The "L" Word

PostmanTwat · Post by **PostmanTwat** » 17 Jul 2018, 16:31

Right guys, some clarification required. What is the official stance on overtime and lapsing? In particular, should an office be lapsing duties and still paying out overtime?

Our office is getting guys in early to prep duties and sort mail/packets. I was under the assumption, there should be zero overtime if duties are being lapsed.

fed_up_postie · Post by **fed_up_postie** » 17 Jul 2018, 16:37

The thing with early morning sorting is the hours comes out of a different budget to the duty overtime/lapsing budget and if managers don't use it they will lose it so a lot of offices still have early morning sorters (coming in an hour or 2 early) so they don't lose the budget hours

Post by **osgoody1970** » 17 Jul 2018, 18:38

no, it cannot be right, that you are lapsing and paying out overtime!!! the two don't add up!!! you lapse, because you have enough time in you duty time to take on extra work, by using overtime, the DOM is telling you, there aint enough time in your day!!!

postslippete · Post by **postslippete** » 17 Jul 2018, 19:02

Its something that constantly baffles me

There are guys who get paid overtime to come in early and do IPS in order to get everyone out on their deliveries earlier so that they can hopefully take out the extra bit of lapse. It seems to be Royal Mail's divide and conquer strategy.

yubin282 · Post by **yubin282** » 17 Jul 2018, 19:19

seems to happen in every office and the CWU do nothing

NewPostieUK · Post by **NewPostieUK** » 17 Jul 2018, 20:35

I struggle to complete most days, so won't take lapsing, and may claim overtime. Other's (usually full timers), finish an hour or two early, so they take their lapsing.

Am example of lapsing and paying overtime.

Presumably this will be looked at with the new PDA actuals stuff but i won't hold my breath.

hans solo · Post by **hans solo** » 17 Jul 2018, 20:50

we should have the part(s) of lapsing agreement in black and white on display
with all the enablers visible
and more specifically the reasons for refusing lapsing
not too hard cwu

worktotime · Post by **worktotime** » 17 Jul 2018, 21:04

Lapsing should only be done if you have time in your contracted hours , it doesn't matter if they pay o/t for the saddos to help him out and claim for it and it will usually be the ones who get finished early that do it , just start on your time , take your break and use the methods ,

Postie45 · Post by **Postie45** » 17 Jul 2018, 21:40

lapsing specifically is there to fill time during "lighter" periods of mail, it makes sense, its just the blanket implementation that is the problem when some duties dont make any time on a typical day and others make an hour or so.

crimson king · Post by **crimson king** » 17 Jul 2018, 21:53

We've now been told to take our lapsing, even though our duty doesn't give us time to do it most days. If we can't complete and have to bring back, we've been told to bring back loops of the duty and NOT the lapsing.

They'll pay us overtime to do it all, but I won't do lapsing in overtime out of principle.

Ringer21 · Post by **Ringer21** » 17 Jul 2018, 22:55

Deals going on allover our office take double lapsing and job done lads are home 1-2 hours before finish time I get back 25 mins before finish time done my lapsing and still get sent back out when the runners are sat at home managers love them union don't want to get involved just keep saying work your hours

Postie45 · Post by **Postie45** » 18 Jul 2018, 14:17

it puts union in a tough spot, i suspect the runners are members too, so the union cant throw them under the bus to management, i believe YOU could do so and raise a grievance about job inequality how effective that would be is questionable and youre risking the runners finding out and you wont be making any friends.
If youre finishing early too and not working having to work past your time then i dont really think you have too much to complain about at a level where you can go to union or managers.

Post by **azza30** » 18 Jul 2018, 16:51

I'm on a 25 hours over 5 days, told beavis and butthead in the office I wasn't taking lapsing but would do it if I returned early before my finishing time. They said they thought it could be done, but that's why I said I'd do it if I had time at the end. They also said traffic was light (on a Wednesday?) They then started saying some pish about my starting and finishing times getting earlier and earlier, when I've actually been doing the same start and finish times for 6 months

So I tried to explain (again)- 15 min walk to start/ 15 minute walk to depot, 1/2 hour break, leaving office 25 minutes after start time because trolley not ready and argument. That left 3 1/2 hours to do the walk. So I worked to rule (well, as many rules as I know), pushed trolley to every delivery point, locked trolley when in flats, waited a couple of minutes at OAP's to answer for packets, tried neighbuors, took my break, no reading whilst walking etc etc. I got back 50 mins after finishing time. So 4.5 hours out on delivery. Others were just coming back too. Was not a light day and I probably left 15 - 20 dockets.

I'm totally peeved with these idiots and the majority of others who don't take their breaks and do lapsing before the walk and then claim overtime. Am I within my rights?