London interim agreement joint statement doc

[fishtank]

"With regards to the National negotations there is a formal review tomorrow and I think not all is well and not going to plan."

All i can say dingo you better hope for some improvement soon.
London(and i don't mean the members) has driven a wedge straight through this union.
This agreement will be seen as two fingers up to the rest of the country.
You even talk about the rest of us as though we were weak and you were strong,how arrogant.
It does'nt even matter if this agreement was justified or not.It only matters how it will be perceived.
I posted early on that it was not enough for the union to BE inclusive.
It had to be SEEN to be inclusive.
Obviously that has fallen on deaf ears.
Good luck dingo you will need it.

[DGP1]

no agreements had been reached under 2.3 which was the only division where this had not been reached.

I must have missed the agreement that we have over here we have NO agreements, NO revisions, NO going back on the EA that RM took months ago so I don't know whaere your information is coming from, the members in my office really feel that they have left hanging in the wind whilst certain offices have got the things that they wanted.

[Big Daz]

Overreaction to this London document IMHO, it's simply re iterating the interim agreement.

The interim agreement allows for ACS to assist at local level as well as national, if mbrs outside of London want that then speak up directly to HQ/ACAS if need be.

All London have got in the interim agreement with the wording slightly more detailed.

London do not negotiate for the rest of the country that is down to your local area divisonal reps for non london areas. No need to have a pop at London. What they have is in the interim agreement.


1.5 To assist the parties in reaching a full and final agreement they will seek
the assistance of ACASand the Tuc in nominating an appropriate,
agreed "independent person to work together with them:
• to oversee and monitor progress made during the local and
national negotiations
• to assist, at the request of either party, in resolving any difficulties
that arise

[dvbuk55]

Overreaction to this London document IMHO, it's simply re iterating the interim agreement.

The interim agreement allows for ACS to assist at local level as well as national, if mbrs outside of London want that then speak up directly to HQ/ACAS if need be.

All London have got in the interim agreement with the wording slightly more detailed.

London do not negotiate for the rest of the country that is down to your local area divisonal reps for non london areas. No need to have a pop at London. What they have is in the interim agreement.


1.5 To assist the parties in reaching a full and final agreement they will seek
the assistance of ACASand the Tuc in nominating an appropriate,
agreed "independent person to work together with them:
• to oversee and monitor progress made during the local and
national negotiations
• to assist, at the request of either party, in resolving any difficulties
that arise

So if this was all in the interim agreement, why keep shrieking that we needed to go back on strike to get a deal? And if there is no difference between London and the rest of us - why specifically create a document solely for London and not for the whole of the membership? And why haven't we seen a full and frank statement from the CWU? Has soomebody got the hand up the jacket working the mouth?

[Ernie Shoe]

I thought the CWU was a national Union not a splintered, regional one.
I appear to be in a weak , crap, shite, piss poor area by the sounds of it.
So I may as well just jack in the union then.

I am not over reacting - this union is fragmented - just what Royal Mail want.

The CWU should be one National union, it should be looking at one national agreement or one interim national agreement not fragmenting itself.

It's ok the rest of the country you can join in with us as well!

[fishtank]

Overreaction to this London document IMHO, it's simply re iterating the interim agreement.

The interim agreement allows for ACS to assist at local level as well as national, if mbrs outside of London want that then speak up directly to HQ/ACAS if need be.

All London have got in the interim agreement with the wording slightly more detailed.

London do not negotiate for the rest of the country that is down to your local area divisonal reps for non london areas. No need to have a pop at London. What they have is in the interim agreement.


1.5 To assist the parties in reaching a full and final agreement they will seek
the assistance of ACASand the Tuc in nominating an appropriate,
agreed "independent person to work together with them:
• to oversee and monitor progress made during the local and
national negotiations
• to assist, at the request of either party, in resolving any difficulties
that arise

All very reasonable Daz but like i said it doesn't matter a f*ck.
You could write a post 16 pages long in defense of this agreement.
All that the majority of members will take from it is London got their own deal.

[Cut Off King]

At the end of the day, my office is still under duties imposed by executive action and weeks after the interim agreement - NOTHING has changed

[fishtank]

At the end of the day, my office is still under duties imposed by executive action and weeks after the interim agreement - NOTHING has changed

Well,According to sources you must have a crappy local rep,sh1tty area rep and lousy divisional rep like the rest of us.

[hairyjack]

Overreaction to this London document IMHO, it's simply re iterating the interim agreement.

The interim agreement allows for ACS to assist at local level as well as national, if mbrs outside of London want that then speak up directly to HQ/ACAS if need be.

All London have got in the interim agreement with the wording slightly more detailed.

London do not negotiate for the rest of the country that is down to your local area divisonal reps for non london areas. No need to have a pop at London. What they have is in the interim agreement.


