CWU Postal Executive formally rejects Royal Mail Group surrender document

[Binsey]

What started out as a No Strings Pay Claim has turned into a complete s-show.
Woody G warned from Day 1 ST was a totally different type of CEO and this would be a totally different type of dispute.


Where I do think RM are weak is on the local level and people need to really change the habits of a lifetime Local Reps , Divisional & Branches need to step up now…

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

[norris9]

This isn't a serious offer. This is a piss-take.

The CWU said the other day that they were getting somewhere with Royal Mail and nothing the CWU told us is in that list of changes etc that Thompson wants. So why has Thompson backtracked on everything? He's just a troll. There has been no effort from him to make an agreement, he's just been playing a nasty game.

All out in December!

This Thompson dude will have no staff!!!

Good luck trying to replace 100,000+ staff.

I'd rather work in a sweat shop in India.

[norris9]

Something doesn’t add up because Ward and Furey were a lot more positive on progress and RM moving on certain issues during Friday( or was it Thursday? ) nights session

He's literally trolled the Union right in front of ACAS, surely ACAS can see that he's there to play games. Thompson made out to the Union that a 7.5% or possibly a 8% pay rise could be offered.... now it comes out that Simon's backtracked on that and everything else. Is this behaviour allowed at ACAS?

This list is even more draconian than the original list of changes.

[HTPostman]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

[FilthyBloke]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

This just have been done first IMO.

As for the public, I think most of them have other things to worry about right now.

[timbo1234]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

Absolutely spot on. It's doing things exactly by the rule book that would do more damage than one day strikes. Yes it might not be instant but if this action had started 3 months ago the strikes planned at xmas would have caused horrendous backlogs. Instead all backlogs have been cleared by people who don't cross the picket line but then work a 12 hour day for the next week. As long as these people continue to do this it undermines the campaign. If they need the money then have the b***ls to cross the picket line.

[chickenwittle]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

Absolutely spot on. It's doing things exactly by the rule book that would do more damage than one day strikes. Yes it might not be instant but if this action had started 3 months ago the strikes planned at xmas would have caused horrendous backlogs. Instead all backlogs have been cleared by people who don't cross the picket line but then work a 12 hour day for the next week. As long as these people continue to do this it undermines the campaign. If they need the money then have the b***ls to cross the picket line.

Complete nonsense, these people have honoured the strikes the union have called and are fully entitled to make up for that loss of pay through ot and I never do ot myself.

[einastronaut]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

Absolutely spot on. It's doing things exactly by the rule book that would do more damage than one day strikes. Yes it might not be instant but if this action had started 3 months ago the strikes planned at xmas would have caused horrendous backlogs. Instead all backlogs have been cleared by people who don't cross the picket line but then work a 12 hour day for the next week. As long as these people continue to do this it undermines the campaign. If they need the money then have the b***ls to cross the picket line.

Complete nonsense, these people have honoured the strikes the union have called and are fully entitled to make up for that loss of pay through ot and I never do ot myself.

It absolutely isn't nonsense. The purpose of a strike is to withhold labour, that's the entire point. Working days off and doing overtime the rest of the week to make up pay is simply moving that labour, not withholding it. As a consequence, Royal Mail and any customers that might have leant on RM to reach an agreement sooner felt very limited impact from strike action. What wasn't cleared on strike days was then invariably cleared the next. So long as people think this is "complete nonsense", the strikes were, and are, destined to have limited to no effect.

Anyone working OT or their days off on strike weeks should grow a backbone and cross the picket line instead. It's the same thing.

[LouBarlow]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

Absolutely spot on. It's doing things exactly by the rule book that would do more damage than one day strikes. Yes it might not be instant but if this action had started 3 months ago the strikes planned at xmas would have caused horrendous backlogs. Instead all backlogs have been cleared by people who don't cross the picket line but then work a 12 hour day for the next week. As long as these people continue to do this it undermines the campaign. If they need the money then have the b***ls to cross the picket line.

Complete nonsense, these people have honoured the strikes the union have called and are fully entitled to make up for that loss of pay through ot and I never do ot myself.

It absolutely isn't nonsense. The purpose of a strike is to withhold labour, that's the entire point. Working days off and doing overtime the rest of the week to make up pay is simply moving that labour, not withholding it. As a consequence, Royal Mail and any customers that might have leant on RM to reach an agreement sooner felt very limited impact from strike action. What wasn't cleared on strike days was then invariably cleared the next. So long as people think this is "complete nonsense", the strikes were, and are, destined to have limited to no effect.

Anyone working OT or their days off on strike weeks should grow a backbone and cross the picket line instead. It's the same thing.

How about if people work their days off before strike action? How does your moral compass respond to that mr arbiter sir?

[einastronaut]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

Absolutely spot on. It's doing things exactly by the rule book that would do more damage than one day strikes. Yes it might not be instant but if this action had started 3 months ago the strikes planned at xmas would have caused horrendous backlogs. Instead all backlogs have been cleared by people who don't cross the picket line but then work a 12 hour day for the next week. As long as these people continue to do this it undermines the campaign. If they need the money then have the b***ls to cross the picket line.

Complete nonsense, these people have honoured the strikes the union have called and are fully entitled to make up for that loss of pay through ot and I never do ot myself.

