Thompson - New agreement sent to CWU

[worktotime]

get the bbqs out and see you thursday simon ( team ) thompson ,

[k979aaa]

I stopped reading when you said the union should have embraced royal mails changes at the start, brilliant, try selling that to your members as a union, unbelievable.

The CWU have always embraced change - single daily delivery, mail centre closures, collections on delivery.
The leadership of the CWU constantly bang on about how prepared they are for change.

In the words of Paul Young - Everything Must Change.

Oh the singer his hair did not change nor has the illusion of R/M is losing £1 billion a year Bollocks and bullshit got to you yet we need change yes of leadership of the Royal Mail!

[Murdoch]

So will it end in fire and rehire?

Unfortunately, I think it's being setup for that (as a last resort), yepp.

Prepare for your tribunal cases.

[k979aaa]

So will it end in fire and rehire?

Unfortunately, I think it's being setup for that (as a last resort), yepp.

Prepare for your tribunal cases.

That is why we are in a UNION so we take a class action with the funds in the Union!

[TheTrolleyMan]

[k979aaa]

Merry Xmas Simon I hope you get what you deserve

P45 in the post!

[chickenwittle]

It’s not rocket science is it , members don’t want Sunday working, later starts , worse sick pay , annualised hours etc.I can’t tell you one person in my office happy to accept this so the union have your backing to fight in all these issues.

If those are the red lines they are working with, then there's no prospect of any deal. We won't accept any changes to any of those things!

It's way more nuanced than that, there are degrees of change within all of those things you listed.

If there genuinely is no chance of members embracing any change. Then there's no solution to this.

I never said they were red lines but they are major issues that the union need to keep chipping away at and as I understand it they have already made progress in some but not yet enough.

[Schiff]

Any member not happy can vote against such a deal - but they should also accept if majority vote for such a deal.

If the majority vote for a deal then everyone else has to accept it, but I don't see how they are going to get a majority voting for any deal.

I, and others, won't vote ourselves a real terms pay cut.

Some will vote against any later start and finish times and delivering in the dark.

Some will vote against annualised hours.

Some will vote against any commitment to deliver.

Some will vote against much longer walks.

Some will vote against zero pay for sick absence.

Some will vote against the end of ill health retirement.

Some will vote against increased owner drivers.

Some will vote against new starters being shafted as that will weaken our position going forward.

Some I know are simply bloody minded and never ever vote in favour of any pay agreement.

So many people have their own personal red lines here that I can't see how we will ever get a majority agreeing to any deal while the current CEO remains in place. Strikes will simply become "business as usual" for RM under this failing management team and their prized parcel customers will continue to migrate to other couriers as RM simply can't be relied upon to deliver.

[qwerty2]

Think ST is panicking now
reckon he's been told to get a deal by next strike date or he's out on his arse

[Mungeys]

I think we need to remember that striking at Christmas is a nightmare scenario for Thompson, he's managed to make people think he doesn't care whether it happens or not but behind the facade he'll be sh*tting it.

His tactics are predictable, that "if you strike then we stop the talks" should tell you everything, December strikes are a disaster for him. He met the shareholders yesterday and has a board meeting on Monday, is he really going to go into that telling the board not to worry about the strikes, at the companies busiest time of year and in the month that makes them the most money? He might act as if he doesn't care what happens but he'll be aware that the shareholders and the board won't just sit back and let him run the company into the ground because he's too stubborn to make a deal.

If he doesn't give us a good deal before the strike day then call his bluff, tell him there's no more room for discussion from the unions side as they've made their red lines clear, and all strikes are going ahead until a better deal is offered.

[sixfoottwo]

Think ST is panicking now
reckon he's been told to get a deal by next strike date or he's out on his arse

I agree, this latest 'agreement' which will be pants by the way makes absolutely zero sense coming now after 1.5 weeks of intense talks, he's had a dressing down by the board here and has just thrown this out there in more hope than expectation.

See you on the picket line

[Murdoch]

It’s not rocket science is it , members don’t want Sunday working, later starts , worse sick pay , annualised hours etc.I can’t tell you one person in my office happy to accept this so the union have your backing to fight in all these issues.

If those are the red lines they are working with, then there's no prospect of any deal. We won't accept any changes to any of those things!

It's way more nuanced than that, there are degrees of change within all of those things you listed.

If there genuinely is no chance of members embracing any change. Then there's no solution to this.

I never said they were red lines but they are major issues that the union need to keep chipping away at and as I understand it they have already made progress in some but not yet enough.

So we are in agreement that all of those things are up for negotiation.

With a bit of mitigation, the Union could get accept those and get them past the members? Cause that's what they need to do to reach an agreement.

So hopefully it's just brinkmanship, and a deal is closer than it appears. But it all comes back to, I'd like to see the agreement currently on the table.

[Gasman11]

I think we need to remember that striking at Christmas is a nightmare scenario for Thompson, he's managed to make people think he doesn't care whether it happens or not but behind the facade he'll be sh*tting it.

His tactics are predictable, that "if you strike then we stop the talks" should tell you everything, December strikes are a disaster for him. He met the shareholders yesterday and has a board meeting on Monday, is he really going to go into that telling the board not to worry about the strikes, at the companies busiest time of year and in the month that makes them the most money? He might act as if he doesn't care what happens but he'll be aware that the shareholders and the board won't just sit back and let him run the company into the ground because he's too stubborn to make a deal.

If he doesn't give us a good deal before the strike day then call his bluff, tell him there's no more room for discussion from the unions side as they've made their red lines clear, and all strikes are going ahead until a better deal is offered.

[k979aaa]

It’s not rocket science is it , members don’t want Sunday working, later starts , worse sick pay , annualised hours etc.I can’t tell you one person in my office happy to accept this so the union have your backing to fight in all these issues.

If those are the red lines they are working with, then there's no prospect of any deal. We won't accept any changes to any of those things!

It's way more nuanced than that, there are degrees of change within all of those things you listed.

If there genuinely is no chance of members embracing any change. Then there's no solution to this.

I never said they were red lines but they are major issues that the union need to keep chipping away at and as I understand it they have already made progress in some but not yet enough.

We do have red lines but with you and I keep chipping away we all can make that difference in a deal at the end of a day it is us all who vote for a deal and us all who accepted the terms of the ballot! I Stand by my union the CWU !

[chickenwittle]

It’s not rocket science is it , members don’t want Sunday working, later starts , worse sick pay , annualised hours etc.I can’t tell you one person in my office happy to accept this so the union have your backing to fight in all these issues.

If those are the red lines they are working with, then there's no prospect of any deal. We won't accept any changes to any of those things!

It's way more nuanced than that, there are degrees of change within all of those things you listed.

If there genuinely is no chance of members embracing any change. Then there's no solution to this.

I never said they were red lines but they are major issues that the union need to keep chipping away at and as I understand it they have already made progress in some but not yet enough.

So we are in agreement that all of those things are up for negotiation.

With a bit of mitigation, the Union could get accept those and get them past the members? Cause that's what they need to do to reach an agreement.

So hopefully it's just brinkmanship, and a deal is closer than it appears. But it all comes back to, I'd like to see the agreement currently on the table.

Everything is up for negotiations, it’s about how much realistically the union can fight off , they have already said they don’t see Sunday being an issue, that could be managed by volunteers and new recruits on new contracts. They have said there’s been movement in start times but not yet enough.