ROYAL MAIL MANAGERS

[BELIAL]

Mines rarely there, gets in late ,finishes early ,f***s off nearly every day for doctors ,personal ,car repairs frequent area meeting stuff. don't know the walks ,trolley/ drop bags/bike/ van?

Think I could cope

Can you tip bags and bully new starters?

I'm gonna practice, not sure i can master the coffee and obligatory strange walk though

[alggomas]

I think were playing tit for tat here.

Most postpersons with the right training and ability could become managers,but they do not [some do of course].

Many postpersons prefer the job they have.They do a good job have a chat etc. with their mates and go home to their families.
It really is the case of horses for courses.

If Supervisors and managers could agree together on work related issues it would be much better.Unfortunatly they disagree with each other and the workforce suffers, for they have no DIRECTION therefore some do not care about their jobs.
I work in East London and the management is poor [some try but are held back by apathy]People come to work ANY time they like and come back from breaks anytime they like.You may think this is great,but wait a minute say all this adds up to say 4 hours lost time.Thats about 25/30 boxes of letters/flats. In other words in a job and finish situation we couls all be out of the door much earlier.

Even if you suggest things they nod but do nothing. If I was a soldier in the army and was led by these Eastern Managers I would,and my unit be killed on the first day of action,and it is not funny!

[TrueBlueTerrier]

There does need to be a cultural change in Royal Mail.

In my limited experience of less than 5 years with Royal Mail I feel that managers within Royal Mail seem to fall into the 2 ends of the spectrum.

They are either weak managers who do not confront the work shy and lazy postmen and are afraid of upsetting senior postmen. I think the reason why they don't want to upset senior postmen is they were probably trained by them and subconsciously still see them as their superiors. This is why in the RAF at least when you were promoted you where never put in charge of those that you worked with. Royal Mails policy of promoting within a unit is at fault here, it would be fairer to the posties and managers if once promoted your were moved to a different section, shift or unit so you could find your feet and get some managerial skill before bossing mates.

At the other end there are the autocratic "I know best" style of management. If you disagree with a proposal they make and from a shop floor perspective you point out where this new idea may fail, they take it as a personal attack and dig their feet in. This in turn raises the heckles of the posties and then it snowballs until either a strike or "Executive Action" happens. Also when the autocratic style mangers are promoted within a shift or unit they tend to use administrative punishments far too easily. They will suspend people at the drop of a hat, and seem unwilling to just warn people as a 1st step.

However, we as a workforce do not help sometimes. It does seem that within Royal Mail that change is not welcome even if it improves working conditions. As a point of reference when we try to point of POSTMAN's way of "Doing the job properly" where they do just that, they do exactly as their boss tells them to, however, in my office when we tried this people would break of the IPS at the time stated on the work plan and go back to their frames and throw off as fast as they could. They would then give up their breaks and fly out to the round in their cars, Run round and finish the whole round . If we had locally adopted POSTMAN's approach we would have been less stressed, less sweaty and would still receive our 40 hours wage every week. So even though this change would have improved things for everyone, at my place there was a lot of resistance to it because they could not see the benefits and "this is they way we have always done it"

[paulsmd]

granger mate i think if the managers gave the 'job' over for one day i'm sure we'd see how much of a crap dim he really is so as that goes it's something that's not going to happen unless you climb the ladder (not really a climb is it) most got off deliverys because they were crap at it and weren't of the physical presence to be able to cope with the ever increaseing volumes of mail (whimps) and jump at a chance of a walk don't be silly we have loads on o/t and they shy away from the walks if they can other than that it's takes three to do one walk

All the managers in our office are x/postman who could not do the job.

[Ex RM Manager]

"We must not confuse dissent from disloyalty.” - Edward Murrow

[smokerjim]

"We must not confuse dissent from disloyalty.” - Edward Murrow

:lfo :cfo :mfo

[redman]

I think some of the views on here are unfair to managers, not all managers were bad at the frontline job. I certainly wasn't!

I got promoted when they opened up promotion to non PHG's about 18 years ago, being a manager is not that easy and is stressful. We have had many Delivery staff try acting and throw it in because they find it too stressful and difficult, others that stay acting, do it for the money and are not that good at the job. I agree you shouldn't act in your own office, there is too much familiarisation and favouritism and personal dislikes do happen.

I would be happy to swop with any of my staff for a week or more, even on heavy delivery days, I wouldn't swop my wages though.

I have great empathy for postal delivery staff the job is a lot harder than it used to be but its still better IMO than being indoors all the time. I have serious concerns about the workload especially on the staff who are approaching retirement its not a easy delivering the volumes of large flats we seem to get and some of the elder staff struggle.

Delivery Managers are under pressure and some may say they deserve it but having to go on two conference calls daily and explain why you are missing your budget isn't pleasent especially when there are numourous other managers listening to you defend your overspend. I don't see these managers coming in late going home early either. If I was paid my hours I would have earned enough to retire years ago. I know there are bad managers but there are bad frontline staff as well and the bad manager allow them to get away with it.

I am not perfect but I treat all my staff the same regardless and thats the way it should be.

