Does the current ODM-lite ways of working strengthen the CWU's bargaining position?

[postslippete]

Right now, IDS has little incentive to show RM as being clearly profitable because it objectively weakens its negotiating position on USO reform and on improving new entrants’ pay, terms and conditions. So RM will continue to be framed as structurally loss-making, even where parcel volumes are performing strongly. Perhaps the horse appeared to have bolted when new entrants were first brought in on worse contracts. History shows that once two-tier workforces exist, the so-called “harmonisation” almost always means levelling down rather than up, as the cheaper tier becomes the new normal through attrition.

However, the problem for Royal Mail is that the job itself has changed from 3 years ago. The work is harder, more pressured, more parcel-heavy, and more physically demanding than it was and thousands of new entrants have voted with their feet because from what I've seen many of them don’t think the pay reflects the graft. That churn matters, because a parcel-first model still relies on people turning up, staying, and doing the job consistently. The CWU may not be able to veto the ODM if RM persists with executive action, but that doesn’t mean it’s powerless.

What it can do is slow the rollout, expose where the model relies on goodwill and force trade-offs rather than granting change for free. There’s no silver bullet, but experience from the last dispute showed that when months of talks fail, working to rule is the most effective lever in this industry. An overtime ban hurts more today because duties remain oversized, parcel volumes are higher than ever, and more tasks are being pushed onto delivery staff.

Crucially, this isn’t just about resistance but leverage. IDS now has a billionaire owner who desperately needs RM to become profitable. A model that depends on burning through underpaid new entrants, low morale, and constant churn is not sustainable. Productivity improvements without fair pay create retention problems further down the line. If RM wants flexibility, efficiency, and cooperation, then improving new entrants’ pay and terms and rebuilding morale across the workforce isn’t just a concession, it’s a prerequisite.

[sweepster70]

I believe about half of new starters are in the Union. What's our percentage now? I bet it's around the 60% mark.

Not doubting your percentage estimate for how many new-entrant employees are in the union, but just wondering where you get your 50% guesstimate from? Is it anecdotal/based just on your office? If so, by way of comparison, only 25% or so of us new entrants at my office are union members.

There was something from Martin Walsh that I read/heard. Might not have been on here, saying 54% were in the Union. Could have been on one of the CWU video's.
Found it.... 13:25

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... QRpZlRTHt0

[postmanplod2026]

the cwu need to get a grip, we want a job where a walk is achievable forget new starts contracts for now, its about getting the job to be sustainable everyday not coming into a shitshow job every day where u dont know what ur doing

[Smoothbackground]

I believe about half of new starters are in the Union. What's our percentage now? I bet it's around the 60% mark.

Not doubting your percentage estimate for how many new-entrant employees are in the union, but just wondering where you get your 50% guesstimate from? Is it anecdotal/based just on your office? If so, by way of comparison, only 25% or so of us new entrants at my office are union members.

There was something from Martin Walsh that I read/heard. Might not have been on here, saying 54% were in the Union. Could have been on one of the CWU video's.
Found it.... 13:25

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... QRpZlRTHt0

Thanks. More new entrants are/were members than I thought.,,

[funkflex55]

the cwu need to get a grip, we want a job where a walk is achievable forget new starts contracts for now, its about getting the job to be sustainable everyday not coming into a shitshow job every day where u dont know what ur doing

I don't expect that walks being achievable will be a priority ever again. RM want staff working every second of every day and if staff are finishing walks then this isn't the case. Instead they'd rather cutting off and as long as tracked are done who cares if mail goes back. The fines are less that the labour costs.

[norris9]

If RM wants flexibility, efficiency, and cooperation, then improving new entrants’ pay and terms and rebuilding morale across the workforce isn’t just a concession, it’s a prerequisite.

I honestly don't think the lesser pay and terms & conditions will be the main reason why newer contracted workers would leave if the new way of working comes in.

If you're in a van-share this is how I understand the new USO changes would work...

Monday Blue = 3 days' mail. (Last went out Thurs)
Tuesday Yellow = 3 days' mail. (Last went out Fri)
Wednesday Blue = 2 days' mail.
Thursday Yellow = 2 days' mail.
Friday Blue = 2 days' mail.
Saturday = 1st Class mail and Tracked.

2 van-sharing partners will cover 4 rounds, alternating between them each day. Some days working on your own delivering Tracked + 1st Class only, as 3 of you navigate the 4 duties.

Attrition rates of both legacy and newly contracted posties will surely increase dramatically.

[ted_e_bear]

If RM wants flexibility, efficiency, and cooperation, then improving new entrants’ pay and terms and rebuilding morale across the workforce isn’t just a concession, it’s a prerequisite.

I honestly don't think the lesser pay and terms & conditions will be the main reason why newer contracted workers would leave if the new way of working comes in.

If you're in a van-share this is how I understand the new USO changes would work...

Monday Blue = 3 days' mail. (Last went out Thurs)
Tuesday Yellow = 3 days' mail. (Last went out Fri)
Wednesday Blue = 2 days' mail.
Thursday Yellow = 2 days' mail.
Friday Blue = 2 days' mail.
Saturday = 1st Class mail and Tracked.

2 van-sharing partners will cover 4 rounds, alternating between them each day. Some days working on your own delivering Tracked + 1st Class only, as 3 of you navigate the 4 duties.

Attrition rates of both legacy and newly contracted posties will surely increase dramatically.

