No English, no stamp: Update: He's been sacked

[Tman]

So what exactly is your problem, with adding more Cultures to the fabric of British Culture?

Maybe his "problem" is that those other cultures, far from "adding" are actually running entirely seperately from so-called main-stream British culture?

Purely as a rhetorical debating point, what could other cultures teach us, or add to "our" culture?

[andy2007]

So what exactly is your problem, with adding more Cultures to the fabric of British Culture?

Maybe his "problem" is that those other cultures, far from "adding" are actually running entirely seperately from so-called main-stream British culture?

Purely as a rhetorical debating point, what could other cultures teach us, or add to "our" culture?

British ex-pats, try to run entirely seperately from other Cultures. And what a contradiction! They're ex Patriots, yet they try to force British Culture on other Countries!

As for what other Cultures can teach us, despite running seperately (I know it was a rhetorical question. But I need to make the point clearly): There was a time, when Indians were shunned, and were forced to keep themselves to themselves. Yet Indian Cooking became part of British Culture, even before they were fully accepted as a people. In fact, there are still a lot of people who STILL look down on them.

In America: Even during the disgusting Slave Trade. Parts of Black Culture were being hijacked by the ruling class. Their music, for example.

That's just 2 examples. Do I really need to start collecting a long list of them?

[NWpostie]

As for those who don't embrace British Culture and Language, being kicked out. If we did that. We'd have to accept all the British ex-pats, back into Britain. And there's a large number of them. I don't know the statistics. But I doubt there are any less of them, than there are Immigrants, who fail to embrace Britain.

Britain has always been an amalgamation of different Cultures, and Countries. Right from the day it became a reality. So what exactly is your problem, with adding more Cultures to the fabric of British Culture?

Integration thats the issue, I have no problems with incomers as long they accept British lifestyles, Language, Culture, its a two way street, we don't mind them doing their own thing as long as they are not contrary to British tradition of tolerance, rule of Law that my point, we cannot have a ghetto culture cutting themselves off from the rest of the UK, thats how Radicalisation happened, as you said it yourself amalagmation of different cultures, thats what I want, not separation of cultures.

Nothing in my previous statement is racist, its all pragmatic and realistic about how I feel about the UK and the way it is going.

[andy2007]

Sorry, I didn't mean to suggest that you were Racist. I was just making the point, that British ex-pats, often do exactly the same thing. And if we got rid of those, who want to have their own little section of Britain. Then it's only fair, that we get all our own ex-pats back.

I believe that we should be doing something to encourage those who aren't currently embracing British Culture, to join in. They need to understand that integration is a two way thing. They don't have to abandon their current Culture. But they need to merge it with our British Culture. It's not the same thing.

[NWpostie]

So what exactly is your problem, with adding more Cultures to the fabric of British Culture?

Maybe his "problem" is that those other cultures, far from "adding" are actually running entirely seperately from so-called main-stream British culture?

Purely as a rhetorical debating point, what could other cultures teach us, or add to "our" culture?

British ex-pats, try to run entirely seperately from other Cultures. And what a contradiction! They're ex Patriots, yet they try to force British Culture on other Countries!

As for what other Cultures can teach us, despite running seperately (I know it was a rhetorical question. But I need to make the point clearly): There was a time, when Indians were shunned, and were forced to keep themselves to themselves. Yet Indian Cooking became part of British Culture, even before they were fully accepted as a people. In fact, there are still a lot of people who STILL look down on them.

In America: Even during the disgusting Slave Trade. Parts of Black Culture were being hijacked by the ruling class. Their music, for example.

That's just 2 examples. Do I really need to start collecting a long list of them?

please do so I can counter or agree to those points.

The ExPats in Spain would find life a lot easier if they spoke Spanish and feel more welcomed so they can particpate in Spanish festival, parties, events etc and vice versa inviting Spanish to take part in British festvales, I remember seeing a St Patrick day event in Benalmadena a few years ago, no St Georges event yet there shoudl be one, I would like to see that myself.

