Cutting off due to personal circumstances

[k979aaa]

I am a DOM and if as has happened a member of staff got a phone call to say some member of there family was rushed to hospital, I would immediately arrange for the mail to be recovered and find someone else to deliver it. I would also ensure the Postman/Lady had the means to get home or to the hospital.

I am struggling to believe any other DOM would do different. I totally believe family come first, well above the necessity to deliver mail. Genuine cases should always be treat with the utmost respect. The main problem I can see is the piss takers who lose a Granny every year, we have them in my office and it seems they have a dozen or so Grandmothers and Grandads. These are only a few and lots people lose close reletives while still at work and its not a pleasant time for them and when this happens their place is at home with the family.

Blimey, a DOM's broke cover.......

I agree with everything you say redman, esp. on your point about the piss takers. I also find it unbelieveable that a DOM wouldn't relieve the postman in question. I don think there is an example of this??

Depends whether they think he is peter wolf or not and if he is then the sh*t hits the fan sorry for saying this but some DOM's have their own views some are good and some are bad just like some posties but too get in their position you have too not be soft!.

[harmony]

I am a DOM and if as has happened a member of staff got a phone call to say some member of there family was rushed to hospital, I would immediately arrange for the mail to be recovered and find someone else to deliver it. I would also ensure the Postman/Lady had the means to get home or to the hospital.

I am struggling to believe any other DOM would do different. I totally believe family come first, well above the necessity to deliver mail. Genuine cases should always be treat with the utmost respect. The main problem I can see is the piss takers who lose a Granny every year, we have them in my office and it seems they have a dozen or so Grandmothers and Grandads. These are only a few and lots people lose close reletives while still at work and its not a pleasant time for them and when this happens their place is at home with the family.

Dont believe it for a second Redman
a postie in our area lost his father suddenly due to a heart attack, as if the stress of this was not enough for the family his mother then suffered a heart problem,she was in hospital for the next two weeks miles from home so the postie was at her bedside. After putting the fathers funeral off for two weeks, the postie retuned to work after three weeks(in total).
And guess what the DOM called him to his office and gave him a stage 1!!! FFS.

and had the cheek to tell him that he was trying to be fair to the whole office regarding sickness!!
So what does it actually say in the INTRANET then Redman?????

[andy2007]

I've not joined in with this up 'till now, because I work indoors, so I have no idea how they would handle this situation on Deliveries. But if it's any help: I'm in the same situation myself. And my Manager has told me, that if the call comes, while I'm at work, to just pass the message on, via the nearest person, and go. He'll make all the neccessary arrangements for me, so I don't have to worry about it at the time. Obviously, it's not quite as simple, if you're out deivering. But there ARE caring Managers out there, who will bend over backwards to help, in a situation like this.

[redman]

So what does it actually say in the INTRANET then Redman?????

I don't know or care what it says on the Intranet, as I have been a Manager for twenty years and a Postman for fice years prior to that, I make my own decisions and justify them to no one. I will say again I would not hesitate to ensure a member of staff who had an urgent domestic crisis got home immediately, even if the delivery failed. As for Stage warnings I cannot recall issuing one to a member of staff who has been off sick for losing a close family member, i.e. Partner, Parent or child. If a Manager has then he has lost any sense of decency, I don't know of any Manager in my area that would take such action.

It does become more difficult is subsequent absences occur and the absentee continually blames the loss for such absences, fortunately handled correctly and dealt with empathy has always meant this has never happened.

I am by no way a soft touch and will enforce attendance standards when IMO they are justified and also conduct when required, I am not a gullible person or a Saint, I think I am fair and reasonable and try to treat everyone the same.

Most ( DIMS as many on here call them ) DOMs are human beings and do bleed red.

[harmony]

So what does it actually say in the INTRANET then Redman?????

I don't know or care what it says on the Intranet, as I have been a Manager for twenty years and a Postman for fice years prior to that, I make my own decisions and justify them to no one. I will say again I would not hesitate to ensure a member of staff who had an urgent domestic crisis got home immediately, even if the delivery failed. As for Stage warnings I cannot recall issuing one to a member of staff who has been off sick for losing a close family member, i.e. Partner, Parent or child. If a Manager has then he has lost any sense of decency, I don't know of any Manager in my area that would take such action.

