How slow is too slow??

[TrueBlueTerrier]

First of all, why can't you claim overtime? You work a 12 hour shift? You must be mad.

If he even tried to claim overtime he would be gone. End of

Why - please expand. If he works overtime on a duty he has not done before then the OT is put on the training budget, and a decent manager would realise if he is claiming excessive OT then he may be having problems and would either get it sorted or try retraining.

They would not just sack him for claiming OT they would have to follow a set procedure or they would and should fail at an ET/IT.

So if he claimed 4 hours (roughly) eachday everyday royal mail would accept that? even tho its a 8hour duty all in and there paying a guy 12 hours when they could find someone who could do it in the 8 hours? Seriously?

NO read my post again - they would pay him the overtime but because he would be claiming excessive docket that should "Flag it up" to management and they should assess if the workload is too great, whether he needs retraining or even if giving him his own fixed duty for a few weeks or months would improve his confidence and therefore his work rate

Fair enough he's not been in the job that long but they would just test his prepping etc. to prove he cant meet the standards then he would be out of a job.

Then he would be entitled to unfair dismissal if they have not followed the agreed testing procedure and have not given him training or guidance to improve. To do otherwise could and I emphasise could mean a case of constructive dismissal would be possible.

Theres a guy in our office who finishes at 3 or 4 everyday even on Tuesday's but the deal to keep him in a job was that he never claimed OT.

Thats not right or fair, they could just keep adding to his workload on this basis and he would unable to complain and if he did they could get rid of him. This is why there should be an agreed, robust and independent way of measuring what is a fair workload and what is a fair and acceptable standard of competence. If you don't meet that level of competence then there should be a process for retraining etc, but ultimately if someone is incapable of working at the agreed standard then dismissal should always be an option as long as its done fairly across the board and is fully documented .

[OnAFlyer]

When it starts to make my head hurt i stop prepping and "road" the mail.

What i mean by this is firstly place the letters into piles of the same roads then prep it into the frame. Its still a slow way of doing it but its easier because you work one section of the frame at a time and it saves brain overload when you stand there feeling kinda lost. Give that a try and you should get it prepped quicker.

Stick with it mate

Good idea - TBH if the guy is struggling then it's probably going to be quite a bit quicker on most frames for him to put it into roads first.

One ray of light is that there are only so many duties and frames, and eventually you will at least have some knowledge of them when you get put on that duty again.

Don't give up or resign, just carry on trying to improve.

[flojon]

Thanks everyone for the helpful replies. I'm not going to resign, i've bin advised not to. I do the regular 8 hour shift, 6 days doing different walks. Sometimes i do the same walk for a week. I street up the letters 1st but still slow. It took me around 30 mins to do a box of letters. Is that too slow? I dont talk to the others or use the canteen cos i'm too embarassed of my speed. I havent joined the union, they cant help someone that slow from the sack for incompetence? Im thinking the rep may think i'm a dosser who only wants to join so he can hide behind it to continue skiving?

[NWpostie]

Im one of the last ones to leave the Office, thats because I've had 2 streets added to my delivery, one before I went on it and another after, I take my full meal break, I don't usually go out until 1030-1130 depending on what I have got that day, I do have a lot of items to throw in, my alleyway is usually gone by 930-1000 they don't take their meal breaks either even if the few that did, its usually no more than maybe 20 minutes, I would say about 50% in my Office now take their full meal breaks before going out.

[Eildor]

6 hours for prep, and 6 hours for delivery, is without a doubt too slow.

I get the impression you aren't too bothered about your speed; rather you are more concerned as to whether you can lose your job as a result of it.

Can you lose your job for being too slow? Well, since you are willing to go out of your way and work for nothing the managers probably wont care. But yes, you COULD end up losing your job for being too slow if it became an issue and you couldn't improve your speed.

Is your manager aware of what time you're finishing? Has he ever discussed your speed with you? Have your colleagues ever commented on your speed?

It sounds like you may need to be coached to get you up to speed... but if it's just a case of you're just working too slow then coaching probably isn't going to do much for you. When you're prepping a walk you need to make sure you concentrate so you can familiarize yourself with the frame. I personally don't road letters, but I do know that some people find that it helps... if you find that roading letters first helps you learn the frame then ask your manager to get someone to road it for you for a while, WHILE you throw it off and get used to the frame. This is what was done for me while I was being trained.

If you're having trouble with prep and delivery you're probably also taking a long time to sort out your packets, do your redirections, band up etc, this is why it could be helpful if you have a coach watch you and advise you on how to improve.

If you want to get up to speed I don't see why you can't. But if you don't mind working until 6pm then you probably wont speed up... that's why I'm telling you straight that YES YOU ARE SLOW, AND BEING SLOW COULD JEOPARDIZE YOUR JOB.

I think rather than asking whether being slow can result in losing your job, you should ask for help on getting up to speed. What do you think?

[krussel]

Thanks everyone for the helpful replies. I'm not going to resign, i've bin advised not to. I do the regular 8 hour shift, 6 days doing different walks. Sometimes i do the same walk for a week. I street up the letters 1st but still slow. It took me around 30 mins to do a box of letters. Is that too slow? I dont talk to the others or use the canteen cos i'm too embarassed of my speed. I havent joined the union, they cant help someone that slow from the sack for incompetence? Im thinking the rep may think i'm a dosser who only wants to join so he can hide behind it to continue skiving?