People being people you can't avoid Racism whatever the Law is and its not exclusively a White thing, Asians, Muslims, Blacks and Chinese do practice it on us or other ethnic groups.

as to the Slave trade we abolished it in 1807 and enforced it throughout the Empire by 1832, over 30 years before the Americans got round to it, their treatment of Blacks was worse than ours, they had no Civil rights until the 60s even then its not perfect, there is a long way to go, by comparison we treat our Blacks better, Land of the Free was a pile of bollocks there and still is.

The slave trade did have one indirect benefit, the Blacks are born here and is now British because their ancestors were brought here, while their Slavers are still living in Mud huts in Africa and pay stupid money in Bribes to try to smuggle into Europe, ironic, BTW Slavery is still going on in AFRICA.

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just saw your comment after my last one, ok no problem, it is an easy trap for some to shout Racism to stiffle debate, so I was pre empting it.

[heapsy]

English as a Language has multiple origins, it was the language of the Angles who invaded England, which incorporated worlds from Norman French, German, Spanish, Indian, Irish, Welsh, Italian, latin, African Languages, basically it is the language of the World, because of that it is wide spread through the influences of the British Empire and then the American Commercial Empire, ensuring that it now becomes the World Language, Shipping, Airlines, Business, Tourism, Banking now use it as a Lingua Francia between Countries.

Not bad for a language that had humble beginings as a minor language originating in the Russian Steppes before Migrating westward picking up words as it goes along.

Welsh had latin influences, which is why it differs from Scots and Irish Gaelic which are very similar to each other, Wales came from the Anglo Saxon word "wealeas" which means Foreigners.

Sometimes I have too much time on my hand lol.

I reckon in the near future (20 years) English may become the working language of the EU, its halfway there already.

You forgot the engineers. They need English, no matter where they are.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

What is British Cohesion that's a phrase I have not heard before. Is it a patriotic version of social cohesion but your only part of it if you consider yourself a British Patriot. In that case I would be excluded as though I consider myself a patriot and even a closet monarchist I don't accept that to be part of a society you have to accept all its values, yes you have to be tolerant of them, but I don't think in this day and age applying a label to a person or section of society really has any meaning any more. This is probably why I will never understand or agree with the BNP.

Something to think about though.

[Tman]

That's just 2 examples. Do I really need to start collecting a long list of them?

Yes, why not?

Indian food is a poor example anyway. Curry and spices were major trading commodities back in Victorian times, and I think music of any sort would have reached here by now. Wireless (radio) has been going for quite some time now....

Do you have any more?

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Purely as a rhetorical debating point, what could other cultures teach us, or add to "our" culture?

Tolerance of others views, which hopefully would work both ways.



In the past - the Middle East invented the number "0" which might not sound a lot but was a fundamental in further scientific progress.

The Alphabets origins come from the near east roughly in the area that is now Egypt. It then progressed through the Phonecians, Greeks and Romans then with the Christian church using Latin as a written and spoken language this helped to spread the current form of the alphabet throughout Western Europe.

The sol centric view of the solar system and astronomy in general that was championed by Copernicus was as the result of previous observations and theories published by 2 Muslim astronomers. This was the subject of a BBC documentary some weeks ago.

[johnsouthwales]

eh? lol. didnt see that bit. the celts came from the banks of the danube. they came over here.. the original celts were driven over to ireland by another band of celts. then the celts who went to ireland who developed their from of gaelic came back over to shove out the invaders...and lived happy ever after.
i wouldnt say welsh had latin influences.more like germanic. unless it was influenced after the romans came and hence ireland untouched because the romans didnt go there and the gaelic untouched?? then came the vikings.normans (much of the english language is french influenced).

[IWW Fellow Worker]

eh? lol. didnt see that bit. the celts came from the banks of the danube. they came over here.. the original celts were driven over to ireland by another band of celts. then the celts who went to ireland who developed their from of gaelic came back over to shove out the invaders...and lived happy ever after.
i wouldnt say welsh had latin influences.more like germanic. unless it was influenced after the romans came and hence ireland untouched because the romans didnt go there and the gaelic untouched?? then came the vikings.normans (much of the english language is french influenced).

