Talks adjourned

jackdaw · Post by **jackdaw** » 17 Oct 2007, 12:46

I want to know as much as anybody and seeing as the majority of us have given up our pay and our time (and will continue to do so if needs be) is waiting another few days really such a bad thing. We have been caught out before by cleverly worded deals. I would prefer PEC to make the right decision rather than a quick one.

catch · Post by **catch** » 17 Oct 2007, 12:58

jackdaw wrote:I want to know as much as anybody and seeing as the majority of us have given up our pay and our time (and will continue to do so if needs be) is waiting another few days really such a bad thing.

It is for those in Liverpool and Leeds not getting paid while the PEC drags their feet.

Post by **dvbuk55** » 17 Oct 2007, 13:00

jackdaw wrote:I want to know as much as anybody and seeing as the majority of us have given up our pay and our time (and will continue to do so if needs be) is waiting another few days really such a bad thing. We have been caught out before by cleverly worded deals. I would prefer PEC to make the right decision rather than a quick one.

The timing doesn't really matter. If the negotiating team need the PEC to take two days to amend the agreement what does that tell you? Here we have the unions senior officers with years of experience relying on the PEC to correct their mistakes. How quickly after the injunction came agreement. Was it rushed and a consequent lack of detail - of course it was. Someone mentioned the Way Forward agreement which was also rushed BUT at least we were getting paid for it.

jackdaw · Post by **jackdaw** » 17 Oct 2007, 13:04

While the wildcat strikes are being seen by some as being strong and having solidarity in truth they are getting us very bad publicity. If they stayed in work, worked to rule stringently and did everything by the book until PEC decided we would be far better off.

QUESTION- If we accept the deal and it is voted in by a majority of us, say 60%, will those who disagree and still strike be seen as being right?

catch · Post by **catch** » 17 Oct 2007, 13:11

Any strike will get you bad publicity (if any) in the media - that's what the media are there for (although I've seen at least two sympathetic articles towards the wildcats in local sources).

The question is who's "better off" if they're quietly back to work. The people on strike or the full-timers who's competence is being increasingly called into question? Pensions, flexibility - these are far more important issues than whether the CWU leadership looks 'reasonable' to a load of small business owners (who tend to be the only 'public' who get interviewed). You have a massive amount of support from the rest of us workers who are facing the same attacks at the moment, but in most cases are less equipped to fight them. If there's a close vote (on a low turnout?) that sells out the pensions and the other strings then yes the minority will have been right.

Post by **dvbuk55** » 17 Oct 2007, 13:12

jackdaw wrote:While the wildcat strikes are being seen by some as being strong and having solidarity in truth they are getting us very bad publicity. If they stayed in work, worked to rule stringently and did everything by the book until PEC decided we would be far better off.

QUESTION- If we accept the deal and it is voted in by a majority of us, say 60%, will those who disagree and still strike be seen as being right?

They say there is no such thing as bad publicity. And it is time the PEC had the balls to say it is a bum deal. Unless there has been a major shift in the clauses and a firm and universal agreement on flexibility there isn't a cat in hells chance this is going through.

jackdaw · Post by **jackdaw** » 17 Oct 2007, 13:19

catch wrote: If there's a close vote (on a low turnout?) that sells out the pensions and the other strings then yes the minority will have been right.

This is so important that if people can't be bothered to vote they don't deserve a say. It's all our futures at risk here, people can whinge all they like but when the vote comes stand up and be counted, if you don't and then say you disagree with the outcome then tough luck.

max_gain · Post by **max_gain** » 17 Oct 2007, 19:35

Screw what the public think. We must look after ourselves.
We will be the ones working below minimum wage, crap pension, never knowing what we are doing from one minute to the next if these two cnuts get ther own way for the future. And I mean the long term, not just next year or the year after.

The public wont care as long as their amazon cds (which we will probably be delivering through DSA for nothing) are delivered. They dont care about what we do everyday and how much effort goes into their delivery.
This is about us, and we must think about number 1