It absolutely isn't nonsense. The purpose of a strike is to withhold labour, that's the entire point. Working days off and doing overtime the rest of the week to make up pay is simply moving that labour, not withholding it. As a consequence, Royal Mail and any customers that might have leant on RM to reach an agreement sooner felt very limited impact from strike action. What wasn't cleared on strike days was then invariably cleared the next. So long as people think this is "complete nonsense", the strikes were, and are, destined to have limited to no effect.

Anyone working OT or their days off on strike weeks should grow a backbone and cross the picket line instead. It's the same thing.

How about if people work their days off before strike action? How does your moral compass respond to that mr arbiter sir?

Do what you like pal. It's not anyone's moral compass you need to be worrying about. You're undermining your own strike action. The strikes have limited to no impact if you don't actually withhold labour. If you're happy to both strike, and undermine your own strike in the same week, that's your own folly. Don't complain when the strikes then achieve nothing.

[LouBarlow]

It won’t be won/ lost on a big table in London but in every DO / MC// Distribution function up and down the land.

Exactly. I know I’m living in fantasy land here but a humble postman can dream; just imagine, first thing Monday morning the following happens in every DO:

-Reps start a claim to ACAS for the thousands of members who’ve missed out on holiday pay.
-Everyone told to stop rolling over annual leave (we have a legal right to take annual leave in the current year. Rolling it over into the next year is purely if we agree). Picture the scenes as management have to start planning leave for those who’ve built up weeks of it.
-Everyone starting on time (I know, won’t happen, like I say I’m dreaming!). Take breaks.
-Tie the rounds up exactly how the planners did them. If that means delivering # 1 to 9 of a 10 house cul de sac, going 5 miles away to do another street then having to come back to do # 10 purely because the idiot planners didn’t listen to you, so be it.
-Thorough van checks....mirror slightly loose? Log it off. Crap all over the inside? Log it off. Side door won’t open? Log it off.
-No corners cut. Don’t even read the mail while walking.
-Finish on time.
-The union start a hard hitting campaign, stop with the 4 page long LTBs and long Facebook posts which the general public will skip, keep it short and simple - for example start sharing a picture of 2 yorks, one full of NHS cancer results and birthday cards, condolence cards etc. The other full of boots parcels and a caption ‘only one of these yorks get delivered today. Managers get bonuses if those parcels are delivered.....guess which york gets delivered.’

And that’s before we even get into the possibility of striking for much longer periods.

Absolutely spot on. It's doing things exactly by the rule book that would do more damage than one day strikes. Yes it might not be instant but if this action had started 3 months ago the strikes planned at xmas would have caused horrendous backlogs. Instead all backlogs have been cleared by people who don't cross the picket line but then work a 12 hour day for the next week. As long as these people continue to do this it undermines the campaign. If they need the money then have the b***ls to cross the picket line.

Complete nonsense, these people have honoured the strikes the union have called and are fully entitled to make up for that loss of pay through ot and I never do ot myself.

It absolutely isn't nonsense. The purpose of a strike is to withhold labour, that's the entire point. Working days off and doing overtime the rest of the week to make up pay is simply moving that labour, not withholding it. As a consequence, Royal Mail and any customers that might have leant on RM to reach an agreement sooner felt very limited impact from strike action. What wasn't cleared on strike days was then invariably cleared the next. So long as people think this is "complete nonsense", the strikes were, and are, destined to have limited to no effect.

Anyone working OT or their days off on strike weeks should grow a backbone and cross the picket line instead. It's the same thing.

How about if people work their days off before strike action? How does your moral compass respond to that mr arbiter sir?

Do what you like pal. It's not anyone's moral compass you need to be worrying about. You're undermining your own strike action. The strikes have limited to no impact if you don't actually withhold labour. If you're happy to both strike, and undermine your own strike in the same week, that's your own folly. Don't complain when the strikes then achieve nothing.

Your argument makes no sense if you are doing work before a strike date. You aren’t clearing up anything by your own bizarre rationale.

[redlen]

The Union trying to get members to do the job properly is an illusion. Runners have been ignoring that advice for the last decade and has directly caused this slash and burn current agenda with cutting the job up.

Gold is their God, pure and simple, strike or no strike

[k979aaa]

Well if simon thompson wants a war let's give him a bloody war total war gloves off new ballot ban overtime work to rule and more strike dates!

[Woody Guthrie]

Well if simon thompson wants a war let's give him a bloody war total war gloves off new ballot ban overtime work to rule and more strike dates!

Do you live with your parents?
This isn't a war.
It's an industrial dispute FFS.

[CRIBMAD]

What’s worrying is that ST will have known these conditions will be rejected.
And that the Christmas strikes will go ahead now.
But after that? The leverage the CWU might have right now is that christmas strikes will hit the company hard. But after January offers no leverage at all. So what then?

Is this literally the last hoorah? One final roll of the dice?

ST is aware of this and I have been concerned for some time that he has been willing to sacrifice this Christmas to get what he wants. Plus a lot of posties won’t be able to afford indefinite strikes. The cost of living ain’t coming down.

got to afford to strike or you may as well bend over and take it up the arse ! he will have you working in Victorian conditions - ENJOY !