glasgow meeting

[Tamsky]

The last time a proposed deal got a no vote (The Way Forward) the architect lost his job in the subsequent election. Rather more than just a pay cut.

The response today to what happens if it's a no vote was the leaderships feeling that this would worry Royal Mail more than the CWU.

[stevie247]

But a huge issue is trust and we are being asked to trust RM with no history of RM respecting it's workers.

Already in our office, where hardly anybody has read the 'agreement' let alone voted on it, we have our DOM who has issued us all with sheets to fill instating the number of our gaps over the next week to get a call rate.
When asked today why we were not allowed to count at least 20% of D2D'S we were told that we will have a max of 4 and we can throw them off on a Monday and only take where we are going so not to interfere with the call rate.

Apart from the fact that most of us take the full 5 days to do 3 D2D'S at the moment as we haven't got the time, what annoys me is that he is doing this before we have even voted or read the agreement. How many more offices are effected this way?

Sure we have no rep, but you would have thought RM would have told their DOM'S to have more sense and at least pretend they have changed until after the vote.

I have emailed the CWU anyway and they did reply saying the weren't happy with that and would get hold of the Area Rep for South Wales.

See straight away the agreement has'nt even been voted on yet/been accepted yet the doms are still using their sly tactics or harrassing workers if you like, yet RM have said thier will be less heavy handed approach from managment, f***ing lies again, and they want you to accept the deal?? proves they cant be trusted.

Everyone of the reps who have now been miraculously converted to a yes vote NEED to read the above post trust is the key and management aint trustworthy.

[DirtyHarry]

and just out of curiosity how much are Dave and co losing in the next 2 years?

Members by the shed load, leaving the CWU a complete irrelevance to people like Higson, Tolhurst, and whichever criminal follows on after Crozier.

[Green Army]

and just out of curiosity how much are Dave and co losing in the next 2 years?

Members by the shed load, leaving the CWU a complete irrelevance to people like Higson, Tolhurst, and whichever criminal follows on after Crozier.

if you all leave the union you wont get a vote on your future that does not make any since change from within the union you wont change it from outside !

[DirtyHarry]

and just out of curiosity how much are Dave and co losing in the next 2 years?

Members by the shed load, leaving the CWU a complete irrelevance to people like Higson, Tolhurst, and whichever criminal follows on after Crozier.

if you all leave the union you wont get a vote on your future that does not make any since change from within the union you wont change it from outside !

Mate, most of the very senior people in the union, the people who have made the union what it is today, are so entrenched in their positions, not to mention that those directly below them will be no less beholden to RM for their positions anyway, that there isn't enough time left in my working life to make it worth my while. Besides, with making Saturday a normal working day, throwing away the cap on D2D crap, the stress workers will be under due to the shift in performance goalposts, and the deep and meaningful relationship the CWU will have with the scum who run RM, the damage will have been done.

[Danelectro]

It's hardly fair to say there was only one dissenting voice at the meeting today. There was a healthy debate over the future job. Almost all questions from the floor were to clarify aspects of the Agreement - this is the stage we are at.
I doubt if any reps have had members meetings on the Agreement so are not yet aware of all members feelings. As I see it we were there to gather accurate information and point out pitfalls.

The audience were the reps who represent workers in delivery who took up to 17 days, and more, industrial action in 2009, including several days unofficial action in response to management bullying, and in support of a strong national union with the industrial strength to enforce local deals. We will have to justify that support when presenting the deal to members.

It has to be said that most of the criticism from the floor concerned whether RM managers can be relied on to implement the Agreement as outlined by Leadership.

I only heard one cry of sell out over later Saturdays.

D2D presentation was impressive but cannot hide the loss of earnings involved for most delivery workers in the central belt who deliver 3 a week.

A pay cut in return for industrial action is no good.

Was there no mention of why H&S has been left wide open to abuse in the agreement? ie no max delivery span,no national performance standards,workloads(what is the average amount of letters in a tray?),workshops that lead to local agreement on walk speeds/pegusus? etc.

All these issues are as clear as shite in a bottle and as other on here have said, we are voting on the words in the agreement not some HQ spin.

My mate was at meeting and we had prepared some questions on the above.Ill find out tomorrow what he thought

[spilie]

Funny how some of these posters have all been to meet billy an dave and have had a complete change of mind into voting yes eh?? Yet are all new posters to the forum


Surely RM or the CWU would'nt stoop this low would they

was thinking the same thing, so many converts and i heard some of them couldnt even walk till they met dave and the gang and then they threw thier crutches away fuc*ing miracle

[laudrup11]

A pay cut in return for industrial action is no good.

