Facts not spin

[Pharox]

Royal Mail funded the escrow. However the surplus has grown and the union then argued this should be given to members. The trustees , Royal Mail agreed.

If that is the case, this extra money should *NOT* be part of this current deal. It's nothing more than a bribe/carrot to try and get this cr*p deal over the line, which I sure hope it does not get voted in! The surplus could have been given anytime, especially when we were out of strike, could have been used as a strike fund to help members who were struggling. Goes to show how desperate the CWU are.

[sixfoottwo]

Shane Warne (RIP) would be proud of this thread!!

[k979aaa]

The fact is the union has and is not doing a good job tactics and timing and unity will win any dispute and we lacked all three of them!

[Acca Dacca]

Regarding point number 6;

If the reason for the later starts is due to items of mail and parcels being delivered to the DO later then how can those who request an earlier finish time be accommodated? They cant start earlier because the mail isnt in the building to sort ( or be prepped for them if its a part timer requesting )

If they COULD be accomodated, why couldnt everyone in that case?

I expect these requests are going to be met with a lot of 'sorry we tried but unfortunately we cant.....'

[ebbzie]

Several times on this thread it has been asked about us working longer out in the heat of the summer and the dark of a freezing winter . Nt once has the CWU addressed our concerns .
It really feels lie they will just ignore it as long as they get a yes vote.
Sorry but if this is allowed to happen im out of this union as they are clearly not listening to there members worries.
Maybe Dave Ward should try a 4 1/2 hour delivery on a Saturday in this heat?

[Martin Walsh]

In terms of working longer in the summer heat , it will depend on your final start and finish times. Remember if it is less than 60 minutes later which we believe will be the case then in the summer period then you will work 24 minutes less per day in the Summer period under seasonal variations.

Remember there is no requirement for you to work beyond your time, the vast majority of Delivery units will finish up to one hour later than your current times. This will range from no change at all to 60 minutes later.

Now clearly there is a risk assessment which will be carried out as even now we have duties who finish after 15:30 currently and rural deliveries can finish currently up to 16.30.

[k979aaa]

In terms of working longer in the summer heat , it will depend on your final start and finish times. Remember if it is less than 60 minutes later which we believe will be the case then in the summer period then you will work 24 minutes less per day in the Summer period under seasonal variations.

Remember there is no requirement for you to work beyond your time, the vast majority of Delivery units will finish up to one hour later than your current times. This will range from no change at all to 60 minutes later.

Now clearly there is a risk assessment which will be carried out as even now we have duties who finish after 15:30 currently and rural deliveries can finish currently up to 16.30.

This clearly will not cannot help those who need the use of facilities nor those who need to pick up children or look after older relatives and at best is a second rate deal and at worst a travesty of our terms conditions which we fought for in 2022.
And as such I cannot recommend this deal and urge us all all to read the deal make your own minds up and VOTE!

[zz666]

If deployment of seasonal variation starts in October, for the tax year 23/24 we would be working two hours extra per week from October 2023 for about 3 months. From January 2024 to 5th April 2024 , we work 37 hours. I work out we will work more than the contracted hours for the current tax year.

How long can a delivery be? 4 hours,5 or 6?

The new start times are vague. Badly worded (probably like the agreement).

[Acca Dacca]

In terms of working longer in the summer heat , it will depend on your final start and finish times. Remember if it is less than 60 minutes later which we believe will be the case then in the summer period then you will work 24 minutes less per day in the Summer period under seasonal variations.

Which is still later than current finishing time because the later starts will have came into effect by next summer - so likely still working out in delivery at least half an hour later in the day than we are now ( and thats half an hour later than the current scheduled finish time - it'd be more if taking into account many offices are allowing people to start and finish earlier at the moment taking the heat into account so itd actually be even more than half an hour later compared to that )

CWU have also said they are going to be working with RM to reduce the time taken doing indoor work which means longer delivery span so the likelihood is that in the summer even though we are working 24 minutes less - we will still be doing the same outdoor work if not more than we are now, and still finishing later than we are now

[LancePercival]

Fact deal is shocking I'm a no

[Zicomurphy]

Regarding point number 6;

If the reason for the later starts is due to items of mail and parcels being delivered to the DO later then how can those who request an earlier finish time be accommodated? They cant start earlier because the mail isnt in the building to sort ( or be prepped for them if its a part timer requesting )

If they COULD be accomodated, why couldnt everyone in that case?

