Fao Martin Walsh / New start times

[Neverwasadoor]

Martin
Please could we have the new delivery office start times, which were promised before the original vote timetable. Which I believe was tomorrow.
My office is very interested in this.
Many thanks.

[pieoftheday]

Martin
Please could we have the new delivery office start times, which were promised before the original vote timetable. Which I believe was tomorrow.
My office is very interested in this.
Many thanks.

I wonder if we'll get them before we get to vote

[CRIBMAD]

of course we won't ! they are running scared- VOTE NO !

[toonshola]

We won’t get the exact start times set in stone. No doubt there will be some “proposed” times released before next week subject to 165 joint working groups and 800 meetings with tea and biscuits for the union elite to participate in. After said meetings and working groups the actual times will be very very different, but by then the ballot will be over anyway.

[Dogbone1510]

Were voting on pure guess work let's face it it's nearly a year till it changes then if it dosnt work (which they say it dosnt) theyll knock it back another 30 mins unfortunately CWU have failed us all and we all need to face it its 5pm fi Isles soon

[Woody Guthrie]

Apparently the times are with the union but they are at the moment trying to tidy up the raw data before it's released to the members probably in the next few days.

The word "indicative" is being used a lot.

[SpacePhoenix]

There's no way that any times will be set in stone, you've got the Network Review in the autumn and any changes to arrival times resulting from that at inward MCs will have a knock-on affect on MC night shift at times and start times in deliveries

[TopperGas]

There's no way that any times will be set in stone, you've got the Network Review in the autumn and any changes to arrival times resulting from that at inward MCs will have a knock-on affect on MC night shift at times and start times in deliveries

That's why the previous poster indicated they'd only be indicative? Regardless surely it's better to have some limited info than none at all.

[Woody Guthrie]

The network will not be changing until next March at the earliest.

The national officers believe the impact on mailcentres will be minimal and the resultant impact on delivery can be mitigated and limited to 60 minutes maximum but in most cases less.

Before you start SP, that's the national officers position so if you're going to call it bullshit don't quote me, give them a call instead.

[SpacePhoenix]

The network will not be changing until next March at the earliest.

It could change at any time, they'd only have to give us 30 days notice. Any "promise" that the network won't change until March at the earliest isn't worth the paper that it's printed on.

If part of the Network Review ends up being the axing of all the Skynet flights then the change of start times WILL be more than 60mins

[Woody Guthrie]

The network will not be changing until next March at the earliest.

It could change at any time, they'd only have to give us 30 days notice. Any "promise" that the network won't change until March at the earliest isn't worth the paper that it's printed on.

If part of the Network Review ends up being the axing of all the Skynet flights then the change of start times WILL be more than 60mins

They have already shared their plan on which flights are being axed.
I think it's 16 legs, eight flights.
Stanstead and Aberdeen will close with Inverness possibly going later but that's still apparently in the mix.
They have guaranteed no change to network until next March, of course they could renegade on that but that equally applies to anything in the proposed agreement.

[Martin Walsh]

Space the processing window will change as once the flights come out then the processing window automatically becomes longer.

However the delivery start times can be mitigated. A combination of things are being considered and the joint working parties will review a lot of this over the next few weeks.

This will range from

1. The final outward dispatch has not changed in 50 years yet the work load has reduced so a review of the outward dispatch will take place.

2. The Midland hub comes on stream next month and will it will reduce the inward for all 37 Mail Centres.

3. Can sprinter vans be used to accelerate the work.

4. The anticipated impact from taking flights out will be that mail centres will be dispatching 95% of work to Delivery units by circa 5.40 but the remaining 5% will not be ready for dispatch until after 08.00. The aim will be to review whether more work be advanced to increase the 95% and reduce the 5%.

5. In addition the amount on the final wave in delivery units may be mitigated by having a sweeper delivery service instead of moving the whole delivery units start times back.

6. Royal Mail are not taking out until 2025 the Inverness and Exeter flights which have the biggest impact and they may decide that these cannot be removed.

We have the start times now for the up to 3 hours , the up to 90 mins and the up to 60 minutes but we want to meet Royal Mail first as these have been done exclusively by Royal Mail without union involvement and we want to understand some anomalies from the modelling in which some units start and finish times were better under the up to 3 hour modelling compared to the up to 60 minutes model.

Remember the modelling has been done based on

A Wednesday and based on your main DDS duty on a Wednesday

The headlines on up to 60 minutes based on actual finish times are :

There are 1252 Delivery Units

330 will finish before 14.59
798 will finish before 15.30
1145 will finish before 16.00

Just 106 units will finish after 16.00 totalling 3872 walks.

The aim over the next few months is to try and better this position.

However a no vote won’t mean Royal Mail just go back to flying mail over the main land.

The reason is

Flying is 6 times the impact on CO2 emissions to road and rail.

Flying is 8 times more the cost

Flying is 13 times worse on quality of service as Royal Mail don’t own planes they hire them in advance and have no in put in to air traffic delays etc.

Plus when traffic is higher they cannot suddenly hire more planes and of course the growth in parcels is based on a better carbon footprint.


Royal Mail wanted the cheaper up to 3 hours model. Now for 93% of units it will be less than 60 minutes change.

[redlen]

The obvious thorn sticking in my side is how can anybody vote on something that is not set in stone and open to future interpretation and changes not in the original proposal?

Agreements, by design, have to give certainty and responsibilities on both parties to that agreement.

Previous agreements have had more holes in them than the Titanic. This negotiators' agreement is no different and ripe to be abused.

How can any union man/woman ever consider this as they doom it to failure like previous agreements following the same scenario?

And talking of planes

What about Northern Ireland?

[LouBarlow]

The obvious thorn sticking in my side is how can anybody vote on something that is not set in stone and open to future interpretation and changes not in the original proposal?

Agreements, by design, have to give certainty and responsibilities on both parties to that agreement.

Previous agreements have had more holes in them than the Titanic. This negotiators' agreement is no different and ripe to be abused.

How can any union man/woman ever consider this as they doom it to failure like previous agreements following the same scenario?

And talking of planes

What about Northern Ireland?

That is a valid opinion but not a reason to vote against the deal. As Martin says, these changes are coming in regardless of the result of the vote. At least with an agreement you have union involvement and some degree of mitigation.

[scotchy1962]

The obvious thorn sticking in my side is how can anybody vote on something that is not set in stone and open to future interpretation and changes not in the original proposal?

Agreements, by design, have to give certainty and responsibilities on both parties to that agreement.

Previous agreements have had more holes in them than the Titanic. This negotiators' agreement is no different and ripe to be abused.

How can any union man/woman ever consider this as they doom it to failure like previous agreements following the same scenario?

And talking of planes

What about Northern Ireland?

That is a valid opinion but not a reason to vote against the deal. As Martin says, these changes are coming in regardless of the result of the vote. At least with an agreement you have union involvement and some degree of mitigation.

Ah Lou and Red, Slymans two errant children, for once i agree with Len you cant vote on a agreement not etched in stone, you would think the CWU would have learned that unless its fully shown how it will work, not "we will have a look after", it leaves it open to interpreting it whatever way they like. You know we are right and yet you go ahead with it.
Get the process in writing on paper to even consider it. And even then i dont think i would trust them.
Also true what about Northern Ireland how will us ones over here be affected, is it all coming over by boat?