Working for free

danterossetti · Post by **danterossetti** » 11 Jul 2018, 16:11

I hope - in this day and age - all this forum talk of people working for free is mistaken.

If you do work for free could you please let me know the reason.

a) You want to please the boss and get promotion.

b) The boss won't pay overtime.

c) You want a steady day tomorrow.

d) You've been brainwashed into thinking you're slow.

e) You are on a trial and want to be kept on.

f) You are part-time and hoping to be made up.

g) You don't know how to fill in the docket.

h) You can't be assertive with the boss.

i) You are old school and stuck in job and knock mode.

j) Other.

Newbie001 · Post by **Newbie001** » 11 Jul 2018, 16:20

Think for most new starts it's a combination of b,d,e and g. Yet union does nothing to stop it.

nuns · Post by **nuns** » 11 Jul 2018, 16:21

im part time and does my head persons i work with who dont put there OT down, new starters aint told what they can claim or how to do it.
they have changed docket 3 times in a year moved it to 3 different places , its a joke.

i just wanna get to sept review and see if anything gets changed in my contract as done OT every week since started and will be in job more than 12 months , if nothing gets improved thats my OT finished i got my 12 months full wage rise,, not going over no more

nuns · Post by **nuns** » 11 Jul 2018, 16:22

i will be moved to another office for winter once i do that

kingeric · Post by **kingeric** » 11 Jul 2018, 18:02

I do think a lot of new starters aren't aware of booking docket.

I worked with a new guy last week who has been here since April and told him we need to book 30mins and he looked at me blankly. When I explained it he said he's never booked and always finishes at that time or later as well as being pushed into taking absorption. So he's basically being bullied into working for free because he's unaware of what is supposed to happen.

He was with the WPC for 2 days then moved. So it seems they are put with wpc for as short a time as possible so they can't tell them the rules

tommyrep · Post by **tommyrep** » 11 Jul 2018, 18:18

Newbie001 wrote:Think for most new starts it's a combination of b,d,e and g. Yet union does nothing to stop it.

I agree. Unfortunately the Union seem oblivious to the true goings on in a DO and don’t appear interested because they aren’t. ,! Simple ! Managers get away with isolation of new starts, getting them alone and exerting pressures achieve what they expect and want from a new start. WPCs are of no use or advice to any new starts, part of the reason they got the job.
It is blatant abuse of their members, where is the support for them ?
You really are left to the dogs working on delivery.
No one seems to want to chaperone or offer friendly advice to new starts.
They can see man@gers openly abusing new starts, witness bullying/intimidation daily and say nowt!
The treatment of new starts is a disgrace !!

crimson king · Post by **crimson king** » 11 Jul 2018, 18:30

kingeric wrote:I do think a lot of new starters aren't aware of booking docket.

I worked with a new guy last week who has been here since April and told him we need to book 30mins and he looked at me blankly. When I explained it he said he's never booked and always finishes at that time or later as well as being pushed into taking absorption. So he's basically being bullied into working for free because he's unaware of what is supposed to happen.

He was with the WPC for 2 days then moved. So it seems they are put with wpc for as short a time as possible so they can't tell them the rules

^^^ This is spot on.

I think lapsing, especially, is something that new starters are being brainwashed into believing is actually part of their duty, has to be done no matter what and are unaware they should be claiming. Come to that, I think managers are currently also being brainwashed into thinking the same.

Trouble is, part timers don't really see anyone in the morning when they come in, except maybe for a manager (not going to tell them anything to their advantage) and their partner (quite possibly a full timer who doesn't tell them anything or likes to cut corners). Everyone else is rushing out to do their own thing and are either blissfully unaware of couldn't give a flying crap that newbies are working for free, don't know how to claim overtime or how to cut off...or even that they can.

It's a divided workforce and, the whole time people are working for free, it suits RM fine.

Sir Henry · Post by **Sir Henry** » 11 Jul 2018, 18:38

The union are very much a hands off sort of organisation in my experience. No one wants to be a rep, you get s**t from every direction and little to no support from further up the hierarchy. As long as the workforce haven't walked out, you'll only see the area when there's more snake oil to sell to the dupes. For anything to change re working for nowt/Saturdays off etc etc the union would need the members behind them but seeing as these issues only affect a minority of less senior colleagues the I'm alright Jack attitude prevails amongst the senior full time, o/t rich, 1 in 6/1 in 4, easy walk holders.

