Union doesn't believe in seniority now

matthew68 · Post by **matthew68** » 23 Mar 2018, 19:04

So I have been a floater for many years and 2years ago was fed up and demanded to go on my own walk as people with less years were in front of me for some reason,I asked for resign but Dom says no eventuality went on shared van which didn’t like and I wanted a single van duty which someone with less years is doing but Dom says it doesn’t count any more it’s all about business needs! So I asked local rep who says Dom doesn’t want resign cause too much hassle and the union don’t think seniority counts When allocating walks,is this true as we never had resign since I’ve been there and now stuck withwalk which I don’t really want! Can’t I demand to be on a walk over someone else with less years? And is Dom right in refusing a resign?

Post by **Judgee** » 23 Mar 2018, 19:37

No you can't just kick someone off a walk because you have been there longer. If that were the case people would be getting booted off walks left right and centre!

They won't have a resign just to satisfy one worker. You could ask for a vote to see if the rest of the office wants one and the union could organise that. Might be wanted by many others if there hasn't been a resign for a long time but be careful what you wish for. Management are looking to pair up part timers with full timers on P & L, ignoring seniority. You may find yourself back on reserve at the end of it!

BELIAL · Post by **BELIAL** » 23 Mar 2018, 22:01

Yes seniority in repicks has quietly been ushered out the door. Dare to suggest that to a union official and they will choke on their tonsils ,and argue that a newbie of 6 months in picking a duty over a 15 yr time server is still seniority . I dunno

matthew68 · Post by **matthew68** » 23 Mar 2018, 22:10

Judgee wrote:No you can't just kick someone off a walk because you have been their longer. If that were the case people would be getting booted off walks left right and centre!

They won't have a resign just to satisfy one worker. You could ask for a vote to see if the rest of the office wants one and the union could organise that. Might be wanted by many others if there hasn't been a resign for a long time but be careful what you wish for. Management are looking to pair up part timers with full timers on P & L, ignoring seniority. You may find yourself back on reserve at the end of it!

We did have a vote and most said no because Dom has given them own walks! Only people who wanted resign were floaters and reserves who are on minority’s so it’s a farce that’s why it should be a proper resign yet union says it’s down to Dom so I assume that seniority counts for nothing these days ,it seems unfair that you have people constantly changing walks and others just stay on same ones all the time despite less years than floaters,we now have 2 people who have asked for resign and told no by Dom and union so now they have had enough and pulling out of union, it just seems as we are a small office and no rep certain guys are being treated differently to others and now making a uncomfortable work place

matthew68 · Post by **matthew68** » 23 Mar 2018, 22:25

BELIAL wrote:Yes seniority in repicks has quietly been ushered out the door. Dare to suggest that to a union official and they will choke on their tonsils ,and argue that a newbie of 6 months in picking a duty over a 15 yr time server is still seniority . I dunno

Agree seniority is nothing ,if you cut off like I have to because kids to pick up they make it awkward for you and union hardly do anything and in the end it will back fire big time

Post by **Judgee** » 23 Mar 2018, 23:19

Resigns are "mostly" done after revisions. That's why a vote after a revision can often result in the majority wanting a resign. Many having either lost their walks or had theirs changed. Without a major revision it is understandable that many want to stay with their current duties.

Doesn't sound to me like your manager or union rep have really done anything wrong in going with the majority? Why would they go against the bulk of the office just to keep the minority happy , that would make the vote on it just a pointless exercise?

Sounds like all you can do if you really hate your walk is to either go back to being a reserve/floater or just sit and wait until something better pops up. If you really feel that you have been mistreated or overlooked by management when it came to signing for a duty in the past you could always put in a grievance and/or speak to your union area rep?

Just as you should put in a grievance if you feel you are being bullied for cutting off. You can always go over your local reps head if you feel they are not representing you correctly.

Superdude201 · Post by **Superdude201** » 24 Mar 2018, 06:25

Have the duties been vacant and then picked by the people on them? Or have they become vacant and then they've just been moved onto them by the manager? As I was under the impression that after 6 months any vacant duty should go up on the board for anyone to pick? Which would then be decided on seniority. Could be wrong. Obviously if they've picked these during a repick then it's their duty.

ted_e_bear · Post by **ted_e_bear** » 24 Mar 2018, 06:54

Superdude201 wrote:Have the duties been vacant and then picked by the people on them? Or have they become vacant and then they've just been moved onto them by the manager? As I was under the impression that after 6 months any vacant duty should go up on the board for anyone to pick? Which would then be decided on seniority. Could be wrong. Obviously if they've picked these during a repick then it's their duty.

