Customer saying they haven't received Tracked I delivered

The Postman · Post by **The Postman** » 10 May 2017, 15:00

TrueBlueTerrier wrote:Correct on the Special Delivery.

Everything else is potentially a Conductable offence. You can only leave items in a safe place if the customer has nominated it ( and I would take a photo of the packet and where you put it), a glass bin is not a secure place so posties shouldn't be using them without the sender's consent. Signing for customers recorded item is essentially fraud. Fraud by pretending to be someone you are not, or by saying you handed it over to the customer (or their representative) when you didn't.

That's what I gathered about signed for. However, I have also been advised by some customers where to leave their parcel if they are not in. Surprise, surprise they said glass bin. Does the item have to be marked 'safeplace' if the customer has given me instructions verbally?

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 10 May 2017, 15:03

Officially - Yes you can only leave in a safe place if designated as such on the parcel, or there is an official instruction to do so. A residents verbal request is not an official instruction.

Now you know the official line, its up to you whether you want to take the risk or not. Don't forget you can always try the neighbours.

Dexydog · Post by **Dexydog** » 10 May 2017, 15:05

Having read all of this post I think from now on everything is coming back.
At the moment if it isn't a special/recorded/tracked/international sign, I try and leave in a safe place out of sight and card the customer to let them know.
However what if I put the card through "parcel in greenhouse", and they ring and say it isn't there, that's me buggered for trying to help a customer.
Royal Mail want you to try 2 neighbours- to me that's no better than leaving anywhere else, out of sight or not- if they say they didn't take it (how do you know if they don't get on with next door), that's another can of worms.
The whole question of what's right or wrong is open to interpretation so back it comes from now on.
Which is a shame because now the customer will have to collect a 2 quid phone case which I could quite reasonably have left under a plant pot.

telithowitis · Post by **telithowitis** » 10 May 2017, 17:50

Just goes to show what a total farce RM is. DOMs asking office to improve on 98% 1st time delivery date, but if it goes wrong your will be hung out to dry.
I'm going to go by the book having read this. I guess I will bring back 50% of packets I take out as I deliver to an area where most people are employed. ( often they have notes on their door asking you where to leave parcels- but no good now). Going by the book will probably mean 30-45 minutes overtime per day.
Why can't RM with the new PDA,S have registered safe places come up against the address on the pda when the packet is scanned to protect them and their employees (us)from complaints.
My guess is they won't because anyone who runs around and does anything the manager asks will never have a problem with this , but anyone who refuses savings or cuts because there is insufficient time to complete their delivery, often because endless new addresses have been added, may be persued and treated very differently to the DOMs favourites!

Postie45 · Post by **Postie45** » 10 May 2017, 18:44

to the last 2 posters - good decision, leaving stuff may have gone well for you up till now, and in most cases it will, but it just takes 1 person to lie, or someone to see you leaving something and then steal it and then its you whos in the wrong.

Ive heard that items can be left if the customer puts it in writing and its logged with your manager. I dont know how legit that is, but basically its a waiver if something does go missing it is then the customers fault.

South_London_Postie · Post by **South_London_Postie** » 10 May 2017, 19:29

Postie 45 "Ive heard that items can be left if the customer puts it in writing and its logged with your manager. I dont know how legit that is"

WRONG.

Royal Mail has a contract with the sender of the Mail not the recipient. Only the sender can authorise and nominate that the parcel is left in a safe place NO ONE else. Do not get involved and bring the parcels back to the office.

steve1873 · Post by **steve1873** » 10 May 2017, 22:15

ArthurPewty wrote:It's all b*****ks and here's why:
If what he's done is wrong fair enough, BUT this also means that you cannot deliver ANY mail into an unlocked porch.
So at each address that has a letter box in the porch door you must try the porch door, if it's locked post the mail. If it's open, and there's a letter box on the main door - post the mail through that.
If there isn't a letter box in the main door, then as per a parcel you have to knock the door. If they answer, hand over the mail explaining the porch is not secure to receive mail. If there's no answer then endorse it as 'insecure delivery' and take it back. Result = you only get round 1/4 of the round and take back about a third of the mail that you've attempted delivery of, plus the other 3/4 of the round that you haven't had time to do.
And for that reason, it's complete b*****ks that doesn't stand up in any way to logical examination

Wrong. A door is always assumed to be locked and secured, therefore posting mail through a letterbox on a porch door is deemed to have been delivered securely to the address. If you have to open a door to deliver any item inside, then you now know that the location is insecure.

