Royal Mail says fall in post volumes accelerating

[POSTMAN]

Theres no mention of email advertising which in the UK is controlled by stricter laws now. This is about companies using email for correspondance and online ads to reach consumers. Check out 'Phorm' for starters. Its not crap, its happening. Look at how many companies offer cost savings for online billing now.

I know this happens and you also get email ads too, you dim wit, have you never had emails asking you to buy Viagra or Weight loss pill, come on don't say that these are down too. No law governs the internet in this country and if it does it doesn't work, now why does that surprise me. If you want proof I'll email you a few hundred email ads from one of my old email addresses which i don't use anymore cos its full ads.

'Dim wit' as an answer doesn't cut it nor strenghthen your argument. Since when have you had a Viagra ad via RM??? You'll find that email for viagra comes from outside the UK and spam DOES have new laws in the UK that require the sender to provide an 'opt-out' facility. If you don't comply you can be fined now. Anything outside the UK isn't even part of the equation or the subject. What is it with some people? world still flat or something? Companies have been throwing a great deal of money into online advertising, even Royal Mail or had that escaped you too? ho ho.

I think to be fair regarding email advertising it is very dodgy,i've just looked in my deleted box and it's hard to tell what is spam and what isn't.
Most people get a lot of s**t,and just delete,delete,delete,which is going to happen and a lot is going to get lost.

If these companies think this is the way forward then i think they are in for a shock,but then again i'm biased.

[F0zziebear]

Email advertising is only one method. You need to bear in mind the whole google model, which provides adverts based on what you are looking for. You only need to see their growth to see where revenue is going. Companies have not suddenly found new advertising budget they have just changed the way in which they use it. For those familiar with social networking sites you will see advertising is targetted there as well based on your preferences.

Spam email in my poinion is not much different to what comes through the door. Some is well targetted based on what you sign up for in shops and websites and other stuff is badly targetted, but may run a blanket campaign with a low return.

I tihnk it's a shame RM did not make better use of WTLL sessions and getting marketing people into operations to explain how this kind of stuff works. Many other industries do something like this which helps frontline people understand their business better. The reverse is also useful. Management working during strikes probably learn't more about how RM works operationally than at any other time, or by reading the Courier.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

http://www.email-marketing-reports.com/canspam/uk/

Anti-spam laws in the UK

The UK's interpretation and implementation of the EU privacy and spam regulations.
Related categories:

* Anti-spam resources http://www.email-marketing-reports.com/spam/
* Permission http://www.email-marketing-reports.com/ ... ermission/
* Anti-spam laws http://www.email-marketing-reports.com/canspam/

Summary

The British government implemented the relevant EU directive (http://www.email-marketing-reports.com/canspam/eu/) in December 2003 with the Privacy and Electronic Communications Regulations. The legislation has attracted criticism for being too weak, for example by making it legal to send unsolicited email to businesses on a purely opt-out basis. Tougher legislation can be expected in the future. Mainstream advertisers also need to comply with industry self-regulation in the form of various codes of practice (see below for links).

Key documents

Privacy and Electronic Communications http://www.ico.gov.uk/what_we_cover/pri ... tions.aspx
This page at the UK's Information Commissioner's Office directs you to relevant regulations, guidelines, FAQs and other documents governing the sending of commercial email in the UK.

Privacy and Electronic Communications Regulations http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2003/20032426.htm
Full text of the legislation, published as Statutory Instrument 2003 No. 2426.

Guidance notes http://www.ico.gov.uk/what_we_cover/pri ... dance.aspx
The above Office's official guidance documents for the Privacy and Electronic Communications (EC Directive) Regulations.

Companies Act (Trading Disclosures) http://www.berr.gov.uk/bbf/co-act-2006/ ... ml#BM38145
Information on the additional trading information a company is required to disclose in any emails that can be considered business correspondence.

Direct Marketing Association http://www.dma.org.uk/content/Pro-BestPractice.asp
This page links to the UK DMA's various codes of practice. The main DM Code is obligatory for members, while the specific guidelines on email marketing best practices are recommendations.

