Talks have ended - no agreement : Added RM's improved offer to 1st post

[daveyeff]

I’m absolutely gobsmacked people think this is an ok deal. Come back on here in December after you have delivered your last letter in the dark for a below inflation pay rise and your £1500 bribe has been spent and tell us all how good this deal is. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg, where’s the info on sick pay, annualised hours, pda big brother conduct technology, the apparent plan to have Mail centres do IPS/indoor prep thus increasing outdoor delivery times AGAIN?!
It can be argued this deal is actually worse than the deal offered before Xmas, weeks of talks and Ward has managed to bargain us a Worse deal. It’s incredible.

Ward hasn't bargained it, it's their offer. Ward couldn't/wouldn't agree to it. That's why there is no deal.

[TopperGas]

Move to a more flexible seasonal working pattern & half four finish, not for me, get those strike date announced, start with a week

Pretty certain the CWU have already agreed those changes?

[postiewhite]

I'd vote for the £1500 plus a 15% over 3yrs backdated from April 22 (with the short fall backdated on top)but keep the last letter no later than 3.30. Better conditions for new starters.
Pay alone, are the union looking for something better than this?

[sindba]

I don't care about last letter time.

I care about the pay and conditions i get for delivering the bloody things.

Every day we get more and more workload, more and more management harassment, for less and less pay, and they want us to accept that crap for a few weeks wages lump sum? F**k you Royal Mail.

[Sbutts8182]

4:30 last letter is still a gone 5 finish, so 60-90 minutes is bullshit.

[Mikeb99]

With EA already taking place and an apparent end to talks, could the business just bring in all these proposals without agreement? And if so could/would they also just give us the proposed pay rise without CWU agreement just like they did with the 2% last year?
This would effectively de-recognise the union and just plough on with their business plan.
I’m not suggesting I approve of this possibility, just wondering if it could happen.

[Edward Hunter]

If thats the best bits,god help us when the reality and bad parts are properly revealed by the union.Administration here we come.

[redlen]

With EA already taking place and an apparent end to talks, could the business just bring in all these proposals without agreement? And if so could/would they also just give us the proposed pay rise without CWU agreement just like they did with the 2% last year?
This would effectively de-recognise the union and just plough on with their business plan.
I’m not suggesting I approve of this possibility, just wondering if it could happen.

It looks to me how Royal Mail are using justification with Executive action and no objections from the CWU?

It is anticipated the financial results will show a loss in the financial year of between 350-450 million as well as a million a day.

They are using the financial security of the business to bypass the process of collective bargaining.

Because of the Pay Ballot the CWU are unable to go to court for breach of contract as the law does not officially recognize collective bargained agreements unless expressly implied as legally binding.

[TopperGas]

Individual employees can still take RM to court if they attempt to change their sick pay etc without their prior agreement, otherwise employment contracts would be pointless.

[redlen]

Royal Mail sick pay is a contractual obligation with implied terms in excess of statutory provision

Statutory sick pay is an express term and believe about £100 a week and nothing for the first three days
Royal Mail can justify any changes with business reasons for the proposed changes on financial grounds for the survival of the business, the same with reducing Ill Health Retirement entitlements.
But looking then at Fire and Rehire on a different contract.

But in reality the Golden Carrot is offered

[dembz90]

Wait until you hear how the union outline the proposed deal on their live update tomorrow, rather than believing everything Thompsons offer said today. I know which one I’ll believe. Some folk need to wake up, these people are not to be trusted. Don’t be easily swayed by the 1500 bribe they are dangling on a fishing rod. It’s tough, but we deserve better and there’s 100% more to that proposed offer from the company today. Solidarity.

[redlen]

Solidarity means nothing in the cold hard world of business.

If Royal Mail can justify the financial security of the business is in jeopardy, Fire and Rehire on sub standard contracts of employment is a real possibility.

British Gas
TESCO
British Airways

They will do this prior to any notion of an administrator being appointed to run the company. If that happens new contracts are an almost certainty as the biggest cost negative is in its wage bill.

[k979aaa]

Solidarity means nothing in the cold hard world of business.

If Royal Mail can justify the financial security of the business is in jeopardy, Fire and Rehire on sub standard contracts of employment is a real possibility.

British Gas
TESCO
British Airways

They will do this prior to any notion of an administrator being appointed to run the company. If that happens new contracts are an almost certainty as the biggest cost negative is in its wage bill.

At the top would make the most difference start with the ones who caused it all and ban them from being directors or CEO or Chairman well do you feel lucky?

[datasaint]

Solidarity means nothing in the cold hard world of business.

If Royal Mail can justify the financial security of the business is in jeopardy, Fire and Rehire on sub standard contracts of employment is a real possibility.

British Gas
TESCO
British Airways

They will do this prior to any notion of an administrator being appointed to run the company. If that happens new contracts are an almost certainty as the biggest cost negative is in its wage bill.

ST said on workplace some time ago 'fire and rehire' wouldn't happen, whatever that's worth.

[needadvice]

Love the way Managers have been "Getting the message out"!

Don't normally give a shite about letting you know anything .... unless it's the RM Message.

Rumour has it Managers have been encouraged to get that message out and push for peer pressure (from Posties) to get the CWU to put it to a vote. Probably because they know a large number of Posties are so short sighted that they'd sell a kidney for a quick £500 bonus.

I'm no maths genius but 10% over 3 years looks like just over 3% a year? Is that meant to be a good deal? I don't bloody think so!

5k lump sum should probably seal the deal