Orinoko · Post by **Orinoko** » 10 May 2017, 23:18

peshwaarinaan wrote:
number one wrote:If you scanned at the doorstep then the GPS on the PDA will back you up.
The GPS shows it being delivered. The van was parked in the street opposite and I must have sent it when I got back to the van.

I thought that the GPS information tells you where the item was scanned, not where the info was sent. Maybe you delivered it to the wrong address in the street opposite.

Post by **woopesh** » 11 May 2017, 09:31

Im also really cautious about damaged envelopes and packaging because I have been accused of stealing from those as well. If there is any chance a packet can catch and tear on the letter box while going in, it gets 739'd.

Better for them to have to go to the sorting office than have accusations of stealing building up on my record.

Damaged parcels eg. some get squashed in the satchel, get taken back to the office and shown to the manager before being put into a damage bag.

peshwaarinaan · Post by **peshwaarinaan** » 11 May 2017, 16:08

Orinoko wrote:
peshwaarinaan wrote:
number one wrote:If you scanned at the doorstep then the GPS on the PDA will back you up.
The GPS shows it being delivered. The van was parked in the street opposite and I must have sent it when I got back to the van.
I thought that the GPS information tells you where the item was scanned, not where the info was sent. Maybe you delivered it to the wrong address in the street opposite.

In that case I must have scanned it when we were driving towards the house. It was definitely delivered to the correct address.

Post by **greengiant** » 11 May 2017, 16:22

What if for example a customer is getting say a broadband router delivered to their new build house, which is currently innaccesible, yet the sales office is currently holding their mail. Do you deliver to the sales office as a "neighbour"? Or as safe place?

It seems odd the pda does not have an option to say "delivered to neighbour", so if the customer is tracking the parcel while they are out, they can see where it has been delivered to.

Clared · Post by **Clared** » 11 May 2017, 16:35

peshwaarinaan wrote:Pulled up by Lino this morning. I delivered a Tracked last Thursday and customer rang yesterday (4 days later.....) dto say they haven't received it.

I clearly remember the item which I left in an enclosed porch.

Lino said DOM and another Lino will be going to see the customer tomorrow and said that if this happens again, action will be taken against me!!!!!! It's the customer's word against mine and from the looks of it, RM will be on the side of the customer. This is the first complaint I've had since I started two years ago.

Can anyone please tell me if this Lino is right? How can this be used against me in future when the customer is clearly trying it on.

Thanks in advance.

1 of the reasons I never leave parcels. Customer not in it comes back ! Unless I know the area really well I would leave it with a neighbour.

Post by **CPTNemoUK** » 11 May 2017, 18:56

telithowitis wrote:Just goes to show what a total farce RM is. DOMs asking office to improve on 98% 1st time delivery rate

our office is only about 87%

Post by **eastie** » 11 May 2017, 19:34

CPTNemoUK wrote:
telithowitis wrote:Just goes to show what a total farce RM is. DOMs asking office to improve on 98% 1st time delivery rate
our office is only about 87%

thats about average, ours used to be in the 90% area but neighbours are starting to get peed off with being the same people knocked up for taking neighbours parcels and now refuse.

Post by **CPTNemoUK** » 11 May 2017, 19:49

eastie wrote:
CPTNemoUK wrote:
telithowitis wrote:Just goes to show what a total farce RM is. DOMs asking office to improve on 98% 1st time delivery rate
our office is only about 87%
thats about average, ours used to be in the 90% area but neighbours are starting to get peed off with being the same people knocked up for taking neighbours parcels and now refuse.

I dont do neighbours anymore. There's not enough hour in the day.