An alternative view

[Martin Walsh]

I fully realise there is frustration out there , especially as some revisions have been imposed and the adherence to the joint statement is patchy to say the least.

There is a thirst for communications and updates but ACAS and in this case Sir Brendan Barber ask both parties to refrain from discussing the details and progress of the negotiations. The principle is nothing is agreed until everything is agreed.

There has been ample criticism of the latest update that talks will continue for a few more days. Instead the cry by many is we should be calling action whilst others are saying we are going to sell them out.

However you have not had the information that the Postal Executive have had and remember the postal executive have not been shy calling strike dates we have had 18 actual dates with a further 8 stood down either with the Queen’s Death or due to legal challenges.

So why have we made the decision to allow for a few more days to reach an agreement?

1. Whilst the joint statement has had its problems , there has been a pause on executive action reported across all 10 Divisions.

2. We have a commitment to an independent review into all conduct cases of reps and members in the dispute and talks are progressing on how that works and the independent body which will deal with this.

3. If we walked away from talks now and served action do you think both of the above will still be on the table ?

4. We have made progress on a range of issues in talks including later starts , pipeline , seasonal variations removing annualised hours , Sundays , new entrants , pay and other issues enough for us to give the talks a few more days to see if they can conclude an agreement. There are still challenges to overcome.

5. Whilst I recognise a lot on here are very defensive if you mention that the company has serious financial issues and of course it is there fault. However what if they do go the same way as Lehman Brothers or Woolworths or the hundreds of other companies which end up not be a going concern ? I am sure all of you would blame the CWU if we did not try to reach the right agreement to prevent this.

6. The CWU are not going to roll over and surrender. We want an agreement which provides a decent pay rise with good terms and conditions.

7. If we can’t get one in the next few days then we will be left with no choice but call for industrial action and this time we will be rolling the dice knowing the risks in line with point 5.

It will be make or brake over the next few days. So whilst I fully understand the frustration we would love to update you on issues but we would be breaching the confidentiality and protocols of the negotiations.

[POSTPERSON50]

I fully realise there is frustration out there , especially as some revisions have been imposed and the adherence to the joint statement is patchy to say the least.

There is a thirst for communications and updates but ACAS and in this case Sir Brendan Barber ask both parties to refrain from discussing the details and progress of the negotiations. The principle is nothing is agreed until everything is agreed.

There has been ample criticism of the latest update that talks will continue for a few more days. Instead the cry by many is we should be calling action whilst others are saying we are going to sell them out.

However you have not had the information that the Postal Executive have had and remember the postal executive have not been shy calling strike dates we have had 18 actual dates with a further 8 stood down either with the Queen’s Death or due to legal challenges.

So why have we made the decision to allow for a few more days to reach an agreement?

1. Whilst the joint statement has had its problems , there has been a pause on executive action reported across all 10 Divisions.

2. We have a commitment to an independent review into all conduct cases of reps and members in the dispute and talks are progressing on how that works and the independent body which will deal with this.

3. If we walked away from talks now and served action do you think both of the above will still be on the table ?

4. We have made progress on a range of issues in talks including later starts , pipeline , seasonal variations removing annualised hours , Sundays , new entrants , pay and other issues enough for us to give the talks a few more days to see if they can conclude an agreement. There are still challenges to overcome.

5. Whilst I recognise a lot on here are very defensive if you mention that the company has serious financial issues and of course it is there fault. However what if they do go the same way as Lehman Brothers or Woolworths or the hundreds of other companies which end up not be a going concern ? I am sure all of you would blame the CWU if we did not try to reach the right agreement to prevent this.

6. The CWU are not going to roll over and surrender. We want an agreement which provides a decent pay rise with good terms and conditions.

7. If we can’t get one in the next few days then we will be left with no choice but call for industrial action and this time we will be rolling the dice knowing the risks in line with point 5.

It will be make or brake over the next few days. So whilst I fully understand the frustration we would love to update you on issues but we would be breaching the confidentiality and protocols of the negotiations.

'It will be make or brake over the next few days. So whilst I fully understand the frustration we would love to update you on issues but we would be breaching the confidentiality and protocols of the negotiations.'

Martin, the CWU needed to explain that situation instead of the continuing radio silence the members have received.

Communicate. Members have already withdrawn their subscription.

[claystones]

Thanks for the update Martin i just hope we are not going to cave into Royal Mail and take everything they throw at us just because they are pleading poverty through no fault of ours, they are the ones who have emptied there bank accounts and are still continuing to pay managers bonuses for failed revisions so we have to reach an agreement that doesn,t impact on there finances i fear these talks could go on for weeks

[Jb1969]

Whilst I except most of your points are valid the following points are not.
The USO is being failed on a daily basis, the term “the mail must get through” has been replaced with “the mail cannot get through”
Pride in the job is almost non-existent, the members have given up with unacceptable & achievable work loads.
Distribution Networks are running around in 7.5 tonne trucks that are 20 years old, most cannot run a full rota of duties on a daily basis as are Delivery.
We are not providing a service anymore, it’s an asset stripping agenda, one that provides for the shareholders & the board rather than the customers.
I understand that these points are not at the top for the CWU but they where for most of us.

[smok3y666]

Pause on EA? Carrying on in our office.

[Schiff]

3. If we walked away from talks now and served action do you think both of the above will still be on the table ?

Giving notice for strike action in a fortnight's time, which would be called off if a deal was reached beforehand, would concentrate minds on both sides to try to reach an agreement.

