RMCtv : Zareena Brown : Attendance changes

[Woody Guthrie]

Our annual leave system is ridiculously rigid and one of the reasons short term sick absence has spiked is because we have a recruitment and retention crisis which has not only pushed members into working their day off but also made getting annual leave outside the normal process almost impossible.

So if something unexpected comes up like a wedding or moving house or any kind of personal issue the only option in a lot of cases is pulling a sickie.

If you allowed people 5 gauranteed short notice "personal days" from their annual leave allocation you could reduce the kind of non-genuine sick absence the company talks about dramatically.

The notice period could be 7 days, lIt's pretty common in most businesses.

[denowashere]

Well I for one said it ( the turkey's ) voted for it now there gobbling.

[postslippete]

When a company is being run on the bare bones and is already that short staffed that it has to rely on people continually working their days off for months on end is a pretty poor way to run a company imho

Could the recruitment and retention crisis have anything to do with new recruits being on less pay, terms and conditions?

[Woody Guthrie]

Could the recruitment and retention crisis have anything to do with new recruits being on less pay, terms and conditions?

It probably will play a part in the future but I think it's more a product of societal change, the job market and our out of date bloated recruitment process.

1.Younger people are more comfortable jumping from one job to another, job security isn't guaranteed anywhere so why wait until you're pushed?

2. There is a glut of manual jobs out there paying roughly the same.

3. Most companies now hire first then check references and security, it's a necessary risk. We still expect people to wait around for eight weeks before they get a start date, they mostly won't.

Also training is pretty s**t in this business.
Also they often tell them a pack of lies at the interview stage.

[LouBarlow]

Well I for one said it ( the turkey's ) voted for it now there gobbling.

How do you know that all those stung by this change to the stage process voted for the deal? Also how can you blame the deal for this when it wasn’t even mentioned in it? I definitely saw no indication of the length of stages changing for existing people affected. If you could point out where in the agreement this was stated, that would be helpful.

[Johnrch8]

My stage 1 was due to clear in September. Now Royal Mail has added a further six months due to the changes. I don’t mind the twelve months stages. That’s what we had when I first joined Royal Mail. My argument is that when you sign for a stage you have entered into a contract with Royal Mail. That you agree with the stage and also the system. Which was six months when I signed for the stage. Royal Mail extending everyone’s stages is basically breaking the contract. The union have basically said nothing to do with us, we can’t help

I’m not having a go at the union, especially the local reps who are all very good. They’ve helped out a lot in the past. My rep said that the union tried to get the details out of Royal Mail. But Royal Mail held back all the details and just went live with it. The union was in the dark as we were in the implementation of this. My rep said they should have implemented it like they did last time. Give everyone a clean slate and wipe their sickness and start afresh. There is one bloke whose stage one was due to clear on August the 2nd. He’s absolutely gutted
To be fair they are trying to agree changes with the RM, however, they probably know their hands are tied as if they call for IA as a last resort the majority of staff won't back the call.

[Johnrch8]

My stage 1 was due to clear in September. Now Royal Mail has added a further six months due to the changes. I don’t mind the twelve months stages. That’s what we had when I first joined Royal Mail. My argument is that when you sign for a stage you have entered into a contract with Royal Mail. That you agree with the stage and also the system. Which was six months when I signed for the stage. Royal Mail extending everyone’s stages is basically breaking the contract. The union have basically said nothing to do with us, we can’t help

To be fair they are trying to agree changes with the RM, however, they probably know their hands are tied as if they call for IA as a last resort the majority of staff won't back the call.

[Johnrch8]

I feel sorry for the local union reps. My rep told me that Royal Mail kept them in the dark with the implementation of this. There is one bloke whose stage was to clear on August 2nd. At least I still had a month to run and not one day

[Mr Rush]

If you allowed people 5 gauranteed short notice "personal days" from their annual leave allocation you could reduce the kind of non-genuine sick absence the company talks about dramatically.

A perfectly reasonable point and suggestion - I know many colleagues who have been in that situation regardless of months of advanced notice. However, nothing can be taken at face value. You are positing solutions to problems when the real intention here is to create problems for the company's preferred solutions. We're discussing cutting down a few trees when the company wants the forest gone.

Simon '♪Tell me why - I don't work - Saturdays♪' Thompson

[...] and this is why we are looking at the policy - unfortunately as is so often the case in life - the minority spoil it for the majority

The savings from crushing the genuine majority far exceed whatever could be wrested back from a minority abusing the sickness policy. And bigger than both are all those who had not yet had need for the old policy but would be potential future cases. That surely reduced the outgoings column.

[sixfoottwo]

Re; Attendace + Other Leave

Are there similar changes regarding 'other leave' such as bereavement leave and unpaid leave for carers & etc that anyone knows about?

Hidden in the details?

Does sour 12 days or 3 absences include this or is it just sick leave that has changed?

For any info, thanks in advance.

I'd like to know this too.

I am a carer and currently on a stage 1 but it looks like I am going to need some time off and I will not be sick obviously so was wondering how this would play out?

[funkflex55]

As a reserve even choosing a rest day in advance is an absolute piss take. Despite giving plenty of notice and my reasons for requests being reasonable each time it's been terrible. From the request being ignored to being granted then being put on shift and having to ask to sort it. Last time I had to ask 3 times before getting answer and the time before 4 times. They were both granted but why do I feel like I beg just for a rest day. No wonder people call in sick.

[Clappedoutpostie]

When a company is being run on the bare bones and is already that short staffed that it has to rely on people continually working their days off for months on end is a pretty poor way to run a company imho

It is but members are also to blame for this. There is outrage at our office if the hardcore don’t get in on their day off. There will be melt downs when they finally get the uso reduced and there is no day off to work.

[postieblueshirt]

When a company is being run on the bare bones and is already that short staffed that it has to rely on people continually working their days off for months on end is a pretty poor way to run a company imho

It is but members are also to blame for this. There is outrage at our office if the hardcore don’t get in on their day off. There will be melt downs when they finally get the uso reduced and there is no day off to work.

Opposite in ours lol manager can't get anyone in on there day off you hear him going around asking all you hear is no no nope eh no f*ck off.

[mjd24]

As a reserve even choosing a rest day in advance is an absolute piss take. Despite giving plenty of notice and my reasons for requests being reasonable each time it's been terrible. From the request being ignored to being granted then being put on shift and having to ask to sort it. Last time I had to ask 3 times before getting answer and the time before 4 times. They were both granted but why do I feel like I beg just for a rest day. No wonder people call in sick.

Kick up the biggest fuss you possibly can about this, be as loud and annoying as is possible to be … often thats the only way of getting things to change in Royal Mail

[denowashere]

Well I for one said it ( the turkey's ) voted for it now there gobbling.

How do you know that all those stung by this change to the stage process voted for the deal? Also how can you blame the deal for this when it wasn’t even mentioned in it? I definitely saw no indication of the length of stages changing for existing people affected. If you could point out where in the agreement this was stated, that would be helpful.

Are you really saying (the turkey's) didn't know what they were voting for? they don't give a monkeys about sickness, they just looked at the (great deal 10%) ball's to everything else, the union sorry (joke) just wanted this s**t deal through no matter what, the greedy people have voted (turkey's)I hope they suffer the most.