National Negotiations – Extended into next week,and the next

[TrueBlueTerrier]

No: 73/10
Ref:
Date: 22nd January 2010




To All Postal Branches








Dear Colleague


National Negotiations – Future of Royal Mail


It has been agreed to extend talks into next week on the basis of progress made and the recognition of the crucial importance this set of negotiations will have on the future of Royal Mail.


Please find below a communication from Roger Poole, the Independent Chair confirming this position. Further information will be sent out in due course.


Yours sincerely




Dave Ward Martin Collins Bob Gibson
Deputy General Secretary (P) Assistant Secretary Assistant Secretary




Ray Ellis Terry Pullinger
Assistant Secretary Assistant Secretary



Message From Roger Poole, Independent Chair




Royal Mail and the CWU continue to make good progress in what are very complex and wide ranging negotiations concerning the whole Letters business.


We will also soon be approaching the stage of negotiations where parties will need to report back and consult with their constituencies.


Further negotiations will take place next week. Both parties are still committed to achieving an agreement which will enable Royal Mail and its employees to secure a better future for everybody in the organisation.

[fishtank]

Ah well at least it hasn't spoiled my weekend off.

[GHOSTman]

these talks are all getting rather predictable now! Cant wait for the next thrilling installment, See you all at the next deadline day!

[dongash]

ODDS ON WE WILL GET SHAFTED!!!! (JUST FOR A CHANGE!!!)

[steven100]

I don't think we will get shafted because these people in the talks know its their future that is also at stake. Bad deal everyone jumps ship and leaves the union or we vote them next cwu elections. Good deal, more people join the union and union begin to feel moral victory.

[pondhopper]

I don't think we will get shafted because these people in the talks know its their future that is also at stake. Bad deal everyone jumps ship and leaves the union or we vote them next cwu elections. Good deal, more people join the union and union begin to feel moral victory.

Let's wait and see what the outcome is first before we jump to any conclusions. Either way I think there will be more to this than meets the eye. Massive changes afoot I bet, and none that will really benefit us at the sharp end of the job. As you say 'these people' know that their jobs are on the line too. If they fail to deliver ('scuse the bad pun!) then they could very well be out at the next elections as there is major dissatisfaction with the people at the top.

[spilie]

surprise surprise getting so fuc*ing boring, treating us like idiots so predictable cant wait for the next definite,should be,well hope so deadline

[Night Tonic]

I wouldn't worry. Its out of our hands anyway. Besides, CWU know that backing for yet another wave of strike action isn't there and if it dragged on union would go bankrupt.

[dvbuk55]

Yes their futures are on the line too - or are they? When you see the election papers it is the same old faces over and over again. Their futures are secure, they aren't working they are released. In order for them to be removed they would have to stand down and let someone else have a go at the election - however the scenario is such that those standing in the wings are of the same ilk. So what we have is a no win no win situation really.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

I wouldn't worry. Its out of our hands anyway. Besides, CWU know that backing for yet another wave of strike action isn't there and if it dragged on union would go bankrupt.

only 1064 days left now Night Tonic and it will be all over

[The truth!]

Sometimes some of you need a reality check , you really believe that the cwu wishes to sell you out with every agreement. What a load of bolloxs.

Lets get things straight

Well some of you are argueing that you stay at 3.5 hours , well thats what the union negotaited in 2003 , yet offices have agreed to go passed that 4 hours without the national union agreeing it. The New National agreement will not force you to move past 3.5 hours if that is your wish but have you got the workload under the roof once walk sequencing has been deployed and the new work plan has been intrduced to maximise full time jobs.

Plus some of you criticise Peagsus/ GEO route , when you agreed for it to be used in your office without a fight. We even have a post praising the geo route version 2 . I can understand where offices have had geo route revisons imposed on them but the reason it took the national union so long to reach an agreement on peagsus was because offices and branch"s didt hold the unions line on not agreeing to the use of geo route..

Last Year the union had a national policy not to agree to any revisons until Royal Mail choose to negotate a deal on the i the future. Yet over 300 offices decided to agree savings regardless of that national policy which left other offices to fight for a national agreement.

The Union has a policy of no use of car derived vans unless there is a national agreement , yet only a handful of offices had a strike to stop them , whereas significantly more offices decided to just agree to them.

So you see its all very well blaming CWU HQs for everything but the union does not begin or end at 150 the broadway it exists in everyone of your offices, the union is as strong or as weak as it members. The union reflects that position, we have strong areas and strong offices and weak areas and weak offices.

