BT cuts final salary pension link

[Tman]

Oh well, at least it wasn't "power to the people!"..

And whats so wrong with the phrase "power to the people!"

What, other than being a trite, meaningless and over-used cliche, and effectively damned forever by being quoted by (the original) Wolfie?

Nothing, I suppose..........

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Glass 1/2 empty and admit defeat and drink the bitter taste left behind.

Or Glass 1/2 full with plenty of opportunity to add sugar so that the final drink is better than you thought.

I know which one I prefer but hey if anyone wants to give up that's your due, but constant attempts to undermine my strength of feeling are doomed to failure especially if no meaningful points are made as to why we should accept the constant attacks on our T&Cs, without at least trying to mitigate their impact.

[Night Tonic]

Next it'll be "I'm proud to be working class"

[BELIAL]

Well I guess there is something to be said for earning your keep rather than being a parasite living off the graft and sweat of others. It's probably an ethical/moral thingy

[DGP1]

Well I guess there is something to be said for earning your keep rather than being a parasite living off the graft and sweat of others. It's probably an ethical/moral thingy

I wouldn't have the heart to let everyone else provide me with a living (nor would I want the Government to bail me out because of my greed).

[dvbuk55]

Glass 1/2 empty and admit defeat and drink the bitter taste left behind.

Or Glass 1/2 full with plenty of opportunity to add sugar so that the final drink is better than you thought.

I know which one I prefer but hey if anyone wants to give up that's your due, but constant attempts to undermine my strength of feeling are doomed to failure especially if no meaningful points are made as to why we should accept the constant attacks on our T&Cs, without at least trying to mitigate their impact.

I am certainly not suggesting the fight should be given up. There should indeed be a campaign, but lets not kid ourselves that there is any chance of overturning the current situation. We should be setting our stall out now for the future and have Royal Mail left in no doubt that we intend to launch a serious campaign to increase wages, cut hours to 37.5 and increase holiday entitlement, have a sensible approach to Bank Holidays - particularly at Christmas and set out a realistic time scale to achieve that. The penalty for not reaching agreement should be a succession of non cooperation on change. The current agreement on pay and modernisation has been taken as a catch all situation by RM and the CWU seem to be extremely reluctant to face that fact and point out to RM that there are limits to the agreement AND WHERE THOSE LIMITS LIE - oh they might actually tell us where the limits are as well.

[Night Tonic]

Next it'll be "I'm proud to be working class"

Proud to be working class? Of course i am i SERVE them all day long and its what makes my days worth while, should i be ashamed? Do you feel nice about looking DOWN on working class people? Do you feel its OK to do it because of accident of birth? i find it good Just to bring a smile to the local kid on the blocks face as i give a card for their birthday or a pensioner a christmas card it makes it all worth while! But it dont stop there some wealthy people hearing from their son / daughter at uni or kid honeymooning in St Lucia its all good its not class war its people being decent good and kind to each other! i only hate greedy rotten thieves and they come in all classes not just one or the other! Said it before and will say it again take people as you find them if they are decent its good if not f*ck em. For you i am sorry most of the greedy rotten crooks are wearing suits but dont blame me but blame their avarice! The fact that we are all gonna pay for it or that you seem to aspire too,or hold it in high regard is not my problem but yours brother but hey thats the system we live in at the MO and we all have a say, but i wont be conned by them if i can help it! Will you? LOL.

You cannot be proud to be working class, you don't do anything to be working class. you either are or you are not. You can be PLEASED to be working class but proud no. You can take pride in what you do in life or in your job but not in something you have no say in or have made no effort to achieve. Being good to people should have no class conotations anyway. You either are or you are not.

