Sick/holiday pay based on average hours not contracted

Sir Henry · Post by **Sir Henry** » 26 May 2018, 21:38

There are a few of us that have been wondering what we should do ( if anything is at all possible) to start the ball rolling re that little understood or mentioned ruling that holiday/sick pay should be paid at the rate of an average of hours worked over the last three months rather than a flat week. I think I read that the union would take this on a case per case basis but so far enquiries have lead to nothing. If anyone could fill us in on the facts and maybe proffer suggestions as to what we need to do please?
Thanks.

Alantidey · Post by **Alantidey** » 27 May 2018, 05:12

This does seem incredibly unfair to only pay contracted hours whilst on holiday or off sick. With an average weekly overtime of 12 hours, it’s a real struggle to adapt to my contracted 25 hours when off on holiday / sick. Been with Royal Mail for just under 2 years and only once have I ever done my contracted 5 hours a day.

Sir Henry · Post by **Sir Henry** » 27 May 2018, 20:50

Anyone?

Creditshampoo · Post by **Creditshampoo** » 27 May 2018, 21:28

If you put a grievance in it will be added to the thousands they already have in a pile.
You can take it further yourself but you’ll need to exhaust the grievance procedure first, then contact ACAS.
Take notes from now, what you’re on, how many hours a day you’re doing etc which will all help.

The CWU are meant to be sorting this....they’ve been saying it for years though haven’t they

Driver74 · Post by **Driver74** » 27 May 2018, 21:45

Don’t think they are ever going to pay your average overtime when on sick legally they could get a way with statutory sick pay if they wanted

Celgar · Post by **Celgar** » 28 May 2018, 13:50

I agree that if you are contracted for example 25 hours but the duty you have takes 39 hours then you should be made up to 39 hours duty time permanently. RM effectively gets work done on the cheap in the current scenario as the overtime rate is about 5% under what we get paid normally per hour. At one time overtime would be 'time & a half' but those days are gone. When Cameron was PM a while back he tried to make Sunday an ordinary working day in terms of pay rates but he had to back down on that one.
I very much doubt you will get your current overtime taken into consideration where amount of holiday leave is concerned. RM promise stuff such as getting more Saturdays off when you want them in the previous agreement. That isn't possible to do especially considering the skeleton staffing levels they like to deploy.

Creditshampoo · Post by **Creditshampoo** » 28 May 2018, 14:00

Could be considered as unfair treatment if you’re working safe hours as full timers but being treated differently

NewPostieUK · Post by **NewPostieUK** » 28 May 2018, 17:57

I'm on a 30 hr contract and work no overtime. My mate is on a 30 hr contract and works 5 or 6 hrs a week overtime. It is his choice to work overtime. .

Why should he get more sick pay or holiday pay than me? It's called overtime for a reason.

I'm just looking at it from a different perspective.

I absolutely and utterly agree that where part timers are working regular overtime then hrs need to be put into that office, and better contacts offered to part timers on a seniority basis. However that is a totally different issue.

The Postman · Post by **The Postman** » 28 May 2018, 18:45

NewPostieUK wrote:I'm on a 30 hr contract and work no overtime. My mate is on a 30 hr contract and works 5 or 6 hrs a week overtime. It is his choice to work overtime. .

Why should he get more sick pay or holiday pay than me? It's called overtime for a reason.

I'm just looking at it from a different perspective.

I absolutely and utterly agree that where part timers are working regular overtime then hrs need to be put into that office, and better contacts offered to part timers on a seniority basis. However that is a totally different issue.

He should get it because he earned it.

Creditshampoo · Post by **Creditshampoo** » 28 May 2018, 18:51

The Postman wrote:
NewPostieUK wrote:I'm on a 30 hr contract and work no overtime. My mate is on a 30 hr contract and works 5 or 6 hrs a week overtime. It is his choice to work overtime. .

Why should he get more sick pay or holiday pay than me? It's called overtime for a reason.

I'm just looking at it from a different perspective.

I absolutely and utterly agree that where part timers are working regular overtime then hrs need to be put into that office, and better contacts offered to part timers on a seniority basis. However that is a totally different issue.
He should get it because he earned it.

1-0

NewPostieUK · Post by **NewPostieUK** » 29 May 2018, 01:19

The Postman wrote:
NewPostieUK wrote:I'm on a 30 hr contract and work no overtime. My mate is on a 30 hr contract and works 5 or 6 hrs a week overtime. It is his choice to work overtime. .

Why should he get more sick pay or holiday pay than me? It's called overtime for a reason.

I'm just looking at it from a different perspective.

I absolutely and utterly agree that where part timers are working regular overtime then hrs need to be put into that office, and better contacts offered to part timers on a seniority basis. However that is a totally different issue.
He should get it because he earned it.

He was paid for the hours he worked. I don't see what that has to do with holiday or sick pay.

Post by **rogersh** » 29 May 2018, 09:12

NewPostieUK wrote:
The Postman wrote:
NewPostieUK wrote:I'm on a 30 hr contract and work no overtime. My mate is on a 30 hr contract and works 5 or 6 hrs a week overtime. It is his choice to work overtime. .

Why should he get more sick pay or holiday pay than me? It's called overtime for a reason.

I'm just looking at it from a different perspective.

I absolutely and utterly agree that where part timers are working regular overtime then hrs need to be put into that office, and better contacts offered to part timers on a seniority basis. However that is a totally different issue.
He should get it because he earned it.
He was paid for the hours he worked. I don't see what that has to do with holiday or sick pay.

EAT rules that voluntary overtime should be included in holiday pay
1st August 2017

https://www.employeebenefits.co.uk/issu ... -pay-case/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

fishtank · Post by **fishtank** » 29 May 2018, 10:11

As an aside to this there may be further complications for Royal Mail along the line.
These legal decisions relate to statutory holiday allocation. At the moment that stands at 28 days, Royal Mail's current basic allocation is only 22.5 days with the deficit from the legal minimum made up from bank holiday allocation.

If it finally shakes down that the business will have to pay an average of hours worked during annual leave they'll also have to do the same with bank holidays.

datasaint · Post by **datasaint** » 02 Jun 2018, 10:29

The union completely glossed over this massive issue affecting all PTers in the recent negotiations, one reason I voted no.

albebb · Post by **albebb** » 07 Jun 2018, 18:43

fishtank wrote:As an aside to this there may be further complications for Royal Mail along the line.
These legal decisions relate to statutory holiday allocation. At the moment that stands at 28 days, Royal Mail's current basic allocation is only 22.5 days with the deficit from the legal minimum made up from bank holiday allocation.

If it finally shakes down that the business will have to pay an average of hours worked during annual leave they'll also have to do the same with bank holidays.

the ruling only applies to the European statutory minimum of 20days( 4weeks) not the British legal statutory minimum of 28days 5.6weeks