Often the easy option for some in the union is to blame others for their lack of resistance in their own office. My belief there are many on this site who fall into that bracket. I know when I blame CWU Headquaters I talk the talk because in my office they have not agreed to any of the stuff i am complaining about.

The reasons the talks have moved into the next week is not because the union is going to sell you out. It is the opposite we aint prepared to accept that Saturday turns into a normal day on Royal Mail"s terms and we are not willing to accept whats is currently on offer for door to door into workload. Lets get things straight progress has been made and both mail centres and network have in principle agreements subject to everything being agreed.

Some of you need to understand that no one is out to sell the membership down the river , get real , its all very well everyone saying we dont want this , we dont want that . But tell us the solutions we all know the problems.

So Your going to get walk seqeuncing there are now 70 in the UK , and this will increase at 3 per week being installed until the last ones are introduced in Waltham cross in November 2011 and your work once you have walk seqencing is not going to come into your delivery office at 0600 for IPS pruposes and prep purposes as it does now. Instead it will come in at least 2 hours later and in some cases up to 4 hours later.

The machines are going to run 6 days a week which means you will be getting that work later on Saturdays.

So any ideas you have on how we stop this from happening and how we can limits it impact on jobs and full time posts please feel free to tell the CWU . PS we already tried the luddite option.

[spilie]

oh you blame us now eh truth, you and your cronies agreed to local agreements and still advocate them, now you are saying that the offices you left to thier own devices to negotiate fu**ed up and its not your fault bulls**t,you fiddled while we burned now you want us to take the blame and give you the solutions,listen the negotiating team are paid to do just that and well paid too, so get the fu**ing finger out and put a deal to us then WE WILL DECIDE, but since you want us to do the councils job, well see the next time i get hammered with light bulbs ..................... aye thats right come and give me a hand eh

[fishtank]

oh you blame us now eh truth, you and your cronies agreed to local agreements and still advocate them, now you are saying that the offices you left to thier own devices to negotiate fu**ed up and its not your fault bulls**t,you fiddled while we burned now you want us to take the blame and give you the solutions,listen the negotiating team are paid to do just that and well paid too, so get the fu**ing finger out and put a deal to us then WE WILL DECIDE, but since you want us to do the councils job, well see the next time i get hammered with light bulbs ..................... aye thats right come and give me a hand eh

It's ok spillie,I've read his post before.
It was a different poster but it was the same old "blame the weak offices" message.

[dvbuk55]

Lets get things straight progress has been made and both mail centres and network have in principle agreements subject to everything being agreed.

Some of you need to understand that no one is out to sell the membership down the river , get real , its all very well everyone saying we dont want this , we dont want that . But tell us the solutions we all know the problems.

We must assume then that the Mail Centres and Network agreement is not as difficult to resolve as deliveries and we have to wonder why that would be - presumably because there will be little change.

The problems are the result of the same negotiators from two years ago - the ones who knew it all then and purport to know it all now, seem to be struggling to find the answers to the problems. We are just postmen, it isn't a suggestion of a sell out but a lack of skills in negotiating.

We seem to be back to the old local negotiation, because these people seem incapable of negotiating a framework that has to be adhered to by both parties.

I wouldn't suggest that they need to get a move on BUT disagreements are starting to pile up again and we all know what the end result of that is.

Perhaps the answer is to not rely on people who are so involved from both a personal and work point of view but to actually employ skilled and dedicated negotiators whose reputation and job stands or falls by results and not some sort of ego trip.

[Puppetmaster]

Lets get things straight progress has been made and both mail centres and network have in principle agreements subject to everything being agreed.

Some of you need to understand that no one is out to sell the membership down the river , get real , its all very well everyone saying we dont want this , we dont want that . But tell us the solutions we all know the problems.

We must assume then that the Mail Centres and Network agreement is not as difficult to resolve as deliveries and we have to wonder why that would be - presumably because there will be little change.

The problems are the result of the same negotiators from two years ago - the ones who knew it all then and purport to know it all now, seem to be struggling to find the answers to the problems. We are just postmen, it isn't a suggestion of a sell out but a lack of skills in negotiating.

We seem to be back to the old local negotiation, because these people seem incapable of negotiating a framework that has to be adhered to by both parties.

I wouldn't suggest that they need to get a move on BUT disagreements are starting to pile up again and we all know what the end result of that is.

Perhaps the answer is to not rely on people who are so involved from both a personal and work point of view but to actually employ skilled and dedicated negotiators whose reputation and job stands or falls by results and not some sort of ego trip.

I think this is a fair and good soloution to our problems.When Offices are left to local Agreements ,a lot of bullying and preassure goes on and conflicts over ambigous wording in national documents"!