It does become more difficult is subsequent absences occur and the absentee continually blames the loss for such absences, fortunately handled correctly and dealt with empathy has always meant this has never happened.

I am by no way a soft touch and will enforce attendance standards when IMO they are justified and also conduct when required, I am not a gullible person or a Saint, I think I am fair and reasonable and try to treat everyone the same.

Most ( DIMS as many on here call them ) DOMs are human beings and do bleed red.

maybe this DOM did not care what it says on the INTRANET either, but even doms must adhere to it during such a sensitive matter!, as far as we know EVERY case is taken at its own merrit and you (dom) MUST seek advice using two phone numbers that they (whoever they are)insist you use for advice before dishing out stages!
As far as we know the DOM got his arse wiped by higher management but he did not have the decency to appologise to the postie!! no surprises there then.....

[TrueBlueTerrier]

So what does it actually say in the INTRANET then Redman?????

I don't know or care what it says on the Intranet, as I have been a Manager for twenty years and a Postman for fice years prior to that, I make my own decisions and justify them to no one. I will say again I would not hesitate to ensure a member of staff who had an urgent domestic crisis got home immediately, even if the delivery failed. As for Stage warnings I cannot recall issuing one to a member of staff who has been off sick for losing a close family member, i.e. Partner, Parent or child. If a Manager has then he has lost any sense of decency, I don't know of any Manager in my area that would take such action.

It does become more difficult is subsequent absences occur and the absentee continually blames the loss for such absences, fortunately handled correctly and dealt with empathy has always meant this has never happened.

I am by no way a soft touch and will enforce attendance standards when IMO they are justified and also conduct when required, I am not a gullible person or a Saint, I think I am fair and reasonable and try to treat everyone the same.

Most ( DIMS as many on here call them ) DOMs are human beings and do bleed red.

maybe this DOM did not care what it says on the INTRANET either, but even doms must adhere to it during such a sensitive matter!, as far as we know EVERY case is taken at its own merrit and you (dom) MUST seek advice using two phone numbers that they (whoever they are)insist you use for advice before dishing out stages!

Can I just jump in here and say that I don't think every situation is covered on the Intranet or in official documents it couldn't be. Sometimes Managers have to make their own decisions based on the information in front of them and situation at hand. One of the biggest problems in Royal Mail at the moment ( to me as a Postman with some supervisory experience outside RM) is that the current approach is too autocratic and top heavy, with the higher ups making the decisions that effect local management, without taking their views on board, and managing by dictate.

Once RM starting allowing local managers to manage according to their own initiatives the better the Industrial Relations between the workforce and management will be. For instance Summer lapsing works in some places but will never work in others so why have do they try to fit one way of working on all units. Give the local management a budget of money and of hours and let them, with CWU involvement, come to sensible decisions that work.

[brothermagrew]

So what does it actually say in the INTRANET then Redman?????

I don't know or care what it says on the Intranet, as I have been a Manager for twenty years and a Postman for fice years prior to that, I make my own decisions and justify them to no one. I will say again I would not hesitate to ensure a member of staff who had an urgent domestic crisis got home immediately, even if the delivery failed. As for Stage warnings I cannot recall issuing one to a member of staff who has been off sick for losing a close family member, i.e. Partner, Parent or child. If a Manager has then he has lost any sense of decency, I don't know of any Manager in my area that would take such action.

It does become more difficult is subsequent absences occur and the absentee continually blames the loss for such absences, fortunately handled correctly and dealt with empathy has always meant this has never happened.

I am by no way a soft touch and will enforce attendance standards when IMO they are justified and also conduct when required, I am not a gullible person or a Saint, I think I am fair and reasonable and try to treat everyone the same.

Most ( DIMS as many on here call them ) DOMs are human beings and do bleed red.

On the surface of what I have just read in your posting, a straight middle of the road, caring and compassionate DOM. Don't suppose there's any chance of you upping sticks and heading North. Delighted that you are firm and fair and albeit no pushover. However, as many of the CWU brethren will testify, most DOMs wouldn't know how to treat their employee workforce with DIGNITY and RESPECT even if it was written down in front of them, and who constantly use persistent, offensive, abusive, intimidating or insulting behaviour, who on a daily basis abuse their power or instigate penal sanctions which makes the recipient feel upset, threatened, humiliated or vulnerable,which also totally undermines their self-confidence and which may cause them to suffer stress. Good managers which you appear to be, do just that manage. Bad managers bully and harass. No doubt you will have received an overwhelming endorsement from your employee workforce in the Have Your Say Results. Not of course suprising to read that the vast majority of the above goes on behind closed doors and well out of earshot of witnesses.

