ok to make delivery supplement pro rata.

Maybe more winners than losers amongst their divisions.

Just a thought.

[Big Daz]

This one was passed

44 CATEGORY A: Composite Motion This Conference agrees that despite previous assurances, the day to day communications from the Postal Department at CWU HQ are getting progressively worse.

This often results in the most basic updates and information not being available and cannot continue.

Conference therefore agrees that the Postal Executive urgently need to find ways to reverse this trend and implement an agreed action plan at the earliest opportunity possible. Such an agreed plan must include the seeking of Branch and Divisional Committee views on how they think communications and the providing of updates, on a day to day basis can be improved.

Western Counties

Plymouth & East Cornwall Amal

Bristol & District Amal

Carried

[gb93]

And is there a point to last post Big Daz

[Night Tonic]

Dont even bother reading Dingos post's anymore.

The CWU are just an arm of Royal Mail management now.

- well that leaves no one then

[POSTMAN]

The workplan changes will drive what span you have if you dont recieve your second batch of mail from the walk sequencing till 10 and you then have to prep that in with your 60% of your earlier work and do your redirections , dead letters etc then you have to tie up and travel to first delivery point the chances are you wont have much more of a span then now, however if you get your second batch earlier then 10 then you may choose to go longer by local agreement.

But why would anyone want to go longer?Now is this not a problem.....

Office A 1st on the list,will they be forced to have a much longer delivery span than office Z who is the last of the list!

In your view dingo,what is RM's stance on this?

[Martin Walsh]

The workplan changes will drive what span you have if you dont recieve your second batch of mail from the walk sequencing till 10 and you then have to prep that in with your 60% of your earlier work and do your redirections , dead letters etc then you have to tie up and travel to first delivery point the chances are you wont have much more of a span then now, however if you get your second batch earlier then 10 then you may choose to go longer by local agreement.

But why would anyone want to go longer?Now is this not a problem.....

Office A 1st on the list,will they be forced to have a much longer delivery span than office Z who is the last of the list!

In your view dingo,what is RM's stance on this?

Postman without delivery methods then it is unlikely that anyone can have much longer a span then now. The agreement states that those offices who wish to take up this option must have clear demostratable weight solutions.

However when you do have delivery methods then I think offices will decide what length of span suits both your attendance patterns and the mix of full time part time jobs. Plus it will depend when you get that second 40% of your walk sequencing.

Id you want to have a 10 hour day ( 4 day week ) you will have to have a longer delivery span then 3.5 hours or that you recieve you second 40% of work after 10 in the morning. A 9 day fortnight means you have to fill a 8 hour 53 day .

Now remember geo route revisions do not count replinshment time so they go first to last point of delivery and if they stop at 3.5 hours then you have to add on at least 30 to 40 mins replishment time to the walk.

So I know some offices choose last year to increase delivery spans in order to increase full time jobs for part timers and I expect some to go down this route.

But the key to this is really delivery methods and when you have your walk sequencing revision what time your second 40% arrives in your office the general rule of thumb is that the second 40% which clears a mail centre about 4 .40 in the morning and then gets walk sequenced from about 6. A batch of work appoxmately 12 walks have to have 3 passes before they are ready and that the furtherest office away from where your walk sequencing kit is located are usually the first to get their second 40% of work. Which means that the earlist will be after 07 30 and the latest 10 o clock.

[belle smith]

This 60/40 split of mail arriving in offices, how does that work dingo?

1)Is it 100% of the sequenced mail for 60% of the duties. Then 100% of the sequenced mail for 40% of the duties.
2)or is it 60% of the sequenced mail for 100% of the duties Then 40% of the sequenced mail for 100% of the duties.

Under option 1 with 2 to a van delivery methods you'll be out doing your first duty whilst waiting for your second feed, and you will be doing an inordanately long delivery.

[Martin Walsh]

This 60/40 split of mail arriving in offices, how does that work dingo?

1)Is it 100% of the sequenced mail for 60% of the duties. Then 100% of the sequenced mail for 40% of the duties.
2)or is it 60% of the sequenced mail for 100% of the duties Then 40% of the sequenced mail for 100% of the duties.

Under option 1 with 2 to a van delivery methods you'll be out doing your first duty whilst waiting for your second feed, and you will be doing an inordanately long delivery.

no it's 60 per cent of the work to the 100 per cent of walks. The first 60 per cent is your first class intra , neighbour second class which clears a mail centre at about midnight which can then be walk sequenced during the night and be ready for your Arrival in the morning. You will still have to ips your packets flats and any machine rejects. The second 40 per cent of work is your distant mail which does not clear the mail centre until 4.40 in the morning that currently comes into your office for ips in the future this work will be sequenced for all of your walks hence why royal mail wants later finishing times as the work will arrive in delivery office later.

[Big Daz]

And is there a point to last post Big Daz

yes

think about the blackout during talks in the contex of conference made policy

[dvbuk55]

What Dingo fails to mention is that in 2007 the PEC was split 9 For 6 Against and that the waverers were leaned on to become more amenable - then THEY were sent to various areas to persuade people that it was a good deal then - this time they've had to get the professional snake oil salesmen on the road - Dingo you can bullshit all you want - IF THIS DEAL WAS ANY GOOD IT WOULD SELL ITSELF, they wouldn't need the travelling road show - by the by who's sweeping up behind them?
It looks like the the red noses and the big shoes are out in force.