UPDATE FROM HQ

[Rennie]

maybe get the cowboys to shoot the messenger!

[gb93]

I 2nd the above post.

[gb93]

OOPS sorry meant sirtophats (i think thats right) post

[belle smith]

[A few years ago Royal Mail publish a hit list for mail centres which reduced mail centres to 31 , most on that list have closed since , Royal Mail denial that they have a list and have redfused to give the CWU a list.

The CWU have heard of the Freedom of information act.

[belle smith]

Dingo,
So after months of negotiation,or perhaps more aptly Cat and Mouse,the messages that we are getting
appear to suggest that RM may yet simply pull the rug from under us?
You imply that the future without agreement would be a disaster,do you mean for all parties?
Could you see a scenario where individual agreements are signed off,for example both sides are happy with
mail centres,distribution,but talks regarding deliveries would have to continue,or is this not an option?

If there is a deal it will include all the elements which have been agreed, there will be futher things which will be subject to futher talks and guidelines but in the main it will cover all the big ticket issues.

I think no agreement would be a disaster for us. Remember there are people facing mail centre clousres now, 200 members in Crewe have no jobs and could face complusory redundancies, you ask them if they want wants in the national agreement. The union has managed to ensure that no further work is transfered until these 200 people are protected. Remember we had the same problem in Stoke.

In addition we have the South East review which will close a number of mail centres and the North East review will also do the same. These will happen with or without an agreement.

Plus walk sequencing is happening now and at the moment walk bundles are being used Saturday whats happens when this changes. Plus a whole range of other issue which are catered for in the national agreement.

Of course the benefits must be right but who remembers the number of banners and placards on picket lines which said this strike is not about pay. Its about our future.

We all hope it is the right agreement. Of course some will not like it , but the question is not about the miniority its about the majority and that is what decide if there is an agreement in the end not who shouts the loudest or who types the faster or the most.

Dingo, i realise that like 'kids in the sweet shop' we can't get everything that we want. But i really do object to the way the union puts a gloss on these things. You said in another thread that postmans now closed, that there won't be anything in the agreement stating a delivery of longer than 3.5 hours but that doesn't include replenisment. since when! thats longer than 3.5 hour delivery span!

also if our D2D payments are consolidated into our pay, then the only people in the country who will know that we haven't had a massive pay rise are us! and the CWU will be busy doing RM's PR for them.

ps. sorry to complain at you. it's not personnel, when we are frustated with HQ we have limited ways of expressing it to them. and i do appreciate you coming on to keep us updated.

[wranglered]

Aint it funny how HQ want the cowboys to do the work and then shoot em through the head with an arrow and say you dont have the responsible that REPs do! Word to the wise, we are the UNION and our REPS jobs is to protect each and every CWU JOB! Dont get us doing your work as normal members and then block us out because WE DONT UNDERSTAND. If we dont its the bloody senior REPS fault! If the Senior REPs have cozzied up to RM its their fault! If Senior REPS have painted themselves into a corner its their fault! INFACT THE SHAMBLES THAT IS THE CWU is the SENIOR REPs FAULT! Do not insult grass roots members and say we dont understand cause we do! SENIOR REPs have FAILED and FAILED BADLY! They jumped into bed with the employer / Government and we as the grassroots are paying the price. What happens now is anyones guess but as a grass roots member i shall fight for EVERY CWU JOB! I DONT EXCEPT CWU HQs /RMs / Governments CUTS to our jobs pay and connditions for ALL THOSE MISTAKES that THEY have made and have been foistered onto our members! If senior CWU members want respect then they need to earn it and this they have clearly failed to do like many other things from its members! Or do dingo`s members pat him on the back and say good job? Dont think so!

well said Linkin...the tone of some of the latest stuff is arrogant in the extreme....

be careful though...if you become too anti HQ you might find yourself banished to the Canteen...

also funny how we have all these new members bigging up the leaker...

[dvbuk55]

Aint it funny how HQ want the cowboys to do the work and then shoot em through the head with an arrow and say you dont have the responsible that REPs do! Word to the wise, we are the UNION and our REPS jobs is to protect each and every CWU JOB! Dont get us doing your work as normal members and then block us out because WE DONT UNDERSTAND. If we dont its the bloody senior REPS fault! If the Senior REPs have cozzied up to RM its their fault! If Senior REPS have painted themselves into a corner its their fault! INFACT THE SHAMBLES THAT IS THE CWU is the SENIOR REPs FAULT! Do not insult grass roots members and say we dont understand cause we do! SENIOR REPs have FAILED and FAILED BADLY! They jumped into bed with the employer / Government and we as the grassroots are paying the price. What happens now is anyones guess but as a grass roots member i shall fight for EVERY CWU JOB! I DONT EXCEPT CWU HQs /RMs / Governments CUTS to our jobs pay and connditions for ALL THOSE MISTAKES that THEY have made and have been foistered onto our members! If senior CWU members want respect then they need to earn it and this they have clearly failed to do like many other things from its members! Or do dingo`s members pat him on the back and say good job? Dont think so!

well said Linkin...the tone of some of the latest stuff is arrogant in the extreme....

be careful though...if you become too anti HQ you might find yourself banished to the Canteen...

also funny how we have all these new members bigging up the leaker...