You would enjoy the book 'The Tribes of Britain' by David Miles. He mentions the various people who arrived in Britain over the centuries and goes into the different types of Gaelic.
I notice you are Welsh. A few years ago I came across a biography of Christmas Evans in a second hand bookshop. The author pointed out than there were Egyptian influences in names given to rivers and places in South Wales and Cornwall.

[Tman]

Tolerance of others views, which hopefully would work both ways.

But doesn't always seem to.......

In the past - the Middle East invented the number "0" which might not sound a lot but was a fundamental in further scientific progress.
The Alphabets origins come from the near east roughly in the area that is now Egypt. It then progressed through the Phonecians, Greeks and Romans then with the Christian church using Latin as a written and spoken language this helped to spread the current form of the alphabet throughout Western Europe.
The sol centric view of the solar system and astronomy in general that was championed by Copernicus was as the result of previous observations and theories published by 2 Muslim astronomers. This was the subject of a BBC documentary some weeks ago

There's no doubt that "we" weren't one of the ancient learned civilisations, but that's nothing to do with this debate, which was, hypothetically speaking, how has "our" culture been enriched etc etc by immigration?
{ We knew about all that stuff by the time of the Empire Windrush, TBT, and one Hell of a lot more besides.. }

[johnsouthwales]

yeh, he's the minister. where he lived is about 30ish miles from where i am in llanddysul.. bee through there, and was chatting to to the post office/spar shop b4 the closures.. then he moved to llyn peninsular. im not sure about the connection between welsh rivers.. it be worth a look.

The Brythonic languages (or Brittonic languages or British languages) form one of the two branches of the Insular Celtic language family, the other being Goidelic.[1] The name Brythonic was derived by Welsh celticist Sir John Rhys from the Welsh word Brython, meaning an indigenous Briton as opposed to an Anglo-Saxon or Gael. The name Brittonic derives ultimately from the name Prettanic recorded by Greek authors for the British Isles. Some authors reserve the term Brittonic for the modified later Brythonic languages after about AD 600.

These languages have been spoken in the British Isles since at least the Iron Age until today, originally as the majority languages but now as minority ones in Wales and Cornwall. In the Isle of Man and Scotland the Brythonic languages have been replaced by Goedelic ones. By emigration there are also communities of Brythonic language speakers in Brittany and Patagonia.

[Edward Hunter]

Britain has always been an amalgamation of different Cultures, and Countries. Right from the day it became a reality. So what exactly is your problem, with adding more Cultures to the fabric of British Culture?

My problem is that theres no more room! I read somewhere that by 2050 there will be 70 million people living here, more than massive countries like Germany and France. The cost to the country is astronomic too. Shut the gates and deport the illegals now

[andy2007]

That's just 2 examples. Do I really need to start collecting a long list of them?

Yes, why not?

Indian food is a poor example anyway. Curry and spices were major trading commodities back in Victorian times, and I think music of any sort would have reached here by now. Wireless (radio) has been going for quite some time now....

Do you have any more?

Ok, first of all: Curry and other spicy foods were (as you rightly said) trading comodities for quite some time, before they became common foods in Britain. But why did we buy them in the first place?
We bought them, because those that could afford to, went to those Countries, and liked the food. But it was just those who could afford them, that had access to it. It was much later, when Immigrants decided to open Resteraunts and Takeaways. When they became a normal part of our diet. Because it became accessible to the masses.


Then of course, there's Religion: The Church of England, is a branch of Christianity. That (as I'm sure you're aware) originated in Jerusalem. Then of course, there's Judiesm. Again, began in the same general area.

And while we're at it. There's Philosophy: A large amount of the Philosophies that we rate so highly, originated in foreign Countries.

I know that these are older examples. But is that relevant?