National Negotiations – Extended into next week,and the next

[wranglered]

Talented?

Well he gets voted in each year,


Just a shame about the turnout!!! Im sure youve got a few opinions on that.


Still there are many things happening beyond my control and if i get slagged off for expressing a opinon on this site then so be it.

Who would have ever thought a local rep expressing the views and defending the views of his members would get slagged off?

don't be so defensive!!!

[Big Daz]

It's in my nature to be defensive!!!

[The truth!]

the truth wrote
"So I would say once it is explained to members on that basis they will not be supporting one standrised start time."

It is not a case of supporting one thing or another it is a case of understanding and dealing with the flaws in both.
Many members,due to commitments outside of Royal Mail will be unable to comply with your vision of later starts.
They will have there lives turned upside down and possibly be forced to leave RM solely due to the geographical position of their D.O.
Can you honestly say you are happy with that?

Of course I am not happy with that , I have spent most of my working life fighting attacks on our terms and conditions. However some have still come in whether we have taken strike action or not. When we took 20 days strike action last year we did so to ensure there was a national agreement on the future rathen than Royal Mail`s imposed policy and to

Things like steaming and protection of the second delivery and the 09.30 last letter to name just one where we saw the collective falure of the CWU to stop.

However what is the alternative ? Do we walk away and let them impose this change on an office by office basis without the protection and benefits of a national agreement or do our leaders have the bottle and courage to make differcult and unpopular decisions on behalf of the membership bacause they know what the future is about to bring ? or do they make a popular decison and walk away and leave the members at the mercy of Royal Mail `s strategy being introduced.

Differcult decision is it not ?

What would you do in that situration ?

[Big Daz]

The Truth

Is conference policy of 2008 for a plain english test going to be put into action with the agreement?

[dvbuk55]

Of course it is a difficult situation, not one easily solved, but a national agreement is NOT a national agreement when it relies on local solutions - that route has landed us in this position only two years after the last agreement. Now do we make an agreement over 3 years this time instead of two and be in this same position again after 3 years. Whose idea was a 3 year agreement? I would have thought it would have been wiser to review these changes after 12 months, whatever the outcome they will be far reaching - at least for deliveries. We still haven't heard how these changes are going to effect anyone else other than deliveries.

[Cut Off King]

I think that the biggest problem is that in recent times the CWU have allowed RM to always set the agenda. They should have been pre-empting the RM's long publiced desire to modernise with their own modernisation plan. Instead RM sets the agenda and the CWU try to cushion the blow a little.

Knowing this RM will make plans , exagarate them and then inform the CWU, who the mittigate the plans back down to what RM really wanted in the first place.

I'm not suggesting that the CWU should be running RM rather an equal partner in major desicions.

I feel that the last round of strikes should not have been called off until RM got a bloody nose to remind them that we are here and need to be taken seriously. Instead we gave them a tap on the back of the hand. RM soon recovered from that and are back to their old tricks.

Thats why members feel let down, especialy those of us who were on strike locally before the national strike was called.

[fishtank]

the truth wrote
"However what is the alternative ? Do we walk away and let them impose this change on an office by office basis without the protection and benefits of a national agreement or do our leaders have the bottle and courage to make differcult and unpopular decisions on behalf of the membership bacause they know what the future is about to bring ? or do they make a popular decison and walk away and leave the members at the mercy of Royal Mail `s strategy being introduced."

They are union leaders,not politicians and do not have a mandate to make "unpopular decisions" based on Royal Mails idea of the future.
It is very arrogant to assume that our leaders "know what the future is about to bring",lets face it their past record on predictions is hardly outstanding.
It doesn't take "bottle" or "courage" to simply toe the company line especially when these unpopular decisions have little impact on you personally.
It would seem that your posts are full of Royal Mail's vision for the future but we have never heard the CWUs vision for the future.
Is their ANY vision or is it simply damage limitation like 2007 again.

We didn't walk away in 2007 and yet we still let them impose change office by office.
What makes you think this time will be any different

As far as later starts are concerned i would protect those who cannot change to later starts and reward those who could.
And i would do that at national level.It's not rocket science really.

[edy]

I wouldn't worry. Its out of our hands anyway. Besides, CWU know that backing for yet another wave of strike action isn't there and if it dragged on union would go bankrupt.

only 1064 days left now Night Tonic and it will be all over

and 565 for me !

[falkland77]

TWO IN A VAN FOR ALL U LAZY 40 HOURS A WEEK POSTMAN

[Big Daz]

The Truth

Will this be the last week of talks and will it also be the last week of no information even if the talks carry on?

Surley a point will come when all parties agree they have gone as far as they can and its time to ballot and see what the troops make of it all? Surley that point starts this Friday?

[fishtank]

TWO IN A VAN FOR ALL U LAZY 40 HOURS A WEEK POSTMAN

Oh, sh1t the schools are out i better run.

[POSTMAN]

TWO IN A VAN FOR ALL U LAZY 40 HOURS A WEEK POSTMAN

Part timer?

[GHOSTman]

The Truth

Will this be the last week of talks and will it also be the last week of no information even if the talks carry on?

Surley a point will come when all parties agree they have gone as far as they can and its time to ballot and see what the troops make of it all? Surley that point starts this Friday?

Great post Big Daz I think it's only the hardcore posties on here that are still interested. When I tell some people in my office what I read on here they are amazed that the talks are still going on. I know we need to get the deal right but if it gets extended much longer theres a danger no one will be interested in the out come.

[fishtank]

The Truth

Will this be the last week of talks and will it also be the last week of no information even if the talks carry on?

Surley a point will come when all parties agree they have gone as far as they can and its time to ballot and see what the troops make of it all? Surley that point starts this Friday?

Great post Big Daz I think it's only the hardcore posties on here that are still interested. When I tell some people in my office what I read on here they are amazed that the talks are still going on. I know we need to get the deal right but if it gets extended much longer theres a danger no one will be interested in the out come.

And i think that was the plan for at least one of the sides involved in the negotiations.

[dvbuk55]

Someone asked me today if the revision was finished and I said the revision can't take place until the agreement has been balloted on and we know the delivery span, the D2D problem solved, and how many hours a week we are working - and he said - are they still going on about that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!