constructive dismissal

[pete72]

Please could you help as i am looking for a little advice. I have worked for Royal mail for the last 14 years of which the last 4 years were spent as a deputy manager. I was accused of sexual harassment by a postwoman as i had sent her 5 flirtatious texts. I was suspended as straight away pending investigation. My manager asked the union rep for the office to support/defend her and i had someone who i did not know come in and defend me, I felt absolutely ill at the time so tried to go sick but was told by union rep that the investigation would still continue.At the same time as this was ongoing my oldest child was in hospital with severe pneumonia so i did not feel able to go on after being found guilty by the investigation manager so i resigned before the conduct interview, i was also being told by my line manager that things were not looking good as my DSM was going to do the conduct interview. This was all blown out of proportion and i wasn't even given a chance to explain to the complainant, also i have read the bullying and harassment procedure and it states that both of us should be represented by people outside the unit but she was not is this a breach of process and could i win my case by going to tribunal.

pete72

Posts: 0
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 7:33 am

[TrueBlueTerrier]

I doubt an ET would deem it as constructive dismissal as there was a "reasonable" breach of the guidelines - if indeed there was. If she was claiming sexual harassment, then this is an emotive subject and it should be treated sensitively. Part of that would be, in my opinion, to allow her to be represented by someone she knew and trusted rather than a stranger because of the embarrassment she may feel over the matter.

Also as far as I know, the investigation has to be someone independent of the 2 people but both can be supported and/or represented by a work colleague or Union Rep (CWU/CMA).

However, I have to say that even though you think the "flirtatious texts" have been blown out of proportion, the ET would look at RMs actions and see if they were reasonable. If they had not investigated her claim this probably would have been seen as unreasonable if the postwoman had started any ET action, so they had to investigate it.

If you didn't send the texts then your only option at an ET is show that RM acted unreasonably, but from the little you have posted I can't see where they have acted unreasonably, even to you. The rep was correct in that the investigation would continue and in the end they would have to make a ruling, you going sick, no matter how genuine, would only delay the outcome, it wouldn't stop it altogether.

If you did send the texts then it perhaps shows a lack of judgement which the ET would have to take into account. Looking at it from an independent standpoint they would have to decide if RM suspending you immediately, or on finding there is a case to answer then proceeding with the conduct process was unreasonable . Your biggest problem in this scenario is that you as an acting manager could be seen as to have acted unprofessionally by sending an employee under your control/stewardship inappropriate texts, even if she was a willing recipient proving that RMs actions were unreasonable would be difficult indeed.

[flaminmoses]

that wont be constructive dismissal.

normally you will have to have been treated bad enough to have to quit.

just being investigated wont be that.

[andy2007]

Well, this is a very difficult one, because it's such a serious issue: alleged sexual harrasment. At any point before it became a conduct issue, did the Postwoman tell you that she felt the texts were inappropriate. Whether by text, personally, or via a 3rd party?
If not, that should help your case.

However. Even if you get your job back, it would still have to be dealt with as a conduct issue. Because even if you didn't intent to distress the Postwoman, the fact is that you must have done, for her to take the matter this far. But that doesn't justify the way you've been treated. Everyone is entitled to defend themselves in conduct cases, and if you're genuinely ill. Even if it's as a result of the case. You should be given time to recover, before the case continues. Obviously, they can and indeed should, continue to collect evidence in your absence. But until you're fit to defend yourself, that's as far as it should go.

[pete72]

No she did not make her feelings known to me at any point but even txt me back answers which played along with my txt so she was ok with the txt until she could not get her own way and stay on a certain shift pattern which she blamed me for

[fishtank]

You compromised your position as a manager through your own stupidity by following the thing between your legs rather than the thing between your ears.
Even if i was to believe the well worn "she led me on" story which i'm not convinced by, Royal Mail could make a case for sacking you purely through incompetence.
The last thing this business needs is more immature managers.
If this seems a bit harsh that's because it's supposed to be,sometimes you need someone to tell you straight,don't waste your time or money on solicitors,it's very unlikely you will find one that will touch your case anyway.
Move on,find yourself another job and....grow up.

[dvbuk55]

Well petey it looks like you took on the mantle of management only too well. It's a fact of life that business and pleasure don't mix - as a matter of interest the only number in my phone related to work is the rep and the manager.............it may suggest I have no friends, which is true, but work is work and social life has no business intruding.

[andy2007]

No she did not make her feelings known to me at any point but even txt me back answers which played along with my txt so she was ok with the txt until she could not get her own way and stay on a certain shift pattern which she blamed me for

As Fishtank pointed out. Even if she led you on, you'll still end up with a disciplinary. But it IS a mitigating factor, so I can't see how they could justify you loosing your job (unless you have a bad disciplinary record already). The problem with texts, emails, etc., is that they can so easily be misinterpreted. I know it's too late in this case, but I'd strongly advise you to flirt in person in future, to avoid further problems. Good luck.

[dvbuk55]

No she did not make her feelings known to me at any point but even txt me back answers which played along with my txt so she was ok with the txt until she could not get her own way and stay on a certain shift pattern which she blamed me for

Whatever - the simple fact is that you shouldn't have sent the texts at all because there is no defence to the evidence she has clearly kept on her phone. If you feel you have been badly done by and you are suggesting that she used those texts to try to influence her duty structure then use that at an appeal - to say she was ok with the texts and replied, well, she may have felt that because of your position she was obliged to reply.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Now I have passed on my advice can I just say that this incident is indicative of the level of training Royal Mail mangers get, whether they are managerial entrants or from the shop floor. Lesson Number 1 in any managerial course, or even just for being in charge of people is:

1. Do not enter into anything with your subordinates that may deemed inappropriate - and being in any way flirtatious with someone under your control must be near the top of the list.

Lesson Number 2

2. Do not leave yourself open to claims of favouritism and treat all staff in the same manner - even if you were not treating this colleague any different than others, you certainly either gave her an opportunity to attempt to influence you, or use the evidence of the texts against you. She would also be in a difficult position if she was receptive to the texts then she could be accused of using her feminine wiles to get treatment, if she wasn't then she would be afraid of being treated more harshly by you - really her only course of action was to report you.

I am afraid your lack of judgement, not helped by the level of training in Royal Mail, brought this on yourself, and you have no one to blame but you. I am sorry if that's harsh, but some things can't be sugar coated.