Yes that covers it, there'll be 3 people doing 4 duties (originally 2 pairs of van share) so mon-fri on alternating days over a two week period out of the 3 people 2 will be doing a full everything delivery whilst the 3rd does parcels+1c for the other 2 duties, not always the same people walking every day as you can swap round obviously unless you can't drive, Saturdays is parcels+1c only so will only require 2 people at work which is where the new attendances with more Saturdays off come in

Yes it will be s**t

No I don't know how non drivers will be affected on Saturdays but they'll be shafted every other day as they can't do the parcels only days for obvious reason.

[qwerty2]

If RM wants flexibility, efficiency, and cooperation, then improving new entrants’ pay and terms and rebuilding morale across the workforce isn’t just a concession, it’s a prerequisite.

I honestly don't think the lesser pay and terms & conditions will be the main reason why newer contracted workers would leave if the new way of working comes in.

If you're in a van-share this is how I understand the new USO changes would work...

Monday Blue = 3 days' mail. (Last went out Thurs)
Tuesday Yellow = 3 days' mail. (Last went out Fri)
Wednesday Blue = 2 days' mail.
Thursday Yellow = 2 days' mail.
Friday Blue = 2 days' mail.
Saturday = 1st Class mail and Tracked.

2 van-sharing partners will cover 4 rounds, alternating between them each day. Some days working on your own delivering Tracked + 1st Class only, as 3 of you navigate the 4 duties.

Attrition rates of both legacy and newly contracted posties will surely increase dramatically.

Yes that covers it, there'll be 3 people doing 4 duties (originally 2 pairs of van share) so mon-fri on alternating days over a two week period out of the 3 people 2 will be doing a full everything delivery whilst the 3rd does parcels+1c for the other 2 duties, not always the same people walking every day as you can swap round obviously unless you can't drive, Saturdays is parcels+1c only so will only require 2 people at work which is where the new attendances with more Saturdays off come in

Yes it will be s**t

No I don't know how non drivers will be affected on Saturdays but they'll be shafted every other day as they can't do the parcels only days for obvious reason.

Theyll stay in office on sat and prep all the mail thats left in!!!!

[postslippete]

Norris, I don't disagree with how the van share/reduced models might work but thats exactly why pay and terms matter even more once it's introduced. RM wants to bring all this change in, but clearly don't want to pay for it and that is the wrong way to go about it. If you want more effort, flexibility, a better performance and an acceptance from the workforce but in return don't improve the pay or conditions then I agree the outcome is predictable that they will met with a lot of resistance, churn, burnout and an overwhelming failure to embed these changes.

RM are expecting staff to give more while offering many of them less and they are deluded if they think that people will accept this when they are seeing and experiencing for themselves just how busy we are. Parcels haven't dropped off a cliff after xmas like in recent years, so people are putting 2 and 2 together and wondering why the business still says it is struggling. The bottom line is if you want people to change how they work the you have to make it worth their while.

[Gingerbread Fred]

More parcels doesn't always mean more profit of you're margins are being squeezed by competition.

Lets say 'Petes Products' uses Royal mail for their parcel (1 million units per year) and RM charge Pete £5 per parcel.
Royal mail have a gross income of £5 million

Lets say Evri offer Pete the same service for £3 per parcel. Pete goes back to Royal mail who agree they'll go down to £3.50.

For the same work Royal mail are £1.5 million down.

If Royal Mail refuse they end up £5 million down

[norris9]

Can't we reduce parcel prices to get more volume. We go to virtually every street in the country everyday. We are always right on people's doorsteps daily. I sometimes see Evri, Yodel etc on the same street, going to same houses as me and think if we had those parcels too it would be a lot of extra money for very little extra effort.

[clashcityrocker]

if we had those parcels too it would be a lot of extra money for very little extra effort.

I am sure there are laws against predatory pricing but then....
Collecting the parcels.
Transporting the parcels.
Processing the parcels.
Transporting the parcels.
All of which has a cost.
And then the very little extra effort of delivering the parcels.

I am sure someone looked at Parcelforce collections and thought - Royal mail could do all that work for very little extra effort ......

[yellowbelly]

if we had those parcels too it would be a lot of extra money for very little extra effort.

I am sure there are laws against predatory pricing but then....
Collecting the parcels.
Transporting the parcels.
Processing the parcels.
Transporting the parcels.
All of which has a cost.
And then the very little extra effort of delivering the parcels.

I am sure someone looked at Parcelforce collections and thought - Royal mail could do all that work for very little extra effort ......

But RM shoot themselves in the foot a lot of the time, went to an address in the deep countryside with a parcel, got to the door, an almost letterbox postable packet was sticking out of the letterbox, half wet. Thought to myself 'bl**dy Amazon', put my parcel in the safe place, pulled out the letterbox item to post my 739 - and it was an RM packet delivered by (when I checked the tracking) PFW! What a waste of resources.

[TopperGas]

More parcels doesn't always mean more profit of you're margins are beingtha squeezed by competition.

Lets say 'Petes Products' uses Royal mail for their parcel (1 million units per year) and RM charge Pete £5 per parcel.
Royal mail have a gross income of £5 million

Lets say Evri offer Pete the same service for £3 per parcel. Pete goes back to Royal mail who agree they'll go down to £3.50.

For the same work Royal mail are £1.5 million down.

If Royal Mail refuse they end up £5 million down

Problem is that RM have let EVRi get a massive foot hold in the parcel market by letting them undercut their prices, I follow the EVRi courier around on my rural duty I cover and his MPV is rammed with parcels, over Xmas he was delivering more each day then I was in a van.

Unless EVRi really mess up I can't see RM ever getting that business now and it will always remain with EVRi.

[Gingerbread Fred]

Absolutely which is where some realism comes into play. In the current climate cost is king.

The business will year by year erode into a gig economy job - the letters are just not sustainable and parcels can be delivered by competitors for alot less