VOTES OF NO CONFIDENCE IN A REP

[stokes11eg]

Yes, If Reps aren't prpared to put in time out of hours, they shouldn;t br in the job. It
was taken as read years ago, that this was the case, and most reps were happy to go that extra mile.

There seems to be a cult amongst some reps that they are there to decide what is best for the membership rather than carry out the wishes of the membership. Some are so far removed from what is and isn't in the best interests of everyone they are on another planet. Perhaps it is because many of the issues do not directly affect them and so they aren't bothered.

What level of rep are we talking about here dvbuk55? Local rep with virtually no release time who does a 40 hour postal workers job or higher up where release time gets more frequent and reaches full release?

I think my post which is over six months old was in reference to a poster who had difficulty in being heard at shop floor level by the rep. My point was that reps did not consult with the membership before making agreements that do not directly affect them but do affect the membership. When CWU HQ make sweeping agreements which are to be "agreed and implemented at local level", then they should ensure that local reps have the ability and the tools to negotiate change and that agreements made with RM are fully understood. I would also say that in order to be a rep then there should be a willingness to spend time outside any release time in order to get the job done. In fairness those agreements can easily be misconstrued and only recently, on re-reading one of the national agreements, I saw that an error had been made in what we had agreed to locally.

[your_postie]

Like I said im not going around the delivery with them to see what they are doing, the time they start dosent matter I look at the time they started duty and the time they finished and compare against scheduled working hours I look at how long they are taking from first stop to last stop.

My call rate on monday was below that at which pegasus is set at in my area (88%) But my attendance call rate was well above.

Are they working any different, proably not but one cant be certain.

Unsure when you say 'the time they start dosent matter'... i think you'll find it does!

and: 'the time they started duty and the time they finished and compare against scheduled working hours', means nothing if they are cutting corners, neglecting security standards and health and safety standards during these times, don't you think?

like i said anydody can make a job work, but how many in the future will find themselves HAVING to make them work, just 'cos a s**t Pegasus revision has been allowed to take place in their office.

[andy2007]

Like I said im not going around the delivery with them to see what they are doing, the time they start dosent matter I look at the time they started duty and the time they finished and compare against scheduled working hours I look at how long they are taking from first stop to last stop.

My call rate on monday was below that at which pegasus is set at in my area (88%) But my attendance call rate was well above.

Are they working any different, proably not but one cant be certain.

Unsure when you say 'the time they start dosent matter'... i think you'll find it does!

and: 'the time they started duty and the time they finished and compare against scheduled working hours', means nothing if they are cutting corners, neglecting security standards and health and safety standards during these times, don't you think?

like i said anydody can make a job work, but how many in the future will find themselves HAVING to make them work, just 'cos a s**t Pegasus revision has been allowed to take place in their office.

Well said! There are too many people willing to cut corners on safety. For example, carrying too much weight, using cars on delivery, etc.. This MUST be checked, when comparing work rates. And those who ARE cutting corners, should be retrained.

Remember: Safety first!

[Big Daz]

Who said they were cutting corners etc? In my office working rates can vary a lot for example a former mbr could not completea duty and was out late back late cutting off. However a transferred in postie from a neighbouring office comes in on time on the duty and ends up getting prepped in a very reasonable time and manages to deliver and complete well within time.

If a mbr is coming in early what does that say about start times? Our walk sorted mail is available well before 6am 0530 if not earler is viable based on mail arrival innto my D.O, we went on strike last year to protect the 5am start so if mbrs across the country are proving the 1 hour later start time is a load of rubbish then HQ should negotiate what they should have done in the first place and thats start times based on mail arrival rather than plucking figures out of the air.

Ifa mbr comes in 30 mins early and sorts his walksort mail before going onto IPS at scheduled time and then finishes early by 30 mins then he has done his duty within the alloted amount of hours and assuming he is doing the job properley then the duty has worked on that paticular day. If however he finishes on time then the mbr has taken 30 mins more than the allocated time for the duty.

When planning duties the delivery needs to be done in 3.5 hours and the overall workload which needs to be completed within hours of attendance and thats what I look for when seeing if the duties are working. Ive got mbrs saying their new route is over 3.5 hours but the amount of indoor work is low enough to enable them to finish within their duty time. It all comes down to longs and shorts and the amount of time the IPS is taking.

[andy2007]

Just look back at the topics about using cars on delivery. There are plenty of people, who said that they use them. Because there is no other way to complete their deliveries.

As for people carrying too much weight: We used to have a problem wih people doing exactly that, back when we we could earn an early finish. There were people carrying as many bags as hey could lift, and running around the segs.

These are just two examples.

My point is that although some people are just more eficient than others. It's important to check whether someone is cuting corners, and taking risks. Or simply, more efficient. When comparing work rates. It's a bad idea, to simply assume that because someone's slower. They are more efficient.

