workshops and menu options

[realmichael]

the ballot should start once the workshops are completed ! not before.

and if it is true that not every member will be sent a copy of the agreement, that is nothing short of a disgrace

[dvbuk55]

the ballot should start once the workshops are completed ! not before.

and if it is true that not every member will be sent a copy of the agreement, that is nothing short of a disgrace

If you have any concerns dingo will put you right - you don't need to read the bad bits - just vote YES

Now that the ballot is in full flow guess who has popped out of the woodwork again.

I say lets wait until he gets bored with this topic and starts another.

[belle smith]

The workshop on geo route is also important as the 2008 model has reduced the walking speed and increased the time for attendance calls ( ie packets , reg etc ) however when this has been overlayed on previous geo route revisions its shows that other planning values have been increased which will need to be anaylised. In additon the call rate calculator needs to be reviewed.

Dingo any chance you could expand on this?

Maybe i'm reading it wrong (or sceptically) but that sounds an awfull lot like the the time given at each drop (7 secounds) has been reduced, cancelling out any gain from the drop in walkspeed.

Do you know the new walkspeed, if so are you able to say??

[pickaname]

All this talk about 'confusing' planning values isnt going to stop people tearing around and going home early.

If you make the walks managable, fliers will carve them up. If you make them bigger so the fliers dont finish early, the rest will cut off.

Such is the nature of the job...some people are simply quicker than others.

[belle smith]

All this talk about 'confusing' planning values isnt going to stop people tearing around and going home early.

If you make the walks managable, fliers will carve them up. If you make them bigger so the fliers dont finish early, the rest will cut off.

Such is the nature of the job...some people are simply quicker than others.

if they are 2 in a van and going back to the office the managers shouldn't let them leave early.

[Martin Walsh]

the ballot should start once the workshops are completed ! not before.

and if it is true that not every member will be sent a copy of the agreement, that is nothing short of a disgrace

I know Branch`s who have copied the agreement and given to members in their Branch`s and are simply left in the canteen. If a member wants a copy then thy should contact their Branch who should be able to get them a copy. There will be comms sent by the union including an executive summary of the agreement.

Now in terms of the agreement the agreement was never going to mean that you got a vote on the planning values of the various tools as you can forget about 90 pages long you would be looking at planning values of a thousand pages. The agreement is quite clear that these planning values will be worked up jointly , modelled and areas of concern will be tested in a live enviorment.

Regarding geo route the actual system is not a problem as it is widely used in Europe and Canada. However if the planning values have been designed un realistically then you have a problem. For instance Geo route 2008 has reduced walking speeds increased attendance rates ( different from call rate ) which should have meant more time given to an offiice but a few offices who have used this system has found that managment have reduced times for walking down paths or delivering to high rise blocks etc in order to comphensate for the reduction of walking speeds.

The union will be able to ensure that all of these planning values are tested and if neccesary test in an office.

The union has never had this opportunity to agree realistic standards. Remember BSI is a recognised standard of working throughout industry and ACAS have wrote the guidelines and remember someone can only work at 100 BSI if they have the right equipment , a full head of work and are fully motivated. Being bullied into working 100BS1 is not a motivation and with acas overseeing this process would not be acceptable.

The other method which needs to be trialled is that some offices recive far more redirections in an office then others and far more dead letters and others and equally some walks have a single slot per address and some have two or three addressess per slot which all require different planning values.

So if the union sent out every single planning value for every possible situration do you really think most would understand what applies to them.

The process is for the union to agree that the planning values are either fair or need to be tested to prove their not fair.

I really do think some of you believe that planning values should all be the same , well clearly if you said that everyone had to sort at 800 items per hour then you would have to understand whether the mix of mail for each office was the same as flats and packets have a lower planning value then letters and of course some do have a secondary sorting ( a further sortation ) or if an office has alpha.

Equally you cannot have one prep rate as the prep includes clearing in and if your a small office you only have maybe 10 or 20 frames to clear in from whereas if your in a big office you might have an hundred frames to clear in from.

So they will be diferent planning values for different siturations , but once they are fair they can be applied to suit an office.

[Danelectro]

So if the union sent out every single planning value for every possible situration do you really think most would understand what applies to them.

Yes,with good clear graphics and a well written guide and the rep given support to answer any queries,then i cant see why anybody could not understand how the workload for their own office is calculated.

[drb]

I remember when we(shamefully) voted to be a delivery best practice office.We thought it would slow the buggers down! How wrong we were! Pre-interim they would finish their walks AND absorb 6 walks!! Stupid b******s.

Anyway...I digress....

The business sold as this geo-route package as..."Make all walks equal"

There is no such thing! 1 walk was tested 3 times and still ran over!!

WE NEED to be part of the planning

WE NEED to sort the parameters out

WE NEED for BSi to include stress and fatigue NOT based on a business plan

WE NEED ACAS involved in the workshop process

[realmichael]

i reiterate my point that this should have all been squared away before the vote, why rush now?

and as for saying most would not understand what applies to them. well well well!!!!!!!!

will we mere reps be able to understand?

"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough."
Albert Einstein

[fishtank]

"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough."
Albert Einstein

And if they don't understand it,we are all screwed.
Fishtank

[drb]

And if they don't understand it,we are all screwed.

Yep!!!

[dvbuk55]

The new understanding will be those famous six words

"Hang on we didn't mean that"

[fishtank]

The new understanding will be those famous six words

"Hang on we didn't mean that"

And you will reach for the agreement and say "It states quite clearly.........awww bugger"

[drb]

And you will reach for the agreement and say "It states quite clearly.........awww bugger"