British Code of Advertising, Sales Promotion and Direct Marketing http://www.cap.org.uk/cap/codes/cap_code/
The UK advertising industry's self-regulatory code for non-broadcast advertising includes direct and indirect references to email marketing. The code is enforced by the independent Advertising Standards Authority.

Other links

Email marketing and the law http://emailmarketingmanual.com/article ... ledge.html
A run down of UK requirements and the best practices that meet them.

Footers required in emails http://www.out-law.com/page-7594
News of new information requirements to go in the footers of outgoing business emails.

eBusiness Factsheet http://www.scottish-enterprise.com/publ ... acylaw.pdf
Scottish Enterprise's take on email marketing, spam and the law.

UK companies Still Breaking Email Privacy Laws http://www.crm2day.com/news/crm/120916.php
The results of a 2006 survey suggest that just under a third of the UK's top companies are not complying with UK (EU) anti-spam legislation.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Management working during strikes probably learn't more about how RM works operationally than at any other time, or by reading the Courier.

- If people honestly believe what goes on in the courier they will get a shock if they ever come to a "backwoods" DO like mine. IMHO it bears no relation to the real world, just RM vision of a perfect one.

[Night Tonic]

Oh nighty were now part of a global financial economy didn't you realise that ? royal fail can't escape this in fact they keep reminding us of the dutch p.o regulary. Time you woke up to royal fail antics and stop spouting the rhetoric of old street as if it's gospel

It seems barely worth replying to a thread that implies that Viagra spam email is competition for Royal Mail, but as usual, someone hasn't read the article properly. Its laughable.

[The FraudSquad]

volumes in letter post may well be falling....how many" take a credit card with us" junk mail type letters have you delivered lately

however losing business to email argument is a flawed one....okay you may lose the second class bank statement or utility bill for example, but on the other hand you gain people shopping online ebay/amazon etc...mainly in packets based traffic, which is much more lucrative than first/second class mail or mailsort....packets are through the roof in our office....you never hear royal mail say packet levels are increasing .funny that

[axeman]

Is it your quest to put down any argument in favour of royal fail ? im pretty sure i didn't mention royal fails eagernes to advertise viagra perhaps your just the part of the end product of viagra .................. i'm sure you know which part

[The FraudSquad]

! First is it me but are not ALL bank and credit card mail sent the same way as DSA? Do we not make a loss on ALL mail sent by DSA?

yeah in the form of paper statements we do lose out....but i meant in terms of people that do online banking/bill paying etc...so i get annoyed when i hear that the internet has damaged the postal business when you think of all the business it has created....amazon, play.com, and at the moment, bt internet modems all sent through the new tracked system...hellmail say we are too negative.....but royal mail are guilty of focusing on the negative doom and gloom scenario for far too long

[Phantom]

Theres no mention of email advertising which in the UK is controlled by stricter laws now. This is about companies using email for correspondance and online ads to reach consumers. Check out 'Phorm' for starters. Its not crap, its happening. Look at how many companies offer cost savings for online billing now.

I know this happens and you also get email ads too, you dim wit, have you never had emails asking you to buy Viagra or Weight loss pill, come on don't say that these are down too. No law governs the internet in this country and if it does it doesn't work, now why does that surprise me. If you want proof I'll email you a few hundred email ads from one of my old email addresses which i don't use anymore cos its full ads.

'Dim wit' as an answer doesn't cut it nor strenghthen your argument. Since when have you had a Viagra ad via RM??? You'll find that email for viagra comes from outside the UK and spam DOES have new laws in the UK that require the sender to provide an 'opt-out' facility. If you don't comply you can be fined now. Anything outside the UK isn't even part of the equation or the subject. What is it with some people? world still flat or something? Companies have been throwing a great deal of money into online advertising, even Royal Mail or had that escaped you too? ho ho.

What about E-Buyer sending ads and Overclockers sending ads via email both british companies who i did not give persmission to send me ads, yes i can opt out just like you can with D2D so whats your point???