[borders]

Next it'll be "I'm proud to be working class"

Proud to be working class? Of course i am i SERVE them all day long and its what makes my days worth while, should i be ashamed? Do you feel nice about looking DOWN on working class people? Do you feel its OK to do it because of accident of birth? i find it good Just to bring a smile to the local kid on the blocks face as i give a card for their birthday or a pensioner a christmas card it makes it all worth while! But it dont stop there some wealthy people hearing from their son / daughter at uni or kid honeymooning in St Lucia its all good its not class war its people being decent good and kind to each other! i only hate greedy rotten thieves and they come in all classes not just one or the other! Said it before and will say it again take people as you find them if they are decent its good if not f*ck em. For you i am sorry most of the greedy rotten crooks are wearing suits but dont blame me but blame their avarice! The fact that we are all gonna pay for it or that you seem to aspire too,or hold it in high regard is not my problem but yours brother but hey thats the system we live in at the MO and we all have a say, but i wont be conned by them if i can help it! Will you? LOL.

You cannot be proud to be working class, you don't do anything to be working class. you either are or you are not. You can be PLEASED to be working class but proud no. You can take pride in what you do in life or in your job but not in something you have no say in or have made no effort to achieve. Being good to people should have no class conotations anyway. You either are or you are not.

Night Tonic -honestly mate , what the hell are you going on about ??

[borders]

Culturally this country still is predominantly working class . Superficially it seems we are middle class because we have more of the trappings of middle class life, but the majority of people are just working class with more money, not middle class.

[borders]

Inequality between the rich and poor has doubled in the last 30 years, the trickle down effect has never really happened. take this from a study by the TUC-- "The study by the TUC union found that while disposable income for the wealthiest in society has risen to more than £700 a week, that of the poorest has only gone up marginally - and is still less than £200.

It claims more Britons are living below the breadline than 20 years ago, and that no other European country has such a gulf between rich and poor.The union said this showed that "the gap between the top tenth of the population and the bottom has roughly doubled since 1979".

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Next it'll be "I'm proud to be working class"

Proud to be working class? Of course i am i SERVE them all day long and its what makes my days worth while, should i be ashamed? Do you feel nice about looking DOWN on working class people? Do you feel its OK to do it because of accident of birth? i find it good Just to bring a smile to the local kid on the blocks face as i give a card for their birthday or a pensioner a christmas card it makes it all worth while! But it dont stop there some wealthy people hearing from their son / daughter at uni or kid honeymooning in St Lucia its all good its not class war its people being decent good and kind to each other! i only hate greedy rotten thieves and they come in all classes not just one or the other! Said it before and will say it again take people as you find them if they are decent its good if not f*ck em. For you i am sorry most of the greedy rotten crooks are wearing suits but dont blame me but blame their avarice! The fact that we are all gonna pay for it or that you seem to aspire too,or hold it in high regard is not my problem but yours brother but hey thats the system we live in at the MO and we all have a say, but i wont be conned by them if i can help it! Will you? LOL.

You cannot be proud to be working class, you don't do anything to be working class. you either are or you are not. You can be PLEASED to be working class but proud no. You can take pride in what you do in life or in your job but not in something you have no say in or have made no effort to achieve. Being good to people should have no class conotations anyway. You either are or you are not.

Utter rubbish - pride is a feeling not a real and tangible object that you can manipulate. Ergo you can be proud of anything you feel a connection to be it a class within society, a local sporting team you follow (not support), your nationality, your regionality, you ethnicity and even your religion. All of these can fit your description

You can take pride in what you do in life or in your job but not in something you have no say in or have made no effort to achieve.

Definition: adj., proud·er, proud·est.

1. Feeling pleasurable satisfaction over an act, possession, quality, or relationship by which one measures one's stature or self-worth: proud of one's child; proud to serve one's country.
2. Occasioning or being a reason for pride: “On January 1, 1900, Americans and Europeans greeted the twentieth century in the proud and certain belief that the next hundred years would make all things possible” (W. Bruce Lincoln).
3. Feeling or showing justifiable self-respect.
4. Filled with or showing excessive self-esteem.
5. Of great dignity; honored: a proud name.
6. Majestic; magnificent: proud alpine peaks.
7. Spirited. Used of an animal: proud steeds.

Definition: working class

working class
The socio-economic class consisting of people who work for wages, especially low wages, including unskilled and semi-skilled labourers and their families.


Noun - working-class
the social group that consists of people who earn wages, esp. as manual workers

Adjective - working-class
of or relating to the working class: a working-class neighbourhood