Sounds to me like that's the problem, when the walks became vacant they should have been advertised,it sounds to me that they haven't and the manager just left someone on them, perhaps you can ask the union rep if he can push the manager to advertise anything that hasn't been allocated officially.

matthew68 · Post by **matthew68** » 24 Mar 2018, 16:52

ted_e_bear wrote:
Superdude201 wrote:Have the duties been vacant and then picked by the people on them? Or have they become vacant and then they've just been moved onto them by the manager? As I was under the impression that after 6 months any vacant duty should go up on the board for anyone to pick? Which would then be decided on seniority. Could be wrong. Obviously if they've picked these during a repick then it's their duty.
Sounds to me like that's the problem, when the walks became vacant they should have been advertised,it sounds to me that they haven't and the manager just left someone on them, perhaps you can ask the union rep if he can push the manager to advertise anything that hasn't been allocated officially.

I did ask similar questions but it appears Dom hasn’t got time and apparently he’s happy with people on walks and doesn’t want the problems of people changing, walks were never advertised just allocated after revisions,I have asked many times for resign but he is dead against it ,I think he just wants easy life as there are some posties who have just done t(e 1wLk since they have been there! It just seems wrong to me when you here about Re sign,but it just appears like rep and Dom just keep talking me out of it and say they won’t do it

Shedend · Post by **Shedend** » 24 Mar 2018, 17:17

Seniority still holds when signing for a duty......

Superdude201 · Post by **Superdude201** » 25 Mar 2018, 08:57

Resign is the wrong word really as that would involve all duties being reallocated. Sounds like these duties haven't been signed for in the first place and if they have they haven't been done using the correct procedure if you haven't had the opportunity to put you're name down for them.

What should be happening is any duties which haven't been picked in the previous repick, or have become available due to people leaving the business etc should be available for all people to put their name down for it over a period of time, then the most senior person should then be given that walk as I understand it.

It's always gonna be easier for the manager to move the people who know the walks round and leave the reserves who don't know anything on the same walk all the time, but end of the day that's not your problem. We all start the job not knowing the walks, and you only learn them by doing them so it's not fair to let some off the hook when they're supposed to be a reserve, so you need to flag it up with the union rep or maybe even put a grievance in over the issue because they're being favourtistic towards other people at your and the more senior members expense.

bloot · Post by **bloot** » 25 Mar 2018, 12:04

Superdude201 wrote:Resign is the wrong word really as that would involve all duties being reallocated. Sounds like these duties haven't been signed for in the first place and if they have they haven't been done using the correct procedure if you haven't had the opportunity to put you're name down for them.

What should be happening is any duties which haven't been picked in the previous repick, or have become available due to people leaving the business etc should be available for all people to put their name down for it over a period of time, then the most senior person should then be given that walk as I understand it.

It's always gonna be easier for the manager to move the people who know the walks round and leave the reserves who don't know anything on the same walk all the time, but end of the day that's not your problem. We all start the job not knowing the walks, and you only learn them by doing them so it's not fair to let some off the hook when they're supposed to be a reserve, so you need to flag it up with the union rep or maybe even put a grievance in over the issue because they're being favourtistic towards other people at your and the more senior members expense.

thats it explained right there , but if you bring it up , the words operational needs and no budget for training is the response .

matthew68 · Post by **matthew68** » 25 Mar 2018, 19:25

bloot wrote:
Superdude201 wrote:Resign is the wrong word really as that would involve all duties being reallocated. Sounds like these duties haven't been signed for in the first place and if they have they haven't been done using the correct procedure if you haven't had the opportunity to put you're name down for them.

What should be happening is any duties which haven't been picked in the previous repick, or have become available due to people leaving the business etc should be available for all people to put their name down for it over a period of time, then the most senior person should then be given that walk as I understand it.

It's always gonna be easier for the manager to move the people who know the walks round and leave the reserves who don't know anything on the same walk all the time, but end of the day that's not your problem. We all start the job not knowing the walks, and you only learn them by doing them so it's not fair to let some off the hook when they're supposed to be a reserve, so you need to flag it up with the union rep or maybe even put a grievance in over the issue because they're being favourtistic towards other people at your and the more senior members expense.
thats it explained right there , but if you bring it up , the words operational needs and no budget for training is the response .

Yep that’s what will happen I’m like a dog chasing it’s tail it seems

Post by **POSTMAN** » 25 Mar 2018, 21:45

Sounds like another wankey rep that needs to be got rid of.

Post by **Warriorpostie** » 28 Mar 2018, 18:40

Does seniority still apply to contract hours? ie most senior person gets made up first?

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