scoliosis - covered by duty of care?

[stevejm]

I'm sure I have developed scoliosis of my back due to carrying bags of mail on one side for a dozen years (and not heavy bags either, always less than 5 kilos and likely less than that) - I believe most of us carry this way too. I only noticed a few days ago when looking in the mirror. This is concerning and annoying too.
Has RM breached it's strict duty of care here? Did I miss something along the way in terms of training/awareness. In all my time I don't recall any instruction about how to avoid cumulative wear and tear to the spine apart from don't lift overly heavy parcels and proper lifting technique. And use the post trolleys of which there is a distinct lack of in our D.O.
You can likely see where I'm going with this ... but really all I want is to correct the problem and that likely involves private therapy with an osteopath or chiropractor of the like - which I can't afford.
Has anybody else had a similar issue with body wear and tear or are we just expected to knacker ourselves in the course of our work?

[tramssirhc]

I'm sure I have developed scoliosis of my back due to carrying bags of mail on one side for a dozen years (and not heavy bags either, always less than 5 kilos and likely less than that) - I believe most of us carry this way too. I only noticed a few days ago when looking in the mirror. This is concerning and annoying too.
Has RM breached it's strict duty of care here? Did I miss something along the way in terms of training/awareness. In all my time I don't recall any instruction about how to avoid cumulative wear and tear to the spine apart from don't lift overly heavy parcels and proper lifting technique. And use the post trolleys of which there is a distinct lack of in our D.O.
You can likely see where I'm going with this ... but really all I want is to correct the problem and that likely involves private therapy with an osteopath or chiropractor of the like - which I can't afford.
Has anybody else had a similar issue with body wear and tear or are we just expected to knacker ourselves in the course of our work?

A duty of care is different to a safe system of work. The only time s bag should be carried is where there is no other option. If you believe that your employment has injured you, you need to bring this to your employers attention. A duty of care will apply where it is known that work is dangerous and there are no mitigation in place to prevent injury or where it is known that employees are working unsafely but there is no intervention to prevent it. All employers owe all employees a duty of care.

[scotchy1962]

I'm sure I have developed scoliosis of my back due to carrying bags of mail on one side for a dozen years (and not heavy bags either, always less than 5 kilos and likely less than that) - I believe most of us carry this way too. I only noticed a few days ago when looking in the mirror. This is concerning and annoying too.
Has RM breached it's strict duty of care here? Did I miss something along the way in terms of training/awareness. In all my time I don't recall any instruction about how to avoid cumulative wear and tear to the spine apart from don't lift overly heavy parcels and proper lifting technique. And use the post trolleys of which there is a distinct lack of in our D.O.
You can likely see where I'm going with this ... but really all I want is to correct the problem and that likely involves private therapy with an osteopath or chiropractor of the like - which I can't afford.
Has anybody else had a similar issue with body wear and tear or are we just expected to knacker ourselves in the course of our work?

A duty of care is different to a safe system of work. The only time s bag should be carried is where there is no other option. If you believe that your employment has injured you, you need to bring this to your employers attention. A duty of care will apply where it is known that work is dangerous and there are no mitigation in place to prevent injury or where it is known that employees are working unsafely but there is no intervention to prevent it. All employers owe all employees a duty of care.

What do you mean "The only time a bag should be carried is where there is no other option"
Trams that makes no sense, how else do you deliver mail and packets? Do you now use a pack horse?
LWT's are not and never have been readily available, plus when i started there were no LWT.
I got sciatica from pulling myself in and out of the old ford combos and RM paid for 6 months of treatment and rehab taking it too almost a year before i was back on full duties.
Back then i wasn't in the union so Iigave them a option, i will claim off you or you fix me and pay for it all.
\they chose the cheaper option, you don't have to be in the union if you have enough knowledge.

[stevejm]

I'm sure I have developed scoliosis of my back due to carrying bags of mail on one side for a dozen years (and not heavy bags either, always less than 5 kilos and likely less than that) - I believe most of us carry this way too. I only noticed a few days ago when looking in the mirror. This is concerning and annoying too.
Has RM breached it's strict duty of care here? Did I miss something along the way in terms of training/awareness. In all my time I don't recall any instruction about how to avoid cumulative wear and tear to the spine apart from don't lift overly heavy parcels and proper lifting technique. And use the post trolleys of which there is a distinct lack of in our D.O.
You can likely see where I'm going with this ... but really all I want is to correct the problem and that likely involves private therapy with an osteopath or chiropractor of the like - which I can't afford.
Has anybody else had a similar issue with body wear and tear or are we just expected to knacker ourselves in the course of our work?