Well you won't find me in the canteen, we haven't got one and anyway even if we had they wouldn't let my horse in

[fishtank]

TicCactus.gif

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Rider_200.jpg

I rather like the idea.

[rockytony67]

Well you won't find me in the canteen, we haven't got one and anyway even if we had they wouldn't let my horse in

Look on the bright side Dvbuk, you've only got a year to retirement, none of these changes will affect you, your be able to take your horse to pastures new

[rockytony67]

So is it true then Fishtank, you haven't got the balls too take on a Rep's job remember anyone can be a cyberspace tough guy

[fishtank]

So is it true then Fishtank, you haven't got the balls too take on a Rep's job remember anyone can be a cyberspace tough guy

Don't believe everything you read on the internet rockytony67.

[dvbuk55]

[quote="dvbuk55"/quote]
Well you won't find me in the canteen, we haven't got one and anyway even if we had they wouldn't let my horse in

Look on the bright side Dvbuk, you've only got a year to retirement, none of these changes will affect you, your be able to take your horse to pastures new [/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

Well I'm learning to ride bareback now - did I ever tell you I began my adult army service in the horse artillery - no seriously I really did

Well I have a little bit more than a year but if you can find me some little niche forum where I can create mischief.................................

Maybe I'll be like Roy and write a book - something like "The Modern Pony Express Rider" - the front cover could be me sat astride an HCT which could well explain my bow legs

[rockytony67]

[quote="dvbuk55"/quote]
Well you won't find me in the canteen, we haven't got one and anyway even if we had they wouldn't let my horse in

Look on the bright side Dvbuk, you've only got a year to retirement, none of these changes will affect you, your be able to take your horse to pastures new

[/quote][/quote][/quote]

Well I'm learning to ride bareback now - did I ever tell you I began my adult army service in the horse artillery - no seriously I really did

Well I have a little bit more than a year but if you can find me some little niche forum where I can create mischief.................................

Maybe I'll be like Roy and write a book - something like "The Modern Pony Express Rider" - the front cover could be me sat astride an HCT which could well explain my bow legs [/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

Fair point, its a bit like the wife, life wouldn't be the same without you moaning

[Martin Walsh]

Belle I understand your concerns. Geo route has for some time mapped walks 1st point to last delivery point and then put in replenishment time on top. Anyone who has had a geo route revision over the last 18 months would have a longer delivery than 3.5 hours now. In addition under the geo route system 2008 it does the same. Royal Mail`s belief is that car derived vans will eventually remove the need for replenishment time. I have to say my experience in London on car derived vans is that they dont work however I know that in Plymouth and in other places it does work.

Now your point on door to door is a fair point. However the current status is that Royal Mail currently pay 55 million per year in door to door payments. Now the fact is and I have seen the statistics is that some offices including lots in London do not get 3 per week , in fact some postcodes within offices dont rise above 1. Some offices have even agreed to do more. We also know that door to door quality is poor in some offices is appalling. We already know we have door to door barons who do a large number of door to door items for an office and normally get their families to do it as well. In a number of places casuals end up taking them out or they dont get done. Remember unaddressed items is the one item of mail which is growing still. Yet Royal Mail cannot grow this product if the delivery of the item is still done in this kind of manner.

The real truth of the matter is that over the next few years we are going to see thousands of jobs go on one hand , full time jobs threatened on the other and on top of all this some members still dont want to use door to door as a product to protect full time jobs. By the way Royal Mail believe the initial cost they will have to pay out from day 1 that when door to door is put into workload is 40 million. In some ways its bizzare that we are going to have job loses but Royal Mail will have to invest in offices to get door to door up to a standard particularly in those offices who dont have walk sequencing till 2011.

Look Linkin I was not having a pop at you , at least you were up for the row last year when others were standing on the sidelines. However sometimes if someone gives out plenty of stick then they should be up for a bit coming back. I know I put myself up for a bit of stick by posting on here ignoring most of my mates advice. But some of the posts slagging me off by some individuals not all on this site are clearly a form of bullying. It doesn't worry me , as I have broad shoulders but some other individuals may not.

Wrangled those who know me know I am far from arrogant , however you on the other hand I know a lot about and the way you snipe on here is a reflection of you as a person.

[postghost]

The real truth of the matter is that over the next few years we are going to see thousands of jobs go on one hand , full time jobs threatened on the other and on top of all this some members still dont want to use door to door as a product to protect full time jobs. By the way Royal Mail believe the initial cost they will have to pay out from day 1 that when door to door is put into workload is 40 million. In some ways its bizzare that we are going to have job loses but Royal Mail will have to invest in offices to get door to door up to a standard particularly in those offices who dont have walk sequencing till 2011.

There is a fine line between "protecting jobs" and abuse of jobs. Management have been underhand in their dealings and informing us of the correct procedure of d2d's in the past. This will now be a cash cow they will milk to death at OUR expense. Nothing is going to change in that respect.

Royal Mail don't and probably won't invest to get offices "up to a standard" in d2d's. We are still waiting on the "investment" they promised us a long, long, long time ago for other parts of the business.