We are currently pissing away the ballot result instructing the union to take strike action. With the last strike day taking place in December last year it will, after this further extension for talks, be at least April before we can take further action against RM. The first ballot was completely wasted, at a huge cost to the CWU members, with pointless one or two day strikes. The union was not professional enough to gather the data to allow rolling functional strike action.

I don't care a jot if RM are losing money and go under. If they can't run their business in a way that they can pay their bills (including the pay bill increasing with inflation) then they deserve to go under, however if city analysts believed that this was a likely prospect then I doubt that they would be recommending that people either buy RM stock, or at least hold on to the stock that they have.

Currently, there is almost as much anger towards the incompetent CWU leadership as there is towards the cowboys running RM into the ground. Time for the union to demonstrate that someone actually has a clue about how to get a good settlement for their members, or many of those members are going to decide that their union subs look very poor value for money.

[scoobydo79]

Thank You Martin.The problem I have is We are dealing with someone who has been proven to be a liar and untrustworthy yet is supported by RM. We abide by the rules while they continue to do what they want

[lostinspace]

I fully realise there is frustration out there , especially as some revisions have been imposed and the adherence to the joint statement is patchy to say the least.

There is a thirst for communications and updates but ACAS and in this case Sir Brendan Barber ask both parties to refrain from discussing the details and progress of the negotiations. The principle is nothing is agreed until everything is agreed.

There has been ample criticism of the latest update that talks will continue for a few more days. Instead the cry by many is we should be calling action whilst others are saying we are going to sell them out.

However you have not had the information that the Postal Executive have had and remember the postal executive have not been shy calling strike dates we have had 18 actual dates with a further 8 stood down either with the Queen’s Death or due to legal challenges.

So why have we made the decision to allow for a few more days to reach an agreement?

1. Whilst the joint statement has had its problems , there has been a pause on executive action reported across all 10 Divisions.

2. We have a commitment to an independent review into all conduct cases of reps and members in the dispute and talks are progressing on how that works and the independent body which will deal with this.

3. If we walked away from talks now and served action do you think both of the above will still be on the table ?

4. We have made progress on a range of issues in talks including later starts , pipeline , seasonal variations removing annualised hours , Sundays , new entrants , pay and other issues enough for us to give the talks a few more days to see if they can conclude an agreement. There are still challenges to overcome.

5. Whilst I recognise a lot on here are very defensive if you mention that the company has serious financial issues and of course it is there fault. However what if they do go the same way as Lehman Brothers or Woolworths or the hundreds of other companies which end up not be a going concern ? I am sure all of you would blame the CWU if we did not try to reach the right agreement to prevent this.

6. The CWU are not going to roll over and surrender. We want an agreement which provides a decent pay rise with good terms and conditions.

7. If we can’t get one in the next few days then we will be left with no choice but call for industrial action and this time we will be rolling the dice knowing the risks in line with point 5.

It will be make or brake over the next few days. So whilst I fully understand the frustration we would love to update you on issues but we would be breaching the confidentiality and protocols of the negotiations.

Common sense

[SpacePhoenix]

1. Whilst the joint statement has had its problems , there has been a pause on executive action reported across all 10 Divisions.

The joint statement wasn't worth the paper it was printed on

[ANDREW CROCOMBE]

A pause ? Wrong. Later starts ? Wrong. They are in from 7a.m to 930 for the rural duties - 430 finish in our office. No new entrants allowed. No more 3 day week shared duties. More agency staff than ever. Yep patience is the key right, no doubt the MC's are having duties/times altered which annoys people. Going very well isnt it.

[datasaint]

Verdi the union representing German postal workers threatened an open-ended strike, and won their dispute without ever taking a day off.

Why hasn't the CWU taken a bolder approach to all this. If we'd gone out indefinitely at the start the company would have bowed to media/public/government pressure. There would have been no postal service which would have hopefully made people reflect on the importance of it.

Sadly these intermittent strikes have only served to weaken the company's finances so they can use that argument against the CWU. At this point more striking would just be an own goal. The strategy hasn't worked.

[parforthewalk]

Given Martins post & the current critical financial situation the company is stating, it seems reasonable to conclude that it's only a matter of (short) time that the company calls in the adminstrators

The deal or so called agreement between the RM & CWU would therefore be effectively null & void.

A New owner (perhaps Amazon could make a successful bid) will ensue & with it new T&C's, take it or leave it or fire/rehire scenario will most certainly apply.

RM is just playing for time (reading between the lines) & the new financial year is also imminent.

I think everyone in the workforce inc managers should now be very worried

[Bob Cooney]

Pont 3 ?

Ceasefire on executive action is by your own admission patchy and you forget that the JS has turned executive action into a ridiculous shared aspiration to tick box revisions over the line in a matter of days and they cant even be arsed adhering to that and to agree those timescales goes against what the likes of D.Glebocki said in a review of the previous agreed revision process

The second point is not even on the table as only a commitment to an independent review with no date or organisation named

[Mazdaman]

Managers have no need whatsoever to be worried. They can't do enough for a manager. They roll out the red carpet.

[SpacePhoenix]

& the current critical financial situation the company is stating,

Have the accounts been INDEPENDENTLY AUDITED? If they haven't I'm afraid I've got to call bullshit on the supposed "current critical financial situation"