A duty of care is different to a safe system of work. The only time s bag should be carried is where there is no other option. If you believe that your employment has injured you, you need to bring this to your employers attention. A duty of care will apply where it is known that work is dangerous and there are no mitigation in place to prevent injury or where it is known that employees are working unsafely but there is no intervention to prevent it. All employers owe all employees a duty of care.

Thats a very generalised answer - what about the specifics that are common to all delivery offices? What has your personal experience been?
In an office of 80 posties I know of one who regularly uses a LWT. Yorks are wheeled past the manager's office every day and are laden with bags. LWTs are nowhere to be seen. I doubt there are five in the D.O. If it is obvious that 95% of our mail gets delivered in bags and we are not being actively told to stop delivering in bags and being told that we must use the LWTs that are available over there in the corner then surely there is no mitigation in place to prevent injury and it can be seen every day that employees are using bags and not LWTs but no intervention is made to prevent it then surely that amounts a lack of duty of care?

[stevejm]

What do you mean "The only time a bag should be carried is where there is no other option"
Trams that makes no sense, how else do you deliver mail and packets? Do you now use a pack horse?
LWT's are not and never have been readily available, plus when i started there were no LWT.
I got sciatica from pulling myself in and out of the old ford combos and RM paid for 6 months of treatment and rehab taking it too almost a year before i was back on full duties.
Back then i wasn't in the union so I gave them a option, i will claim off you or you fix me and pay for it all.
\they chose the cheaper option, you don't have to be in the union if you have enough knowledge.

Hey Scotchy, did you present them with a medical certificate about your sciatica? Did the management just accept that your sciatica was caused on the job or did they push back on that?

[Hitcher]

When did you last ask for a LWT?

[Pidleypoo]

The above poster is correct. You’re only allowed to carry a big if you’re going into flats or up steep hills and then there’s a procedure to follow as in a risk assessment.

All other times you’re meant to use a lwt.

Unless you’ve repeatedly asked for one ( it doesn’t matter what anyone else is doing ) and thats been refused by your manager then I’m not sure you have case.

I won’t get in the van to do any mail unless there’s a lwt in it.

[tramssirhc]

I'm sure I have developed scoliosis of my back due to carrying bags of mail on one side for a dozen years (and not heavy bags either, always less than 5 kilos and likely less than that) - I believe most of us carry this way too. I only noticed a few days ago when looking in the mirror. This is concerning and annoying too.
Has RM breached it's strict duty of care here? Did I miss something along the way in terms of training/awareness. In all my time I don't recall any instruction about how to avoid cumulative wear and tear to the spine apart from don't lift overly heavy parcels and proper lifting technique. And use the post trolleys of which there is a distinct lack of in our D.O.
You can likely see where I'm going with this ... but really all I want is to correct the problem and that likely involves private therapy with an osteopath or chiropractor of the like - which I can't afford.
Has anybody else had a similar issue with body wear and tear or are we just expected to knacker ourselves in the course of our work?

A duty of care is different to a safe system of work. The only time s bag should be carried is where there is no other option. If you believe that your employment has injured you, you need to bring this to your employers attention. A duty of care will apply where it is known that work is dangerous and there are no mitigation in place to prevent injury or where it is known that employees are working unsafely but there is no intervention to prevent it. All employers owe all employees a duty of care.

What do you mean "The only time a bag should be carried is where there is no other option"
Trams that makes no sense, how else do you deliver mail and packets? Do you now use a pack horse?
LWT's are not and never have been readily available, plus when i started there were no LWT.
I got sciatica from pulling myself in and out of the old ford combos and RM paid for 6 months of treatment and rehab taking it too almost a year before i was back on full duties.
Back then i wasn't in the union so Iigave them a option, i will claim off you or you fix me and pay for it all.
\they chose the cheaper option, you don't have to be in the union if you have enough knowledge.

There is individual culpability. Where measures are put in place to mitigate risk and they are not adhered to or there is no evidence of saying no then an individual is culpable. The only time a bag should be carried is when it is not possible to use the mitigation provided.

