Managment Attck Underway As Predicted

[Lincox]

Absolutely right. I do not know how anyone can agree to absorbing any part of any round until they have completed their own round. Who knows how long it will take considering weather, packets. specials, recorded etc. Then when you have got back to the DO, how long will it take to get to the absorbed area you are asked to cover. How many Pkts etc are you going to have. Time to get back to the DO. Until an agreed form of modernisation is brought in and the indoor work is reduced, I dont think anyone can agree to regularly absorb, and then we come back to the other bone of contention which is delivery spans.

[Big Daz]

Daz,At the end of the day and without going into specifics Absorbtion is part of the OUTDOOR workload.
If your P/T delivery is the same as a F/T delivery then you should also be absorbing.
Providing of course their is time within your 3.30 delivery span and within your contracted hours.

There isnt time within my day, PT duties are very tight in terms of workload ratio to hours of work, FT are not tight at all. Perhaps if FT did not get done before PT when the aforementioned FT have finish times that are 2 hours later than PT, the DOM might be inclined to propose PT do some outdoor or indoor absorption.


Pegasus took out one delivery at my D.O and PT delivery duties became bigger and moved from 28 hour week to 30 hour week. The extra delivery workload under the pegasus revision removed any spare time.

Absorption can be indoor as well, in fact the wording of phase 3 for delivery offices says and OR indoor, and as FT are more than capable of covering 2 deliveries within their approved attendance times/normal paid work hours PT could do some IPS if there was tiome to absorb work but that nots needed as IPS finishes early every single day.

To jointly identify/implement genuine opportunities to absorb outdoor and/or indoor workload where time exists within approved attendance times/normal paid work hours.

I forgot to mention absorption is Monday to Friday only at my D.O.

[prowler]

"where time exists"

Surely if you start work on time, go for your full 40 minute meal relief, weigh your bags and work to your time, there won't be any time for lapsing? what is wrong with your people??! Stop it now! Tell you what, start work half an hour early, forget about your meal relief, run around like an idiot then work you half an hour flexibility ...do this for a month. For free. Now if Royal Mail asked you to work for free you'd tell them to go jump right? RIGHT?? Come on people get a grip

Sadly a lot of the muppets that work for RM will never see the light of day, they think they are keeping themselves in a job, when in fact they are the cause of many jobs going. As posted previously, the smart ones work by the book and make sure they have enough work to keep them to their time. Its not exactly rocket science.

[fishtank]

Daz,At the end of the day and without going into specifics Absorbtion is part of the OUTDOOR workload.
If your P/T delivery is the same as a F/T delivery then you should also be absorbing.
Providing of course their is time within your 3.30 delivery span and within your contracted hours.

There isnt time within my day, PT duties are very tight in terms of workload ratio to hours of work, FT are not tight at all. Perhaps if FT did not get done before PT when the aforementioned FT have finish times that are 2 hours later than PT, the DOM might be inclined to propose PT do some outdoor or indoor absorption.


Pegasus took out one delivery at my D.O and PT delivery duties became bigger and moved from 28 hour week to 30 hour week. The extra delivery workload under the pegasus revision removed any spare time.

Absorption can be indoor as well, in fact the wording of phase 3 for delivery offices says and OR indoor, and as FT are more than capable of covering 2 deliveries within their approved attendance times/normal paid work hours PT could do some IPS if there was tiome to absorb work but that nots needed as IPS finishes early every single day.

To jointly identify/implement genuine opportunities to absorb outdoor and/or indoor workload where time exists within approved attendance times/normal paid work hours.

I forgot to mention absorption is Monday to Friday only at my D.O.

Are you telling me the delivery portion of the P/T walks in your office is longer than the F/T walks.
How can this be justified?
Yes Daz,indoor or outdoor work can be absorbed but not one into the other.
Remember at the moment 3.30 is supposed to be the max delivery span.
If you had very little IPS but a full 3.30 delivery,how could this be protected?
Would you ask your members to break a national agreement just because they were off the ips early?

[number one]

Question for people:-

If I manage to get out on delivery at 9am and my round takes me 3.30hrs the time is now 12.30 but.... Im paid till 14.45 so what is to happen here??

A. I go home at 12.30 and make 2.15hrs

B. I have to do Lapsing but this will push me over the 3.30hrs that I am supposed to be on the streets?

Royal Mail just come up with the quote "we want you to work your hours"

[fishtank]

Question for people:-

If I manage to get out on delivery at 9am and my round takes me 3.30hrs the time is now 12.30 but.... Im paid till 14.45 so what is to happen here??

A. I go home at 12.30 and make 2.15hrs

B. I have to do Lapsing but this will push me over the 3.30hrs that I am supposed to be on the streets?

Royal Mail just come up with the quote "we want you to work your hours"

What time are you supposed to leave the office?
That is where you will find your answer my friend.

[Dushku2309]

[quote="number one"]Question for people:-

If I manage to get out on delivery at 9am and my round takes me 3.30hrs the time is now 12.30 but.... Im paid till 14.45 so what is to happen here??

A. I go home at 12.30 and make 2.15hrs

B. I have to do Lapsing but this will push me over the 3.30hrs that I am supposed to be on the streets?

Royal Mail just come up with the quote "we want you to work your hours"[/quote ]

hmmm..me smells a plant here ( only kidding)

9am out on the street! So you have no missort van, no work time learning and a full office all working like machines?

To be done at 12.30,You'd have to start your delivery at the house next to your D.O. But aside from that, You' also have to add in travelling time to your round, doing the round, meal relief and pouching off times.

When I hear of people claiming that they finish at 12.30pm, It's no wonder R.M wring their hands with glee and bring in all this walk lapsing to save money in other areas. Heavens to Murgatroyd !

