35 hour contract but told you have to work 38

Pope Marmalade lll · Post by **Pope Marmalade lll** » 13 Oct 2020, 15:29

A bit of a similar dilemma to a previous post. One of our colleagues who has a 35 hour contract has been put on a full time duty (38 hours) this week to cover annual leave. He has said he only wants to work his 35 hours because he has a new baby.
The manager has been putting him under extreme pressure telling him that because he is on a 38 hour duty this week he MUST do 38 hours and anything less would basically be a conduct code.
We've told him that this can't be right and management can't make you work overtime. He is getting the union involved but I just wanted to ask if anyone out there knows where he stands and if there is any legislation/Royal mail policy I can quote/point him towards to back up his case. He was quite upset and feeling pretty much bullied by the manager. Thanks in advance.

number one · Post by **number one** » 13 Oct 2020, 15:41

Let him try and conduct him. He won’t get anywhere with it.

Post by **celtic1967** » 13 Oct 2020, 15:49

There really are some awful managers in RM, probably unemployable as management in any other company

2yearpostie · Post by **2yearpostie** » 13 Oct 2020, 15:50

total load of bollocks, tell him to ask the manager for it in writing then he will do it, if he dont get it in writing he will work 35.

yellowbelly · Post by **yellowbelly** » 13 Oct 2020, 16:23

Have been in this situation, was advised by local rep to inform manager, however (again this is what rep advised me) the manager
was able to insist that I work to the end of duty time but start later than the duty start time and the indoor prep work would be covered by other staff.

If it was not done and it appeared that I was going to go beyond finish time then I would have to use the 'cutting off' procedure -
which I did (as only a token effort was made at the indoor prep). Didn't take out two loops and there was no comeback.

Whether this is the 'official' way of managing this type of situation I've no idea, but this was my experience.

ThatsNotPlumb · Post by **ThatsNotPlumb** » 13 Oct 2020, 16:35

The manager literally doesn't have a leg to stand on & because he's a piece of s**t for even trying to act like he has the power to conduct code someone for only wanting to work their contract hours, I wouldn't be doing him any favours at all for the foreseeable future.

Pope Marmalade lll · Post by **Pope Marmalade lll** » 13 Oct 2020, 16:37

yellowbelly wrote:Have been in this situation, was advised by local rep to inform manager, however (again this is what rep advised me) the manager
was able to insist that I work to the end of duty time but start later than the duty start time and the indoor prep work would be covered by other staff.

If it was not done and it appeared that I was going to go beyond finish time then I would have to use the 'cutting off' procedure -
which I did (as only a token effort was made at the indoor prep). Didn't take out two loops and there was no comeback.

Whether this is the 'official' way of managing this type of situation I've no idea, but this was my experience.

Yes. There was a mention of this so it may be the 'official' way of doing things.

Grumpyoldmailman · Post by **Grumpyoldmailman** » 13 Oct 2020, 16:42

At ours the handful on the new 35 hour contract is paid 3 hours docket every week to bring them inline with the old contracts. I’m not sure if they should be doing that or not. On the original question just come in and your normal start time and make sure you can finish at your correct finish time. Follow the cutting off procedure if not

wallan · Post by **wallan** » 13 Oct 2020, 16:51

Grumpyoldmailman wrote:At ours the handful on the new 35 hour contract is paid 3 hours docket every week to bring them inline with the old contracts. I’m not sure if they should be doing that or not. On the original question just come in and your normal start time and make sure you can finish at your correct finish time. Follow the cutting off procedure if not

Would it not be 3 Hour,s at Single Rate to bring it up to Full Time Hours

Grumpyoldmailman · Post by **Grumpyoldmailman** » 13 Oct 2020, 17:18

wallan wrote:
Grumpyoldmailman wrote:At ours the handful on the new 35 hour contract is paid 3 hours docket every week to bring them inline with the old contracts. I’m not sure if they should be doing that or not. On the original question just come in and your normal start time and make sure you can finish at your correct finish time. Follow the cutting off procedure if not
Would it not be 3 Hour,s at Single Rate to bring it up to Full Time Hours

It’s all single rate upto 38 hours.

wallan · Post by **wallan** » 13 Oct 2020, 17:21

Grumpyoldmailman wrote:
wallan wrote:
Grumpyoldmailman wrote:At ours the handful on the new 35 hour contract is paid 3 hours docket every week to bring them inline with the old contracts. I’m not sure if they should be doing that or not. On the original question just come in and your normal start time and make sure you can finish at your correct finish time. Follow the cutting off procedure if not
Would it not be 3 Hour,s at Single Rate to bring it up to Full Time Hours
It’s all single rate upto 38 hours.

Agree

Pope Marmalade lll · Post by **Pope Marmalade lll** » 14 Oct 2020, 06:40

Thanks for all your help everyone. The union rep has confirmed that RM can not make him work the 38 hours and if they want to change his starting time they have to give 28 days notice. He is feeling much better about things now because of this information and I have passed your comments and help over to him. Again, many thanks.

zipmeister · Post by **zipmeister** » 14 Oct 2020, 07:01

Grumpyoldmailman wrote:At ours the handful on the new 35 hour contract is paid 3 hours docket every week to bring them inline with the old contracts. I’m not sure if they should be doing that or not. On the original question just come in and your normal start time and make sure you can finish at your correct finish time. Follow the cutting off procedure if not

Post by **Murdoch** » 14 Oct 2020, 16:01

I'm surprised Royal Mail allow managers to be this stupid. Lets put this wider issue into context.

Royal Mail do not pay people holiday pay equivalent to average hours worked. As their stance is that any overtime is completely voluntary. This is the loophole they use to argue that they can just pay contractual hours during holidays.

So not only is the manager completely in the wrong. I would suggest if there is a systemic issue of people being forced to work overtime, and I think there probably is. There's an even better case to bring legal action for holiday pay to be paid at an average hours worked rate.

The Union got outplayed with the Shorter Working Week, we were never going to reduce the working hours to 35 hours, anybody with half a brain knew that. So now their priority should be to pressure RM to remove the 35 hour cap from contracts. I would say they should apply pressure to sort the holiday pay issue too, but I've given up hope on that.

yellowbelly · Post by **yellowbelly** » 14 Oct 2020, 17:23

Murdoch wrote:............. I would say they should apply pressure to sort the holiday pay issue too, but I've given up hope on that.

It's in the legal system ie it's gone to a Tribunal Court, so anything CWU say or do is unlikely to have any beneficial effect. We're all cheesed off
that it's taking so long but that's the system we've got and of course Covid hasn't helped in progression of the issue through the court.