Does Royal Mail underestimate how much experience it has lost?

[abuch1980]

Of course they know of the impact of losing so much experience - they just do not care !

High turnover of staff is the Amazon business model - which RM have copied.

Exactly this. Care not they do.

[ted_e_bear]

By way of example, the firms duty I’m covering over peak is normally done by a legacy staff member who regularly leaves four yorks of oversized for it on a daily basis.

Shouldn't be much of a problem delivering to firms, apart from handling the items you generally don't have the usual issues of people not being in etc.

[Smoothbackground]

By way of example, the firms duty I’m covering over peak is normally done by a legacy staff member who regularly leaves four yorks of oversized for it on a daily basis.

Shouldn't be much of a problem delivering to firms, apart from handling the items you generally don't have the usual issues of people not being in etc.

As you say, it’s no problem at all. But it does beg the rather obvious question as to why the duty-holder doesn’t clear it. And thinking about it, the legacy postmen who normally cover it when he’s off all leave the same amount each day as the duty-holder (so as not to embarrass him, I presume). As I said in my original comment, us new-entrant posties certainly can’t complete a duty like some legacy posties, ie, stringing it out and doing the bare minimum. Not tarring all with the same brush, I hasten to add — just responding to the generalised comment and assertion above in the thread about new-starters not being able to “compete a duty” like the experienced posties they replace…

[Kenfandango]

You're all missing the (incredibly stupid) point here.

"Legacy" contracts are a burden on the spreadsheet column marked "staffing costs."
"New starts" are a burden on the column marked "overtime."
Agency has its own column.

A company will pledge to reduce staffing costs and will only look at that column (this is why vets, opticians, pharmacy etc run on locum staff- even if they end up paying the same 3 people double what they'd pay them as staff members, it doesn't count towards staffing costs thus isn't important.)

Royal mail are focusing on overall staffing costs at the moment. Come January they will be looking at the overtime or agency columns, cycling through them trying to shave off money every few months as large companies do. Every 3 years or so someone will ordain to shave some money off the "management" column.

Doesn't it all need to work together? Yes, but I did say it was stupid

[Neverwasadoor]

I don't want to really get involved with the whole who does more, but don't forget a legacy 37hrs only actually works 33.40 a week because of breaks.
Where as a new contract works 37 with their breaks on top, which to my mind is the first thing that needs changing.

[Wullie10]

What is scary is the amount of new starters in their 60s . When most sane postmen are looking to get out these poor sods are just starting. They probably see the postie in the summer and think that's a nice easy job till state pension .

[roman]

I think they don’t care about experience. In fact we more or less got told in in a team briefing a number of years ago that long serving posties are a drain on the resources.The old guard would take no crap when it came to pay rises and working conditions. Pensions are another drain on long servers. They want a revolving door recruitment policy cause it’s cheaper.

[Hyrrokkin]

High turnover of staff is the Amazon business model - which RM have copied.

In the same way cargo cults have bamboo control towers, bamboo radios, and bamboo runways. The loot will arrive any day now.

???

[Hyrrokkin]

Of course they know of the impact of losing so much experience - they just do not care !

High turnover of staff is the Amazon business model - which RM have copied.

Have Amazon been going long enough to lose experienced staff or are they just continually replacing inexperienced?

Amazon are over 30 yrs old
Amazon UK started in 1998

I read an interesting article (cannot remember where) that went into detail regarding their employment practices/structure/history etc etc.
It went into detail that is exactly what is factored into their business model - a high turnover of staff.
Would they rather have a settled long term experienced workforce - they do not give a s**t.

[Zicomurphy]

I don't want to really get involved with the whole who does more, but don't forget a legacy 37hrs only actually works 33.40 a week because of breaks.
Where as a new contract works 37 with their breaks on top, which to my mind is the first thing that needs changing.

I thought the new full time contract was 40 hours with an unpaid break making it a 8 hour 40 minute day. Getting paid less money to work over 6 hours more a week, I can fully understand the resentment and high turnover of new starters.

[TopperGas]

I don't want to really get involved with the whole who does more, but don't forget a legacy 37hrs only actually works 33.40 a week because of breaks.
Where as a new contract works 37 with their breaks on top, which to my mind is the first thing that needs changing.

You can only see that changing one way and it won't be the new contract staff who gain anything from the change, instead of having legacy contracts and new contracts RM should have just had one universal contract from day 1.

[Neverwasadoor]

I thought the new full time contract was 40 hours with an unpaid break making it a 8 hour 40 minute day. Getting paid less money to work over 6 hours more a week, I can fully understand the resentment and high turnover of new starters.
[/quote]

Depends where you are I think, we have no 40hr contracts, they are all 37 new and old.
Our office is half decent though and new and old contracts aren’t expected to do any more work on a duty even with the break situation.

[WalkerX]

On the shop floor I genuinely wonder if RM fully understands the operational impact of losing so many long-term experienced staff. In our office the managers appear to be relying heavily on these new starters and many of them are now working long hours, mainly because experience and speed often takes years to develop. Duties that seasoned posties complete are now stretching well beyond the usual spans, leading to increased overtime and delivery excess.

Mistakes are also becoming more common with mis-deliveries, missed collections, parcels not being scanned and items brought back to the office unnecessarily. None of this is a criticism of the new starters as they are being asked to learn a job at pace on reduced terms and under constant pressure - but it does highlight a big flaw when it comes to cost-saving. If RM believes that it is saving money by replacing experienced staff with cheaper new contracts then the hidden costs of increased overtime, re-deliveries, customer complaints and failed targets need to be acknowledged.

On top of this is the churn with over half of those recruited on the new contracts have already left the business which means repeated costs for recruitment, training, uniforms and equipment. Being paid significantly less than experienced colleagues for doing the same job doesn't exactly inspire any sort of loyalty or long term commitment. Are RM genuinely saving money here or just shifting visible costs into invisible ones while eroding service quality? At what point does the business recognise that experience, stability and workforce morale are assets rather than liabilities?

Are we going to look back in 5 years and realise when the knowledge base was stripped out in the name of "modernisation" only to find that the service is slower, more error prone and actually more expensive to run?

All of this

[PH75]

I'm new to RM this week and have just started my 23 hours contract in Distribution. I will need to hope for OT / day off work ( if available )

[roman]

Good luck to you