I do however hope that you will continue to make regular postings and perhaps we can mutually all learn from one anothers opinions. I also find it strange that you say that you justify your own decisions to no one. Really depends if it is a right decision or a wrong decision. And like their own workforce even management are accountable through their acts or omissions.

Wishing you all the best with dignity and respect.

[fmrPOSTIE]

Out of interest what is the pay for a DOM?

[tiredwalker]

Out of interest what is the pay for a DOM?

[DGP1]

Out of interest what is the pay for a DOM?

It all depends on their grade and the size of the DO (I know that mine got £43k a couple of years ago because I overheard his boss talking about it with another manager).

[dvbuk55]

Out of interest what is the pay for a DOM?

It all depends on their grade and the size of the DO (I know that mine got £43k a couple of years ago because I overheard his boss talking about it with another manager).

And worth every penny . It would be interesting to see how such a salary is justifiable without any special skills particularly as the recruitment for managers is shall we say "flawed" in the extreme. Perhaps what the salary represents is bribery money for toeing an ever changing line or jumping on the shovel - it would be difficult in the extreme to find anywhere other than RM which would pay that sort of salary and if there is money to be saved then it would surely be worth RM looking at the salary scale - get rid of the existing managers and recruit from outsiders with a more realistic package.

Redman may well be a Manager but to infer that he has the last say is nonsense - we all know how the system works and no Manager is a law unto himself, everyone has to justify the decisions taken to someone.

[redman]

I don't have to justify Special leave or emergency annual leave or if I issue Stage warnings, my reasons are in the interview notes.

I am not on anywhere near £43k I wish I was.

Postman/Women do work hard and I have every respect for the job they do but we are the buffer zone between senior managers and Policy and our job isn't easy either. I don't know any managers in my area who would not take EVR if offered, just as many frontline staff would as well. Its a hard time for all at the moment, it could get harder if we have Industrial Action but I don't want to get into that debate until it happens.

I think a few years back the job was a lot easier for all parties but the pressure is on to acheive budget and quality and Health and safety has also ebcome a major priority, even so Deliveries have become heavier due to the growth in packets/ magazines and the reduction of letters.

I really think Royal Mail are trying to address weight on delivery, unfortunately I also beleive it will involve longer time on the street to protect full time jobs, this is where I struggle to see how many people will cope, especially the 50+ who are starting to struggle with the workload.

[dvbuk55]

I don't have to justify Special leave or emergency annual leave or if I issue Stage warnings, my reasons are in the interview notes.

I am not on anywhere near £43k I wish I was.

Postman/Women do work hard and I have every respect for the job they do but we are the buffer zone between senior managers and Policy and our job isn't easy either. I don't know any managers in my area who would not take EVR if offered, just as many frontline staff would as well. Its a hard time for all at the moment, it could get harder if we have Industrial Action but I don't want to get into that debate until it happens.

I think a few years back the job was a lot easier for all parties but the pressure is on to acheive budget and quality and Health and safety has also ebcome a major priority, even so Deliveries have become heavier due to the growth in packets/ magazines and the reduction of letters.

I really think Royal Mail are trying to address weight on delivery, unfortunately I also beleive it will involve longer time on the street to protect full time jobs, this is where I struggle to see how many people will cope, especially the 50+ who are starting to struggle with the workload.

I have to say redman that you appear to belong to the old school of managers and I'll just bet you don't fit in with the current crop of yes men and I don't doubt you would take EVR but despite supposedly looking to cut costs RM seem to be reluctant to let people go - I worked for the ESI once and they had a program of EVR and was there ever a mad rush - which was taken advantage of by both parties - 6 months later they were writing to people asking them to go back and they could keep the money - RM seem to be of the opposite persuasion but still manage to keep the carrot dangling.

[POSTMAN]

Thankyou redman for your comments,it's much appreciated.