I expect these requests are going to be met with a lot of 'sorry we tried but unfortunately we cant.....'

Yep, the wording is….

Royal Mail will therefore strive to accommodate at all times the needs of individual employees, whilst also meeting the needs of the operation.

Like you say the only way someone could finish earlier would be to get out the office and commence their delivery earlier but they can’t finish prepping and tying up their walk until all the work is in the office and all IPS is finished so they won’t be ready to leave the office any earlier than anyone else.

I fully expect most requests will be met with an answer of “we tried to accommodate your needs but operational needs mean we can’t and you will have to make your own care arrangements.”

[kazardaimenu]

If it gets dark the mail is getting taken back no access. Carry out your own risk assessments, if it gets to 40 degrees in your 15 year old combo take it back to the office along with the mail. Also reject this deal.

[pieoftheday]

In terms of working longer in the summer heat , it will depend on your final start and finish times. Remember if it is less than 60 minutes later which we believe will be the case then in the summer period then you will work 24 minutes less per day in the Summer period under seasonal variations.

Which is still later than current finishing time because the later starts will have came into effect by next summer - so likely still working out in delivery at least half an hour later in the day than we are now ( and thats half an hour later than the current scheduled finish time - it'd be more if taking into account many offices are allowing people to start and finish earlier at the moment taking the heat into account so itd actually be even more than half an hour later compared to that )

CWU have also said they are going to be working with RM to reduce the time taken doing indoor work which means longer delivery span so the likelihood is that in the summer even though we are working 24 minutes less - we will still be doing the same outdoor work if not more than we are now, and still finishing later than we are now

Oh for goodness sake stop talking comment sense man, the CWU will be completely flummoxed

[pieoftheday]

In terms of working longer in the summer heat , it will depend on your final start and finish times. Remember if it is less than 60 minutes later which we believe will be the case then in the summer period then you will work 24 minutes less per day in the Summer period under seasonal variations.

Which is still later than current finishing time because the later starts will have came into effect by next summer - so likely still working out in delivery at least half an hour later in the day than we are now ( and thats half an hour later than the current scheduled finish time - it'd be more if taking into account many offices are allowing people to start and finish earlier at the moment taking the heat into account so itd actually be even more than half an hour later compared to that )

CWU have also said they are going to be working with RM to reduce the time taken doing indoor work which means longer delivery span so the likelihood is that in the summer even though we are working 24 minutes less - we will still be doing the same outdoor work if not more than we are now, and still finishing later than we are now

Oh for goodness sake stop talking comment sense man, the CWU will be completely flummoxed

[Pidleypoo]

In terms of working longer in the summer heat , it will depend on your final start and finish times. Remember if it is less than 60 minutes later which we believe will be the case then in the summer period then you will work 24 minutes less per day in the Summer period under seasonal variations.

Which is still later than current finishing time because the later starts will have came into effect by next summer - so likely still working out in delivery at least half an hour later in the day than we are now ( and thats half an hour later than the current scheduled finish time - it'd be more if taking into account many offices are allowing people to start and finish earlier at the moment taking the heat into account so itd actually be even more than half an hour later compared to that )

CWU have also said they are going to be working with RM to reduce the time taken doing indoor work which means longer delivery span so the likelihood is that in the summer even though we are working 24 minutes less - we will still be doing the same outdoor work if not more than we are now, and still finishing later than we are now

Speaking of this magical new indoor method , anyone heard anything?

Also , the point about the heat is that we will have longer outdoor spans in the hottest parts of the day….I don’t understand the the cwu aren’t getting why it’s such a worry for many.

Then along comes the winter and we’re out there even longer and both things will increase sickness but it’s a good job the union saved the sick pay , oh wait , they didn’t.

Add to that this new performance standard that no one has a clue about then it’s gives managers the green light to bully everyone.

Another question that needs answering is the new flexibility of 30 mins , is this still optional or mandatory? Because if it’s the latter then that’s another thing we’ve been sold down the river for.