I am glad your going stick with it good on you

Thirty mins for a perstop (box) on a strange frame really is not too bad as its never easy. As already suggested someone could help you by putting the mail in streets for you. Dont be embarassed to accept help i often get back trouble and have to get help loading up in the mornings.
I think joining the union is a really good idea at any time regardless of your prep speed As for being sacked for incompetence it wont be as easy as you think because RM will have to offer you extra training to help you improve your speed before they think about sacking you.

I think your best bet is to hit the problem head on, join the Union asap and with the help of a rep you could approach a manager and request some extra training with perhaps the option to cover more walks for a week in rotation which would help you get used to the same frames?
As for being a skiver, are you mad, i would not call anyone willing to put in 12 hour shifts just to keep a job lazy But you really must be knackering yourself out and with xmas coming up its going to get harder.

Once again stick with it dont be so hard on yourself, remember your doing different frames each day and it is so much easier when you have a regular walk so try not to compare your speed with the old timers

[swpostie]

Hi Flojon,

Don't despair - learning a new frame is the hardest part of the job.

I reckon you would need to be on the same frame for 3 or 4 weeks to get the prep up to speed.

The actual walk you will probably know inside out after a couple of days.

So book overtime - you're fully entitled to! Don't volunteer for anything - the more you know the more you'll be messed around! Don't use your car - that will restrict you to walks with bag drops (though you probably don't use cars in London).

Basically, things will be easier for you if you do everything you can to limit the number of different walks you're asked to do.

So, join the union, book overtime and, of they don't pay it - cut off! If you're on a different walk everyday they can't make your life any more difficult.

Hang in there.

[Finlay09]

Hey,

You started around the same time I did. When I started I was put on a walk with my trainer for a week, then after that I was on a walk for a solid six weeks. I've not really had a problem with speed, I'm fast at prepping and bagging up but I see casuals that work around me just going out on delivery when I have finished.

The thing is, if you are a casual does that not mean that you work for an agency that royal mail hire you from? (That's what all the casuals are in my office). Then there is a problem if you start claiming the overtime because the office will just tell the agency not to send you. Which they have done to a couple of casuals that are called in at our office.

I'm on a different walk each week now and I find that if I spend the first few minutes studying the frame to remember where each road is and any odd adress slots, that way prepping becomes easier for me. That may help, just thought I'd suggest it.

[concerneduk]

I tend to be one of the last to finish each day and it always turns heads and starts the muttering when I say i'm cutting off. Unfortunately the dim wits forget that they put me on my current start/finish time in the first place therefore I only see most of my colleagues on busy days or if in early to prep on OT as i'm one of the last to start normally after most are already delivering.

[shadow]

I tend to be one of the last to finish each day and it always turns heads and starts the muttering when I say i'm cutting off. Unfortunately the dim wits forget that they put me on my current start/finish time in the first place therefore I only see most of my colleagues on busy days or if in early to prep on OT as i'm one of the last to start normally after most are already delivering.

They are probably saying good on you for having the guts to cutt off. You are right about your hours, they are the ones that gave you them.

[flojon]

what a difference 2 wks make! The walk is 1 of the biggest, with a large estate that requires a timelock key. Not surprisingly nobody likes doing. Have been doing it every day for the past month. After 2 wks, i can prep up and b ready to leave by 9.30 most mornings. In fact i am no longer the last to leave! I worked out my own way 2 do the walk, becos by following the frame takes longer. The more u do it the better u get i suppose, all without extra training or warnings from managers about being too slow. Its the longest i've been on the same walk and in same office. The managers said 'looks like u cracked it'.

[OnAFlyer]

what a difference 2 wks make! The walk is 1 of the biggest, with a large estate that requires a timelock key. Not surprisingly nobody likes doing. Have been doing it every day for the past month. After 2 wks, i can prep up and b ready to leave by 9.30 most mornings. In fact i am no longer the last to leave! I worked out my own way 2 do the walk, becos by following the frame takes longer. The more u do it the better u get i suppose, all without extra training or warnings from managers about being too slow. Its the longest i've been on the same walk and in same office. The managers said 'looks like u cracked it'.

Woohoo!

[krussel]

what a difference 2 wks make! The walk is 1 of the biggest, with a large estate that requires a timelock key. Not surprisingly nobody likes doing. Have been doing it every day for the past month. After 2 wks, i can prep up and b ready to leave by 9.30 most mornings. In fact i am no longer the last to leave! I worked out my own way 2 do the walk, becos by following the frame takes longer. The more u do it the better u get i suppose, all without extra training or warnings from managers about being too slow. Its the longest i've been on the same walk and in same office. The managers said 'looks like u cracked it'.

Well done mate, see it was not you !, it makes all the difference being on the same walk and finding your feet.

[dejavu]

Well done mate, a lot of it can all be in the mind, when you see others leave the office before you when youve still got loads to do can get you feelin down, then you suddenly without knowin start goin a bit slower. If it was anything like my office when I first started some used to race round there rounds to get back on purpose before I got out delivering. That can really make you feel s**t at the job, but just persist at it and suddenly it just clicks. Ive seen people jack it in after just 1 day or a week coz they look at others and think theyll never be that quick. It just takes time and keep your head up.

[POSTMAN]

What a great thread and well done,and well done to those who helped you as well in the thread.