Divide and rule? We did that NOT RM.

Celgar · Post by **Celgar** » 11 Jul 2018, 21:24

danterossetti wrote:I hope - in this day and age - all this forum talk of people working for free is mistaken.

If you do work for free could you please let me know the reason.

a) You want to please the boss and get promotion.

b) The boss won't pay overtime.

c) You want a steady day tomorrow.

d) You've been brainwashed into thinking you're slow.

e) You are on a trial and want to be kept on.

f) You are part-time and hoping to be made up.

g) You don't know how to fill in the docket.

h) You can't be assertive with the boss.

i) You are old school and stuck in job and knock mode.

j) Other.

There is no mistake about it - you should read the report released by the TUC a while ago. I think the main reason for not booking extended delivery is that it isn't easy to do. I think there is an opportunity with AHDC & PDA data to fix this problem for good and maybe automate calculations for paying wages. Whether RM will be honest enough to do this I wouldn't like to say. Most of the reasons you listed are not relevant to the situation.

LaggyBand · Post by **LaggyBand** » 11 Jul 2018, 21:40

People start early at ours because it means they will finish hours early through the week. Does that count?

danterossetti · Post by **danterossetti** » 11 Jul 2018, 22:32

Celgar wrote:
danterossetti wrote:I hope - in this day and age - all this forum talk of people working for free is mistaken.

If you do work for free could you please let me know the reason.

a) You want to please the boss and get promotion.

b) The boss won't pay overtime.

c) You want a steady day tomorrow.

d) You've been brainwashed into thinking you're slow.

e) You are on a trial and want to be kept on.

f) You are part-time and hoping to be made up.

g) You don't know how to fill in the docket.

h) You can't be assertive with the boss.

i) You are old school and stuck in job and knock mode.

j) Other.
There is no mistake about it - you should read the report released by the TUC a while ago. I think the main reason for not booking extended delivery is that it isn't easy to do. I think there is an opportunity with AHDC & PDA data to fix this problem for good and maybe automate calculations for paying wages. Whether RM will be honest enough to do this I wouldn't like to say. Most of the reasons you listed are not relevant to the situation.

Thank you for taking the trouble to reply. Can you remember what the TUC report was called? Why is booking extended not easy?

Should the Union push for all new starters to be given a booklet explaining hours, cutting off, breaks , docket etc ?

Newbie001 · Post by **Newbie001** » 11 Jul 2018, 22:46

danterossetti wrote:
Celgar wrote:
danterossetti wrote:I hope - in this day and age - all this forum talk of people working for free is mistaken.

If you do work for free could you please let me know the reason.

a) You want to please the boss and get promotion.

b) The boss won't pay overtime.

c) You want a steady day tomorrow.

d) You've been brainwashed into thinking you're slow.

e) You are on a trial and want to be kept on.

f) You are part-time and hoping to be made up.

g) You don't know how to fill in the docket.

h) You can't be assertive with the boss.

i) You are old school and stuck in job and knock mode.

j) Other.
There is no mistake about it - you should read the report released by the TUC a while ago. I think the main reason for not booking extended delivery is that it isn't easy to do. I think there is an opportunity with AHDC & PDA data to fix this problem for good and maybe automate calculations for paying wages. Whether RM will be honest enough to do this I wouldn't like to say. Most of the reasons you listed are not relevant to the situation.
Thank you for taking the trouble to reply. Can you remember what the TUC report was called? Why is booking extended not easy?

Should the Union push for all new starters to be given a booklet explaining hours, cutting off, breaks , docket etc ?

A booklet would be good for everyone, you know your on a loser when full-timers who've been in job 20/30 years are asking relatively new part-timers how to claim/cut-off. They are actually scared to ask the manager.

nuns · Post by **nuns** » 12 Jul 2018, 06:03

can the people on here not come up a A4 size paper explaining everything you need to do . then we all can see , maybe leave a couple pinned to notice board a work when they get removed some one can pass on to a newbie when they start

bobsworth · Post by **bobsworth** » 12 Jul 2018, 08:03

Somewhat proving the point but what's a docket in this context? The only docket I've been told about is a P739....

LaggyBand · Post by **LaggyBand** » 12 Jul 2018, 08:09

bobsworth wrote:Somewhat proving the point but what's a docket in this context? The only docket I've been told about is a P739....

Docket is postie slang for overtime.

As in,

“Hey there goes the office ghost chompin’ up all the creamy docket”