[norbert]

I think some of the views on here are unfair to managers, not all managers were bad at the frontline job. I certainly wasn't!

I got promoted when they opened up promotion to non PHG's about 18 years ago, being a manager is not that easy and is stressful. We have had many Delivery staff try acting and throw it in because they find it too stressful and difficult, others that stay acting, do it for the money and are not that good at the job. I agree you shouldn't act in your own office, there is too much familiarisation and favouritism and personal dislikes do happen.

I would be happy to swop with any of my staff for a week or more, even on heavy delivery days, I wouldn't swop my wages though.

I have great empathy for postal delivery staff the job is a lot harder than it used to be but its still better IMO than being indoors all the time. I have serious concerns about the workload especially on the staff who are approaching retirement its not a easy delivering the volumes of large flats we seem to get and some of the elder staff struggle.

Delivery Managers are under pressure and some may say they deserve it but having to go on two conference calls daily and explain why you are missing your budget isn't pleasent especially when there are numourous other managers listening to you defend your overspend. I don't see these managers coming in late going home early either. If I was paid my hours I would have earned enough to retire years ago. I know there are bad managers but there are bad frontline staff as well and the bad manager allow them to get away with it.

I am not perfect but I treat all my staff the same regardless and thats the way it should be.

to be fair there are some telling points about the 70's Command and Control style that :lfo borrowed from Archie Norman and a very negative - rejected by most Businesses regimented Top Down Autocratic style - UNITE incidentally make the same points - they also say RM have gone backwards to the pre 1986 " PO Manual Days "

[ronnie6]

Think yourselves lucky you don't work in some of the 'transformed' non-operational areas. New managers publicly rubbishing staff in the press. Very highly paid contractors with no knowledge of the business, bullying and harrassment rife, staff 'encouraged' to leave, people off sick with stress, grievances, withholding of pay rises, mandatory (not voluntary) six week christmas working and the good old CMA response is..........................deafening in its silence.

[DGP1]

It really beggars belief that a company the size of RM can provide such poor IR there are an awful lot of managers who are not up to their jobs and who get around that by their bullying of staff. It seems that only the bad managers remain and any of the good ones leave to take an easier job elsewhere

[axeman]

True fact is that every one promoted within royal fail is in my opinion subserviant and are too frightened to speak out against anyone above them in rank
wether or not they agree with what they are told to do. It's a shame as i guess there might just be one or two who could be good managers if they were led by some other regime not like the 'asda' one lateone and crazier think is great.
royal fail seem to be under the illusion that fear , bullying and harrasement is the way to go to and is all apparent in the way things are now done within royal fail.
Just maybe it's the result of being fed bullshi* on a daily bassis at the conference calls they dissapear to all to regulary. wonder if they do star jumps at the conference call .........of course only if the big man tells them

[smokerjim]

True fact is that every one promoted within royal fail is in my opinion subserviant and are too frightened to speak out against anyone above them in rank
wether or not they agree with what they are told to do. It's a shame as i guess there might just be one or two who could be good managers if they were led by some other regime not like the 'asda' one lateone and crazier think is great.
royal fail seem to be under the illusion that fear , bullying and harrasement is the way to go to and is all apparent in the way things are now done within royal fail.
Just maybe it's the result of being fed bullshi* on a daily bassis at the conference calls they dissapear to all to regulary. wonder if they do star jumps at the conference call .........of course only if the big man tells them

Can't speak for all of them, but one has started at my DO this week - postman for 15 years, lineo for 18, and I was chatting to him earlier this week and he said that he hasn't been promoted higher because he is the sort that "...if the area manager is a prat, I'll tell him he's a prat!"

So basically, if you follow the company line without complaint, keep your management style firmly rooted in the 70's, and pucker up on a regular basis, then with luck, you can work your way so far up the greasy pole, when the sh*t flies it won't stick to you.

Or, you can stay as a lineo, be loathed by posties, get crapped on from above.....and be able to look at yourself in the mirror in the morning.

[BELIAL]

Think yourselves lucky you don't work in some of the 'transformed' non-operational areas. New managers publicly rubbishing staff in the press. Very highly paid contractors with no knowledge of the business, bullying and harrassment rife, staff 'encouraged' to leave, people off sick with stress, grievances, withholding of pay rises, mandatory (not voluntary) six week christmas working and the good old CMA response is..........................deafening in its silence.

Bet you could tell a tale or two?

[Tman]

and he said that he hasn't been promoted higher because he is the sort that "...if the area manager is a prat, I'll tell him he's a prat!"

That old cop-out. The old "I'm still bottom of the ladder 'cos I speak my mind" excuse.
More like he's down there because he's crap at his job...

[smokerjim]

and he said that he hasn't been promoted higher because he is the sort that "...if the area manager is a prat, I'll tell him he's a prat!"

That old cop-out. The old "I'm still bottom of the ladder 'cos I speak my mind" excuse.
More like he's down there because he's crap at his job...

In my two years in the job, I've found if you're crap, you get punted further up the heirarchy .....true story, we had a temp postman, that was woeful ( regularly taking 12 hrs on an 8 hr duty ) he's now the late shift manager