1.5 To assist the parties in reaching a full and final agreement they will seek
the assistance of ACASand the Tuc in nominating an appropriate,
agreed "independent person to work together with them:
• to oversee and monitor progress made during the local and
national negotiations
• to assist, at the request of either party, in resolving any difficulties
that arise

All very reasonable Daz but like i said it doesn't matter a f*ck.
You could write a post 16 pages long in defense of this agreement.
All that the majority of members will take from it is London got their own deal.

Yeah, that’s exactly how it looks and to be honest, that’s exactly how it is. London now have a big satisfying grin on there face while the rest of us are wondering why the hell we bothered to go out on strike

[Martin Walsh]

fishtank at no time did i say other areas were weak so dont try to make cheap shots cause thats drivel.

Fact is that there are 1500 offices in the UK and only 680 revisons were introduced in 2009. Out of that number 240 were agreed with the CWU either at local ,area or divsional level. This was despite the fact that there was a national policy of no agreement to any savings until there was a national agreement on phase 4 of the pay and modensation.

The 440 other offices in all parts of the uk who had revisons imposed by executive action did so becuase they were carrying out the National Unions policy of no agreements to savings until a national agreement was in place. Had those offices not done that there would of been no national strike and no national talks and no interim agreement fact.

Now I repeat again there is no seperate agreement for London. The Interim agreement is still the agreement which applies , the joint statement is an enabler to allow for this.

Now DGP have you had a revison imposed if so have you had a review under 2.3 and have you raised it with you area and divisonal reps who then feed back to CWU HQs. Facts are there 9 divisons within the CWU have are South West & South Wales , South Central , South East , London , Anglia, Midlands , North West & North Wales , North East and Scotland & Northern Ireland. All of those divisons apart from London have some agreements thats a fact.

Now Lets get one thing straight where an office have not had a revision imposed then the agreement still effects them as further savings are due in Jaunuary and the National Issues being discussed will have an impact on every single employee in the UK regardless of what function or what part of the UK they live in.

One thing I have always taken pride in is that London has always supported others when they are in disputes including walking out in support of Liverpool , Milton Keynes , Watford in the past, so I do get frustrated at indivuduals who just whine about things and turn inwards. Let be stragiht we have just gone through some of the most bitterest disputes in Royal Mail history including in London , Peteborugh , Bristol , Plymouth , Parts of Scotland whilst the majority of the CWU have lost just two days pay well it was always going to be harder in those other areas.

One last thing if the national union decide that we have to go out again then I know we in London will do everything in our power to get the members up for it as we have to ensure we get the right agreement for our futures.

[dvbuk55]

Would you clarify the following dingo:


Does this agreement go back as far as 2008, because it does specifically say 2009 in the interim and when was the call for NO savings and cooperation made? I have the distinct memory it was around February or March of this year, which was a bit late for us. Including the advice received and the continuance of trials ad infinitum and revisions from early 2008. Are ACAS and the trouble shooter directors going to pop up here and see to our specific problems do you think?

Also if as you state the following:

"Now I repeat again there is no seperate agreement for London. The Interim agreement is still the agreement which applies , the joint statement is an enabler to allow for this."

the interim agreement hasn't changed, then why is there no longer a need to call for further strikes? It wouldn't be the joint statement by any chance?

[Martin Walsh]

DVbuk the no savings policy was made in December 2008 and annouced to all Branch "s at a national briefing in January 2009 at friends house.

Further infomation was given to Divisonal Reps and an Ltb was issued.

[POSTMAN]

Well,According to sources you must have a crappy local rep,sh1tty area rep and lousy divisional rep like the rest of us.

I'm guessing that's me I'm only pointing out what i see and read on here from reliable sources.

The union i guess can only work with what they have got.

Now whilst some areas within divisons are having a degree of issues the vast majority by these reports are not.

[axeman]

Wrong dingo me lad the ones that were 'agreed' were forced to conceed otherwise more drastic action would have been forced upon them.The truth of the mater is i'll most definenatly be voteing against fat billy / pec when we / i get the chance and yes it does seem as if ''london'' is causing a split within the cwu you just have to come to terms with whats happening. i do hope it doesn't come to this but until this union gets it's act together i see no alternative
A vote of no confidence is an option !!!

[dvbuk55]

DVbuk the no savings policy was made in December 2008 and annouced to all Branch "s at a national briefing in January 2009 at friends house.

Further infomation was given to Divisonal Reps and an Ltb was issued.

So does that mean that any changes agreed or imposed prior to the call for NO SAVINGS and no cooperation must still stand? Because we have had changes long before December 2008, we had PDAs, and park and loop and revisions before December 2008 - you see these things may well have triggered the call for a no saviings policy in some areas but in others we were following the THEN party line of Pay and Modernisation a la 2007. Perhaps you can now see that there is a certain chagrin in people like me who have seen the conditions deteriorate because they were started before this policy was created and once on that road you cannot turn back.