[Himaggen]

I have to do Lapsing but this will push me over the 3.30hrs that I am supposed to be on the streets

What are you talking about? The 3½ hours is simply an agreed time frame for the span of a single walk, there is no rule which states that you are to be out on the streets for 3½ hours. You have been contracted for another 2¾ hours and are obliged to work it. In this case because you've not spent as much time on indoor work on that particular day does not prevent it from being deployed elsewhere.

[Big Daz]

Max?

SDD said planned on the basis of 3.5 hours no mention of max or maxium in SDD that I can recall, allways worth another look though.

With pegasus anything is possible in delivery spans, one FT round was tested post pegsaus by the DOM with a experienced postie that knew the duty and it came out as 4 hour del. Some pegasus dels seemed just right some raised eyebrows, but the mbrs voted the pegasus revision in by a comfortable majority on a s**t turnout.

If you strip the IPS off the FT urban bike dels which do IPS then most will easily fit in to a 30 hour week with some needing up to 32 hours. At this moment in time IPS letter mail levels have dropped and walksorted have risen. We have more OPG's than need doing IPS, but this can be sorted out by reducing the number of rurals. We have smaller rural dels who do IPS and bigger ones that dont do IPS. 15 rurals in total, a sensible (outdoor, not computer) rural revision could revise the routes to create say 13 or 14 rural deliveries with none of them doing IPS and all being full sized rurals. This then means the urban FT are on the IPS for longer but still within the 1 hour 30 min planned IPS time and this reduces the amount of spare time in the FT duties. The reason we have IPS rurals is a throwback to the 6 day week and the SDD revision. We took out the night shift back then so rurals that were getting done within their 6 day week duty time simply took on IPS rather than extra delivery work upon the move to 5 day week duty hours. As IPS mail levels have fallen we no longer need need those rurals on the IPS. Up untill the SDD revision rurals did not do IPS at my D.O and I belive the time has come after 5 years to revert back to that set up.

With a mbr that curently does a rural retiring next year, there is scope to reduce the number of rurals without any of the currrent rural OPG's having to loose out on a rural delivery.

A genuine reduction in the working week is essential at my D.O to counteract reduced indoor workload levels.


Yes Daz,indoor or outdoor work can be absorbed but not one into the other.?????

Indoor/outdoor absorption at my D.O is simple

INDOOR

IPS is absorbed everytime somebody is taken off IPS to sort mail into the RM 2000 frame of the absorbed delivery duty.

Prep is absorbed everytime a OPG gets the section of the absorbed delivery they are doing as the delivery is thrown off but not bundled up.

OUTDOOR

Delivery of absorbed delivery duty

[number one]

If this was the case then surly there is no problem with Royal Mail bringing in 5hr walks then? Afterall they are saying you will spend less time inside. You will find the 3.30hrs IS the time you "spend on delivery" this is due to the health and safty side of things, toilet breaks etc.

[Big Daz]

I have to do Lapsing but this will push me over the 3.30hrs that I am supposed to be on the streets

What are you talking about? The 3½ hours is simply an agreed time frame for the span of a single walk, there is no rule which states that you are to be out on the streets for 3½ hours. You have been contracted for another 2¾ hours and are obliged to work it. In this case because you've not spent as much time on indoor work on that particular day does not prevent it from being deployed elsewhere.

From the national agreement

b) Town Residential routes will be planned on a 3.5-hour delivery span. All routes will be planned on the basis of equalisation, and a fair and manageable workload. The planning process will have the full involvement of the CWU and employees.

[Himaggen]

If this was the case then surly there is no problem with Royal Mail bringing in 5hr walks then? Afterall they are saying you will spend less time inside. You will find the 3.30hrs IS the time you "spend on delivery" this is due to the health and safty side of things, toilet breaks etc.

Why don't you get it? After your 3½ hours is complete you have returned to the office. (This is therefore a 3½ hour span ending with a short break). You can therefore be asked to repeat the process again, (up to 3½ hours), subject to you having sufficient time left in that day to do so. That is working 7 hours outdoors, it isn't however performing a 7 hour delivery span.

[number one]

If this was the case then surly there is no problem with Royal Mail bringing in 5hr walks then? Afterall they are saying you will spend less time inside. You will find the 3.30hrs IS the time you "spend on delivery" this is due to the health and safty side of things, toilet breaks etc.

Why don't you get it? After your 3½ hours is complete you have returned to the office. (This is therefore a 3½ hour span ending with a short break). You can therefore be asked to repeat the process again, (up to 3½ hours), subject to you having sufficient time left in that day to do so. That is working 7 hours outdoors, it isn't however performing a 7 hour delivery span.

I have no idea where you are getting your info from but it is so wrong its untrue!!

[fishtank]

Max?

SDD said planned on the basis of 3.5 hours no mention of max or maxium in SDD that I can recall, allways worth another look though.

YES DAZ MAX.

MAX because it doesn't say 4hrs or 4hrs15 or 3hrs45 and we are not in the habit of making managers lives easier by saying 3.5 means 4 etc.
It was AGREED with H&S and RM and the CWU that these walks would be 3.5 hours,Why are you looking to extend this?

[Himaggen]

I have no idea where you are getting your info from but it is so wrong its untrue!!

I'm making a point not getting this information from a specific location.
You are employed to perform specific duties for an employer, and paid to do those for a specified length of time over a specified frequency. If you have performed your usual duties but have not exhausted the time allocated to you for that dayt, then why is it wrong that your employer wishes for you to make up that deficit in time worked?

Show me where it says that an employee cannot work outdoors in any day for combined periods and exceed 3½ hours. If you do then I'm happy to be wrong. I only recall seeing information for single delivery spans, hence the point of my post.