Dogs of War wrote:When the cap is lifted that means royal mail can bring there prices down to get more work which means more d2ds for less money.
Your forgetting if they need to bring their prices down to capture more of the unaddressed market then they would not be able to continue to pay you the 1.67.
In addition think about the fact it also protects jobs when automation is designed to remove jobs.
funny how we are delivery D2Ds for TNT, so TNT will also get a bigger share and STILL pass them on to RM and those that do walks to deliver them, all for the lower price you are saying RM may have to use to "capture more of the unaddressed market"
Supply and demand..............if there are fewer companies that deliver to EVERY door then the price can be negotiated, normal upwards not down!
Dogs of War wrote:By the way dingo where to f**k did you's get 20.60 from. Why not 20.00 or 21.00. Did dave and billy just have a dream and say 20.60 in there sleep.
Its quite simply last year 51 million was paid out on door 2 door payments last year , the previous year it was 55 million. So the union got the 55 million total. The average payment was £12.39.
With regards to the early shift allowance that money is dimishing year in year out as people leave the industry. Last year Royal Mail saved 3 million pounds in early shift allowances as people left the industry.
The union then decided to get the money and pay it to everyone attached to delivery units. So now the supplment will be paid to 97500 people attached to deliveries pro rata for part timers.
This is a real sticking point for me.It would seem that all union members are equal,but some are more equal than others.
dingo wrote:
I think the red in LONDON varies postcode to postcode. Some have better quality then others. However the growth protential in London is massive if quality improves.
Does that mean that those of us in areas where quality is high and we get 3 D2D on a regular basis will under the new agreement be subsidising both those that do not get an opportunity to deliver D2D through no fault of their own i.e geography, and also those in area's that just cant be arsed to deliver them thus reducing the quality and therefore the customers willingness to send them to certain areas i.e. some postcodes in London as you say.
I can understand helping colleagues who through no fault of their own could not get d2d payments.
As you say improve your quality and the growth protential in London is massive, but why should we lose our payments to subsidise your members, people in the areas you are describing should get NO help at all, because if it happened anywhere else they would face conduct charges.
In my office i took last weeks d2d then went back every 6 months for three years to find an average. It works out at £19.70 per claim per person. So purely on d2d my office is 90p better off per week under this agreement, for thoses that usually claim. But then take away the early morning suppliment and you get £11.10 out of pocket each week!!! Not even the 1.5% pay rise would cover that drop!!!
But then you have the people on 30 hr weeks who prep and deliver 100% d2d only being paid pro rata. Who the f thought that up???
Take it out of the agreement and you may have a deal. Keep it in and it will sink
Dogs of War wrote:I do 730 drops while the fellow next door does 250 but he's going to get the same payment as me this is crazy.
Well you should make your rep ensure your walks are equal. After all you get the same basic pay as them.
What an out of touch comment! pass the buck.
The simple fact is the walk that does more d2ds ,does more work when he has d2ds for that week . so hes going to have even more work in the future for less money whilst the less call walk will have more work(but not as much as the other walk)and therefore not lose as much if any with 250 calls.But essentially he is not going to have as much work IS HE?
Being of the former its a no from me.
dingo wrote:The following are factual figures and apply in London ( not including North West London )
Week number 45 (07/02/2010 ) total claimed £52,365.43 by 2553 staff average amount £20.51
week number 46 ( 14/02/2010 ) total claimed £ 59,170.85 by 2747 staff average amount £21.54
week number 47 (21/02/ 2010 ) total claimed £ 47,157.09 by 2557 staff average amount £18.44
week number 48 ( 28.02. 2010 ) total claimed £ 45,833.97 by 2579 staff average amount £ 17.77
week number 49 ( 07 . 03. 2100 ) total claimed £33,520.54 by 2009 saff average amount £ 16.69
The total number of walks ( foot deliveries ) is 3096.
Total delivery employees in London is 6277.
You can see Door to Door fluctuates from week to week plus the amount of indivuduals claiming door to door varies. In London there are a number of so called barrons in certain offices. However it should also be noted that not every walk has door to door as there are 3096 actual walks in London not counting RDCs , firms vans etc.