[trythat]

Trythat. Can't argue with what you see/feel in your postal bag. Obviously this time of the year is the key time to advertise in the lead upto Xmas and some/most retail companies make their big revenue gains during this period. Also note that advertising campaigns, and especially print based one's have a several month lead time. I won't dismiss your feedback completely, but would be surprised if there is the same autumn pressure as in previous years, and expect January/February next year to be rather quiet. Plenty of early finishing, chance to implement Pegasus, and clean out your frames.

Sorry to found like a pessimist, but bear in mind your jobs are safer than most. You might also see an improvement in agency staff as more people will be unemploed and desperate for work (not saying being a postie etc. is the bottom of the pile).

You may be right, about early next year, but this year, we all thought that Autumn pressure came early and hard, it's still busy now. Plus even our DOM has queried our mail centre on the count they think we've received, one day alone we got them to add 30K to the figures. So I'm not sure how much I rely on RM for stats.

Georoute is being done now, not happy about the answers I'm getting from the guy doing it, no-one from our office has been on a course, also have the PDA's here being used, again no national agreement. I just think we're being ground into the dirt at the moment.

[F0zziebear]

There's also the belief that many retailers are in last chance saloon and are trying to advertise their way out of trouble. for example someone last night said he'd be surprised if Woolworths survived past Xmas. Regardless of the situation the following is true:

If the government allowed Royal Mail to cease operating (as was close a few years ago) there would a be a national outcry, it would be political dynamite. So yes I believe your jobs are getting harder, and the discrepancies in volumes is a strange one.

I have a question regarding volumes. There are volumes that come from the outward side of a mail centre and then the ones from inward. The iniward side needs to add both the RM outward and the DSA volumes. I do wonder where the figures being sent to the DO come from. However, the delivery rounds are essentially a fixed pipeline. There is a delivery round, someone preps it and you go out and delivery that route everyday (most of the time). RM make more money when that pipeline is as full as can be. This is not quite science and in reality no-one quite know's where the limit is. Cut-off, employee disgruntlement, strikes etc. are a guage of reaching and going past that limit. So if an extra 30k of volume comes through to the DO, that obviously is felt on a delivery round, and prep time goes up, but considerably? Usually rises in mail volume are felt disproportionately on delivery addresses, which means that they shouldn't take much longer to deliver. Please don't kill me for saying this, as I appreciate the extra weight, drop offs etc.... (well not really as I haven't ever delivered mail on a consistent basis).

Anyway, the discrepancy in mail volumes whilst of interest can be measured in different ways, be it operationally (quite unreliable at times), independent mail characteristics survey, or via revenue which is split by product. none of them match up, but ultimately who cares about the volume if you're not getting the revenue is my thought as you could be delivering far more volume but no-one is paying for it!

[Big Daz]

Trythat. Can't argue with what you see/feel in your postal bag. Obviously this time of the year is the key time to advertise in the lead upto Xmas and some/most retail companies make their big revenue gains during this period. Also note that advertising campaigns, and especially print based one's have a several month lead time. I won't dismiss your feedback completely, but would be surprised if there is the same autumn pressure as in previous years, and expect January/February next year to be rather quiet. Plenty of early finishing, chance to implement Pegasus, and clean out your frames.

Sorry to found like a pessimist, but bear in mind your jobs are safer than most. You might also see an improvement in agency staff as more people will be unemploed and desperate for work (not saying being a postie etc. is the bottom of the pile).

You may be right, about early next year, but this year, we all thought that Autumn pressure came early and hard, it's still busy now. Plus even our DOM has queried our mail centre on the count they think we've received, one day alone we got them to add 30K to the figures. So I'm not sure how much I rely on RM for stats.

Georoute is being done now, not happy about the answers I'm getting from the guy doing it, no-one from our office has been on a course, also have the PDA's here being used, again no national agreement. I just think we're being ground into the dirt at the moment.

The national aggrement is they (PDA) can and should be used without objection whilst CWU and RM rustle something up.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Thats it in a nutshell Linkinpark . Another way of looking at it in a simple way 600 houses on a walk and each one gets only 1 letter each and its the same one this will take a lot longer to complete than if you have 1000 letters divided between 500 of the houses, and you have to have done a walk to understand this I think.