[shelanda]

Reading here about members coming in 30 mins early then finishing 30mins early being acceptable......we would like to think so but unfortunately in the real world this does not happen, the first 30mins is a gift ....yes a gift to RM (which they take happily rubbing their hands together with glee)!!!! the early finish is being looked at as hours too many in the office, and the worst part is those hours are now being taken from people on temporary contracts and also contracts not being renewed.........PLEASE THINK VERY, VERY CAREFULLY NOW ABOUT YOUR WORKING DAY. WHEN THOSE OF YOU ARE CUTTING CORNERS, WHEN THOSE OF YOU HAVE AN APPOINTMENT SO RUSH AROUND............ THAT IS SOME POOR ******* JOB YOU ARE DESTROYING. IF YOU NEED TO FINISH ON TIME, CUT OFF, SIMPLE REALLY. The more we do this the quicker we will win, all the time members are allowing themselves to be bullied, threatened and all the other sad ways doms are getting us to increase our workload they are driving us back to the dark days when we had no rights. I am sure that none of us want this.....SO FIGHT, ALL WE ARE ASKING IS THAT WE ALL WORK PROPERLY.

[your_postie]

thumbs up Andy & Shelanda :)


It’s about time we all started to make the stand together.

Big Daz you mention it’s ok if the members get done in 3.5 hours, no it’s not... It’s only ok if they’ve achieved this without coming in early, cutting corners, ignoring security regulations and H&S.

You say ‘assuming he is doing the job properly’, I doubt if many ever do... do you?

I’m not having a go mate, it’s just that if we don’t act now it’s going to be too late.

Managers should look upon gratefully when members finish before their time ‘cos they are saving hand over fist. If those members did the job properly it would cost RM, so they are saving them oodles.

RM being RM is still not satisfied with that, they now want to leech into that time aswell, by loading the jobs up even more with the intentions of conduct code when members no longer are physically capable to perform to their new standards.

We must stop rushing and simply do the jobs as they should be done... forget job and finish or else our jobs will be finished!

[Big Daz]

Do I do the job properley, well the last time i was prep tested I didnt even make 10 I walk at my own speed which varies from day to day take today it was a plod all the way around. What is a walking speed that is acceptable to us rank and file mbrs though thats a question tht needs answering we can slag off rm speed all we want but what speed is realistic and why is there only a performance aggrement covering sorting, does that not leave us wide open to attack from RM in the absence of agreed and fair standards for the other aspects of a delivery postal workers job? I dont doorstep packets etc etc


Why is there a assumption that the deliveries in my D.O are all unrealistic, mine isnt I have a 6 hour day (NO IPS) and a deliverey that is designed for a 6 hour day (475 calls about a quarter are flats). We have a prep rate standard of 11 yet its been reported on here that some areas have 16 and 16 .8. Tell me is 11 realistic or not what figure do you consider reasonable? Some in my office make 11 easily others dont.

Wve just done pegasus and already one delivery has been proven to be over 3.5 hours and the DOM is making it smaller and its been given more prep time (less time doing IPS). Two others are potentially over 3.5 hours but the DOM nees a little more persuassion. Ivemade it clear to mbrs that if they think the del is too big then bloddy well show that on the sheets so i can get the DOM out testing hes willing to go out and test deliveries that people have problems with and has done it before.

Pegasus set at 88% call rate in my office and after xmas I will be asking for all dels to be checked to see how they are shaping in regards to that figure as part of the 12 week review as the area pegasus terms of reference that was agreed by two ADR'S has a clause that allows for areas with a call rate higher than 88% call rate to be taken into account on planning deliveries.

Last monday my deliverey was below 88% call rate

[dvbuk55]

Why is there a assumption that the deliveries in my D.O are all unrealistic, mine isnt I have a 6 hour day (NO IPS) and a deliverey that is designed for a 6 hour day (475 calls about a quarter are flats). We have a prep rate standard of 11 yet its been reported on here that some areas have 16 and 16 .8. Tell me is 11 realistic or not what figure do you consider reasonable? Some in my office make 11 easily others dont.

Well TBH BD if yours is anything to go by then the deliveries ARE unrealistic - I always reckoned on being able to do 100 houses in 30 minutes - I could cover 600+ garden fronted semis in under 3.5 hours - one of our deliveries prior to Geo route was 860 drops on a 30 hour contract - no IPS - mostly terraced streets but garden fronted - so I would say unrealistic is an understatement.

[rockytony67]

. What is a walking speed that is acceptable to us rank and file mbrs though thats a question tht needs answering we can slag off rm speed all we want but what speed is realistic and why is there only a performance aggrement covering sorting, does that not leave us wide open to attack from RM in the absence of agreed and fair standards for the other aspects of a delivery postal workers job? I dont doorstep packets etc etc

But at the end of the day BD why did you go into a pegasus revision? when you yourself admit that there's no agreement covering walking speeds, and then go on to say "that leaves us wide open to attack from RM" I'm not having a pop mate I know how hard it is, but people should not be getting involved in pegasus revisions without the parameters being set in stone and agreed by HQ.