Every Division can obtain these figues and should do , to ensure we have some facts on door to door. Additionally Door to Door figures per office are also available .
i will give you a fact dingo combine those figures with the early shift allowance we are all losing ie £12.37 for me ... then tell me i am not losing money .. i get roughly on average £23.00 per wekk d2d money because my floater does 20% of my d2ds combine that with my £12.37 and you will find i am losing £15 quid a week and you want us to deliver more of them ... away and take a flying f**k to yourself
"Vi har haft århundraden av kärlek och tillit till varandra."
dingo wrote:The following are factual figures and apply in London ( not including North West London )
Week number 45 (07/02/2010 ) total claimed £52,365.43 by 2553 staff average amount £20.51
week number 46 ( 14/02/2010 ) total claimed £ 59,170.85 by 2747 staff average amount £21.54
week number 47 (21/02/ 2010 ) total claimed £ 47,157.09 by 2557 staff average amount £18.44
week number 48 ( 28.02. 2010 ) total claimed £ 45,833.97 by 2579 staff average amount £ 17.77
week number 49 ( 07 . 03. 2100 ) total claimed £33,520.54 by 2009 saff average amount £ 16.69
The total number of walks ( foot deliveries ) is 3096.
Total delivery employees in London is 6277.
There are just 3 offices in London with early shift 1 payments. Now in terms of whether you lose is if you do have 3 items of door to door every week which will mean that you have in the region of 400 plus delivery points. Plus you dont get door to door at christmas or during your leave. Some may lose money and I understand why they would be angry however if we dont put door to door into workload then you will lose a lot more money as you wont have as many full time jobs.
Plus do you really believe that Royal Mail are going to continue with the current system on door to door turning away contracts worth millions when they are losing revenue through downstream access and downtrading on exisiting products .
Some posters need to get in the real world , you either accept you have to have more working into workload which protects your jobs or you want a part time industry.
You can see Door to Door fluctuates from week to week plus the amount of indivuduals claiming door to door varies. In London there are a number of so called barrons in certain offices. However it should also be noted that not every walk has door to door as there are 3096 actual walks in London not counting RDCs , firms vans etc.
Every Division can obtain these figues and should do , to ensure we have some facts on door to door. Additionally Door to Door figures per office are also available .
i will give you a fact dingo combine those figures with the early shift allowance we are all losing ie £12.37 for me ... then tell me i am not losing money .. i get roughly on average £23.00 per wekk d2d money because my floater does 20% of my d2ds combine that with my £12.37 and you will find i am losing £15 quid a week and you want us to deliver more of them ... away and take a flying f**k to yourself
Dogs of War wrote:When the cap is lifted that means royal mail can bring there prices down to get more work which means more d2ds for less money.
Your forgetting if they need to bring their prices down to capture more of the unaddressed market then they would not be able to continue to pay you the 1.67.
You won't get 1.67 you get £20.60 no matter how many you do, none or say 6.
What I would like to have cleared up is this, when we first heard about the new D2D agreement, we was told that they would put them all together some how, but today it was said mybe and we will have to add time to the duties for prepping them. Well what is the truth all together or prep time added ?
dingo wrote:The following are factual figures and apply in London ( not including North West London )
Week number 45 (07/02/2010 ) total claimed £52,365.43 by 2553 staff average amount £20.51
week number 46 ( 14/02/2010 ) total claimed £ 59,170.85 by 2747 staff average amount £21.54
week number 47 (21/02/ 2010 ) total claimed £ 47,157.09 by 2557 staff average amount £18.44
week number 48 ( 28.02. 2010 ) total claimed £ 45,833.97 by 2579 staff average amount £ 17.77
week number 49 ( 07 . 03. 2100 ) total claimed £33,520.54 by 2009 saff average amount £ 16.69
The total number of walks ( foot deliveries ) is 3096.
Total delivery employees in London is 6277.
You can see Door to Door fluctuates from week to week plus the amount of indivuduals claiming door to door varies. In London there are a number of so called barrons in certain offices. However it should also be noted that not every walk has door to door as there are 3096 actual walks in London not counting RDCs , firms vans etc.
Every Division can obtain these figues and should do , to ensure we have some facts on door to door. Additionally Door to Door figures per office are also available .
Which begs the question, if London had higher figures for D2Ds, would the CWU still have pursued this policy of spreading D2D money?
Dogs of War wrote:When the cap is lifted that means royal mail can bring there prices down to get more work which means more d2ds for less money.
Your forgetting if they need to bring their prices down to capture more of the unaddressed market then they would not be able to continue to pay you the 1.67.
You won't get 1.67 you get £20.60 no matter how many you do, none or say 6.
What I would like to have cleared up is this, when we first heard about the new D2D agreement, we was told that they would put them all together some how, but today it was said mybe and we will have to add time to the duties for prepping them. Well what is the truth all together or prep time added ?
Both!!!
New work rates are being developed which will allow for prep and delivery of DTD, untill those workrates are finalised and revealed we can only guess if they will be any good.
Getting them alltogether is something RM are thinking about, but at this moment in time its still in R & D.
dingo wrote:
In addition think about the fact it also protects jobs when automation is designed to remove jobs.
One minute the CWU spokesmen are telling us that D2Ds into workload will protect jobs, then they're telling us that D2Ds will soon be arriving in one envelope, which is it?