[tramssirhc]

I'm sure I have developed scoliosis of my back due to carrying bags of mail on one side for a dozen years (and not heavy bags either, always less than 5 kilos and likely less than that) - I believe most of us carry this way too. I only noticed a few days ago when looking in the mirror. This is concerning and annoying too.
Has RM breached it's strict duty of care here? Did I miss something along the way in terms of training/awareness. In all my time I don't recall any instruction about how to avoid cumulative wear and tear to the spine apart from don't lift overly heavy parcels and proper lifting technique. And use the post trolleys of which there is a distinct lack of in our D.O.
You can likely see where I'm going with this ... but really all I want is to correct the problem and that likely involves private therapy with an osteopath or chiropractor of the like - which I can't afford.
Has anybody else had a similar issue with body wear and tear or are we just expected to knacker ourselves in the course of our work?

A duty of care is different to a safe system of work. The only time s bag should be carried is where there is no other option. If you believe that your employment has injured you, you need to bring this to your employers attention. A duty of care will apply where it is known that work is dangerous and there are no mitigation in place to prevent injury or where it is known that employees are working unsafely but there is no intervention to prevent it. All employers owe all employees a duty of care.

Thats a very generalised answer - what about the specifics that are common to all delivery offices? What has your personal experience been?
In an office of 80 posties I know of one who regularly uses a LWT. Yorks are wheeled past the manager's office every day and are laden with bags. LWTs are nowhere to be seen. I doubt there are five in the D.O. If it is obvious that 95% of our mail gets delivered in bags and we are not being actively told to stop delivering in bags and being told that we must use the LWTs that are available over there in the corner then surely there is no mitigation in place to prevent injury and it can be seen every day that employees are using bags and not LWTs but no intervention is made to prevent it then surely that amounts a lack of duty of care?

There is individual culpability. Where measures are put in place to mitigate risk and they are not adhered to or there is no evidence of saying no then an individual is culpable. The only time a bag should be carried is when it is not possible to use the mitigation provided

[tramssirhc]

The above poster is correct. You’re only allowed to carry a big if you’re going into flats or up steep hills and then there’s a procedure to follow as in a risk assessment.

All other times you’re meant to use a lwt.

Unless you’ve repeatedly asked for one ( it doesn’t matter what anyone else is doing ) and thats been refused by your manager then I’m not sure you have case.

I won’t get in the van to do any mail unless there’s a lwt in it.

Spot on.

[scotchy1962]

What do you mean "The only time a bag should be carried is where there is no other option"
Trams that makes no sense, how else do you deliver mail and packets? Do you now use a pack horse?
LWT's are not and never have been readily available, plus when i started there were no LWT.
I got sciatica from pulling myself in and out of the old ford combos and RM paid for 6 months of treatment and rehab taking it too almost a year before i was back on full duties.
Back then i wasn't in the union so I gave them a option, i will claim off you or you fix me and pay for it all.
\they chose the cheaper option, you don't have to be in the union if you have enough knowledge.

Hey Scotchy, did you present them with a medical certificate about your sciatica? Did the management just accept that your sciatica was caused on the job or did they push back on that?

It was blatantly obvious what was wrong with me, after visiting my doctor i phoned my dom/dum, whatever they are called, and we took it from there i informed him i intended to put a claim in unless they repaired what they had broken and he decided that the best option was to agree.
If i remember correctly 2 or 3 posties got ihr all with bad backs at or just before that time and all with the same sort of problems, maybe he thought upper management would come down and check on the office and thought it was easier to just pay for treatment, but pay for it they did and privately at that.

[scotchy1962]

The above poster is correct. You’re only allowed to carry a big if you’re going into flats or up steep hills and then there’s a procedure to follow as in a risk assessment.

All other times you’re meant to use a lwt.

Unless you’ve repeatedly asked for one ( it doesn’t matter what anyone else is doing ) and thats been refused by your manager then I’m not sure you have case.

I won’t get in the van to do any mail unless there’s a lwt in it.

Spot on.

I see posties all over Northern Ireland and what i don't see is all of them using LWT, some yes but the vast majority no.
And in my old office in my town none.

[Neverwasadoor]

From what I recall LWT are only mandatory if the round was designed with one to be used when a revision was done.
I have done nearly 30 years and worked in 3 offices and there has never been a LWT present in any of them.
Saying that using the correct bag weights is mandatory.

[Hitcher]

From what I recall LWT are only mandatory if the round was designed with one to be used when a revision was done.
I have done nearly 30 years and worked in 3 offices and there has never been a LWT present in any of them.
Saying that using the correct bag weights is mandatory.

LWT use was mandatory when van sharing was brought in all those years ago.