Was there no mention of why H&S has been left wide open to abuse in the agreement? ie no max delivery span,no national performance standards,workloads(what is the average amount of letters in a tray?),workshops that lead to local agreement on walk speeds/pegusus? etc.

All these issues are as clear as shite in a bottle and as other on here have said, we are voting on the words in the agreement not some HQ spin.

My mate was at meeting and we had prepared some questions on the above.Ill find out tomorrow what he thought

There will be workshops on IWT and Georoute with full CWU involvement.
If you've read my previous posts i'm not a big fan of the agreement, especially Saturdays, but one thing it does contain is CWU involvement throughout the revisions process.

[ashadd]

just back from a meeting in glasgow with dave ward and bob gibson, what a fantastic presentation bob gibson gave, I went in there with a closed mind, that this deal was a bad deal for posties, but boy did I get a wake up call, d2d into workload saves f/t jobs when mail volumes are declining globally, fact, d2d could cease in a few years, we could lose them to TNT etc etc, this deal gaurantees money into basic pay, we will be at the forefront of change now, not having it imposed, managers have to toe the line, they cannot behave like they use to, of all the people in the hall, there was only one desenting voice, I found that quite remarkable, I will be recommending my colleagues to vote yes.

d2d COULD cease, COULD lose them to tnt," managers having to toe the line,"(like why would they start now) FFS you fell for this bollox......pigs COULD FLY and wolves COULD win the premier league ....i dont think so

[Danelectro]

A pay cut in return for industrial action is no good.

Was there no mention of why H&S has been left wide open to abuse in the agreement? ie no max delivery span,no national performance standards,workloads(what is the average amount of letters in a tray?),workshops that lead to local agreement on walk speeds/pegusus? etc.

All these issues are as clear as shite in a bottle and as other on here have said, we are voting on the words in the agreement not some HQ spin.

My mate was at meeting and we had prepared some questions on the above.Ill find out tomorrow what he thought

There will be workshops on IWT and Georoute with full CWU involvement.
If you've read my previous posts i'm not a big fan of the agreement, especially Saturdays, but one thing it does contain is CWU involvement throughout the revisions process.

My point is why is the walkspeed in geo route not been independently reviewed by experts and a national speed set?? or has it?? I cant see how me having a workshop with my DOM-who lets face it is a c***t ,is going to produce some locally agreed speed.

[jobies]

How many of the reps at today's meetig actually work a Saturday ???

My rep doesn't and neither does my manager .Will this change in new agreement ? Why should people with regular Saturday off keep them and not go through the turmoil the rest of us are going to go through.


We have at least 8 people in my office who are going to leave if this gets voted in !!!!


VOTE NO

[seanocelt]

threw away their crutches!!!!!!!!!!! funniest post in a while haw haw

[brunswick]

dave says tnt could end up getting d2d contracts,so whats that going to do,we already deliver what they get now, personally for me they can have them all as it's only a matter of time before they get them through privatisation. dave and co gave a great presentation and received applause,throughout this topic i see no mention ofthe pension situation or indeed a figure enlightening us as to the number of jobs that will need to go.finally am i correct in thinking that our brothers in london even though they don't deliver d2d due to unrelliability will see an added increase in their basic pay of £20+or will d2d payments still be shown as a seperate item?

[clashcityrocker]

or indeed a figure enlightening us as to the number of jobs that will need to go

I thought I heard him say quite clearly - 24 000 jobs will go over 3 years. 12 000 by evr and 12 000 by natural wastage.

[Postmania]

As usual the world ends a few miles over the Border...

I pay YOU Mr Ward & Co to look after my interests. This entails that YOU communicate to me and collegues and work on our behalf. Have you ever been further North than Glasgow????..or is it to tiring for you to bother. Surrely my CWU contributions over 25 yrs would have covered the cost???

Should the CWU get a Yes vote they will be cutting there own throats as the majority of delivery postmen will leave the CWU which is exactly what RM would like. ( A de-unionised business)

Having been a member of the CWU for 25Yrs+ I will be one of those,

The CWU has systematically have failed to protect my terms and conditions for a generation.

Who in there right mind votes for a Pay cut, increase in workload, longer deliveries spans, later finises, longer Saturday attendancies, loss of retained allowance and a failure to protect my Final Salary Pension Fund.

I invested approx £3750 in todays money into the CWU in that 25yrs. On top of this I Supported the Union when asked and threw that earnings away too..and for what? I would have been considerably wiser to have invested this money in trying to bolster what remains of my Pension so I can retire through choice and not from likely imminent 'forced retirement' from the cumulative damage from overuse of my Joints.

Without the Postman on the street you have nothing

Lets just say I'm some what F£$%"D OFF with being taken for a ride by both RM and the CWU