Thompson wins

[chickenwittle]

Hate to say it but Thompson has achieved everything he set out to do, all changes implemented by EA, he has he union split in two, he appears to have backed them into a corner with the threats of stopping senior reps paid release and stopping subs coming direct out of our wages (both of which are magically now not happening) and before anyone defends this by saying it’s self preservation, the unions role is to protect and fight for its members rights not their personal interests. As hated as he may be, well played mr Thompson, mission accomplished

Although I get your sentiment I don’t agree, Thompson and co set out to get rid of CWU from the workplace. They have not done that YET.

It’s a CWU that now has zero power or influence anymore, which is as good as getting rid of them.

[timbo1234]

But u will all vote yes like numpties and that will be it

Are you for real? You're not involved in this dispute so it does not affect you. How dare you call people who have a different view to you - somebody who no longer works for RM - numpties. Ignorant, childish post from a bigoted individual who just likes to sit back and stir things up . You need to get out more.

[FilthyBloke]

Hate to say it but Thompson has achieved everything he set out to do, all changes implemented by EA, he has he union split in two, he appears to have backed them into a corner with the threats of stopping senior reps paid release and stopping subs coming direct out of our wages (both of which are magically now not happening) and before anyone defends this by saying it’s self preservation, the unions role is to protect and fight for its members rights not their personal interests. As hated as he may be, well played mr Thompson, mission accomplished

Although I get your sentiment I don’t agree, Thompson and co set out to get rid of CWU from the workplace. They have not done that YET.

It’s a CWU that now has zero power or influence anymore, which is as good as getting rid of them.

The reps I see all have their heads down….
I think ST has won in a sense. A lot of people on here are suggesting that we will have a high turnover of staff now and when you know you are not at a company long you probably won’t join a union. I think the numbers of members will be a lot lower in 3/4 years than they are now.
Royal Mail were just more efficient during this dispute. The CWU has the catchy slogans and the parliamentary victory but the real battles were lost because of hesitancy and incompetence.

[clashcityrocker]

.... but the real battles were lost because of hesitancy and incompetence.

The real battle was lost years ago when we were privatised.
Our civil service terms and conditions were never going to survive the harsh reality of a private company.

Our T&Cs are less now but they are still pretty good.

[Seymour Buts]

From what I know and have seen of Mr Thompson you give him far too much credit. It’s the unions mass incompetence and inability to capitalise and get us a reward on the pandemic profits combined with Royal Mails incompetence that’s brought this about.

A child could see the covid boom wasn’t going to last to forever.

What more could the union have done, seriously? We were out for 18 days, costing most of us about 1500 quid at probably the worst economic time in most of our lifetimes. Yes, the messaging was ridiculous at times. A 'No strings payrise' was never going to happen, and I doubt has ever happened. The company in exchange for increased wages are always gonna want that money back in terms of productivity so it's self funding.

[Seymour Buts]

.... but the real battles were lost because of hesitancy and incompetence.

The real battle was lost years ago when we were privatised.
Our civil service terms and conditions were never going to survive the harsh reality of a private company.

Our T&Cs are less now but they are still pretty good.

This. The reality is if you're funded by the government money is literally limitless so you're gonna have better terms.

[cobrakai]

From what I know and have seen of Mr Thompson you give him far too much credit. It’s the unions mass incompetence and inability to capitalise and get us a reward on the pandemic profits combined with Royal Mails incompetence that’s brought this about.

A child could see the covid boom wasn’t going to last to forever.

What more could the union have done, seriously? We were out for 18 days, costing most of us about 1500 quid at probably the worst economic time in most of our lifetimes. Yes, the messaging was ridiculous at times. A 'No strings payrise' was never going to happen, and I doubt has ever happened. The company in exchange for increased wages are always gonna want that money back in terms of productivity so it's self funding.

Cancelling rolling strikes due to incompetence was one major failure, the rumoured invalid strike ballots due to people leaving another. 18 days spread out so haphazardly that there was so little disruption that it was losing wages for no reason.

No strings was never happening. More change for more pay was parroted all the time even though it flew in the face of a legally binding agreement that was perfectly fine. Now we have very little terms left including the upcoming destruction of the sick terms.

The job/company has been ruined by ineptitude.

[clashcityrocker]

Now we have very little terms left including the upcoming destruction of the sick terms.

Destruction of the sick terms? Destruction?
Can you give us examples of other companies who have more generous terms?
And try to avoid the hyperbole.

[enskied]

From what I know and have seen of Mr Thompson you give him far too much credit. It’s the unions mass incompetence and inability to capitalise and get us a reward on the pandemic profits combined with Royal Mails incompetence that’s brought this about.

A child could see the covid boom wasn’t going to last to forever.

Don't think it was the COVID boom, for 10 years or so the CWU has allowed RM to systematically understaff or under resource offices across the land. There have practically no full time duties, all filled with PT cover and not a challenge.

RM could see how complacent the union executive had become, but as long as they were alright. No look where they are.

[sindba]

Now we have very little terms left including the upcoming destruction of the sick terms.

Destruction of the sick terms? Destruction?
Can you give us examples of other companies who have more generous terms?
And try to avoid the hyperbole.

6 shortish absences in 3 years can get you dismissed. In an intensely physical job.

That alone should have been enough to for the CWU to throw this "deal" in the bin.

[rambo1]

LOL, thought this was a thread about an 80's pop band

[Splappy_McSplap]

It’s a CWU that now has zero power or influence anymore, which is as good as getting rid of them.

How would the last 12 months have gone if there was no union?

[clashcityrocker]

6 shortish absences in 3 years can get you dismissed. In an intensely physical job.

In the past 20 years I have seen 2 people dismissed under the Attendance Procedure (1 reinstated on appeal)
It is hardly draconian.

What is on the table is less than it was, but it is far from being the destruction of our terms.
Which company for you has the gold star for sick policy?

[cobrakai]

Now we have very little terms left including the upcoming destruction of the sick terms.

Destruction of the sick terms? Destruction?
Can you give us examples of other companies who have more generous terms?
And try to avoid the hyperbole.

Destruction is probably a bit hyperbolic. I know of people that have long term issues that usually mean 1/2 absences a year at present the business as any employer would treats them with the dignity they deserve through terms and conditions earned by decades of trade unionism. In one shonky agreement they are suddenly going to be punished for being ill with the bare minimum ssp. This will save the company millions of pounds it’s nothing to do with the well-being of staff.

Other companies, I know of many massive companies that offer the same don’t think of Royal Mail as been the gold standard. In fact I was told the other day that only 7 percent of major uk companies use the statutory sick pay rule.

[sindba]

6 shortish absences in 3 years can get you dismissed. In an intensely physical job.

In the past 20 years I have seen 2 people dismissed under the Attendance Procedure (1 reinstated on appeal)
It is hardly draconian.

What is on the table is less than it was, but it is far from being the destruction of our terms.
Which company for you has the gold star for sick policy?

"Don't worry, your rep will get you off your stage 3". Not good enough.

No modern company has a policy whereby 6 short (i.e. self-cert) absences in 3 years can get you dismissed. With full agreement of the Union ffs!

I'm not counting backwards places like Amazon or the gig economy. Unless that's what the CWU aspires to?

And can the CWU explain why it was necessary to agree this in order to save Royal Mail from administration? Maybe they have just become completely detached from the harsh realities faced by the shop floor, so they didn't think it was important?