Deal and part timers

[bigal383]

Union havent agreed yet anything for part time staff been at royal mail 8 years always worked 39 hours plus still on my 30 hr contract.The last deal stated hours to be reviewed every 6 months.... Never been reviewed. All smoke and mirrows about senority and the hours worked and contracts being given. My vote will be a fat no and hundreds of part time staff are doing the same. Its about part time staff got treated the same

[slinder123]

[Martin Walsh]

Have you read the agreement ?

There are better words on part timers than ever before about what constitutes a need for an up lift in contract hours. Everyone know this has to be done immediately after this agreement is voted on.

Additionally a part timer stands to get 12.3 % pay rise over the three years of this agreement whereas a full time gets 7%.

Additionally as part timers make up the majority of those in the DC scheme they will now have the same pension scheme as everyone else once secondary legislation is achieved.

In the interim those who have done 4 years plus the nursery year will go into the Same scheme as all those who were in the DB scheme.

Additionally those in the DC scheme will automatically be enrolled in the upper tier of the scheme ie paying 6% and Royal Mail will increase their own contributions from 9% to 10%.

By all means vote no but let’s clarify what else do you want in an agreement and are you willing to strike to get more and what exactly is more ?

[fishtank]

I don't think the problem is words dingo, we've got plenty of those but until the union holds Royal Mail to the words members will rightly be sceptical.

It can't be left to local reps, unfortunately some of them aren't up to it but are the branches? Sadly with some of them I doubt it so what mechanisms are their in the agreement for part-time members getting screwed over by their own office/manager/rep/branch because that's exactly what's been happening.

[clashcityrocker]

Here is what I don't understand....... (1 of many things)

Imagine postie A breaks his leg. He is a rest day cover and the 4 part timers whose duties he covers are all asked to work their day off to cover the absence.
They are paid 7 hours overtime each so they are working a 32 hour week.

Postie A has a bad break followed by an infection (like Cazorla) and is off for over 6 months.
Do those 4 posties get a temporary increase in their contracts or after 6 months will they (as I believe most of them expect) get a permanent increase to their contract?

One of the 4 has 3 weeks annual leave after the third month.
Will he get the 32 hours in his holiday pay?
Whereas another has his 3 weeks after Postie A returns, so he won't get any increase in his holiday pay?

What happens?

Or question 2.
If they are guaranteeing to cover the overtime will it be paid as SA?
How do you pay a part timer SA and still maintain his correct delivery supplement?

[fishtank]

Maybe I could ask a simpler question...
Does seniority or length of service or time served or whatever we call it now still apply when allocating increased contractual hours because this agreement seems to suggest it doesn't and to be honest the whole thing isn't really compatible anyway.

[yellowbelly]

Have you read the agreement ?

There are better words on part timers than ever before about what constitutes a need for an up lift in contract hours. Everyone know this has to be done immediately after this agreement is voted on.

Words - but no clarity - Para 8 - 'Where appropriate increased hours will be offered.....', bear in mind this this paragraph is entitled 'Resourcing in line with current agreements' so shouldn't this already be happening, it's nothing new? Who decides what's appropriate?

Additionally as part timers make up the majority of those in the DC scheme they will now have the same pension scheme as everyone else once secondary legislation is achieved.

It's still an IF and there is no definite date for implementation.

In the interim those who have done 4 years plus the nursery year will go into the Same scheme as all those who were in the DB scheme.

Why not everybody who is in the DC scheme? - same work different pension - no justification for this in my eyes.

Additionally those in the DC scheme will automatically be enrolled in the upper tier of the scheme ie paying 6% and Royal Mail will increase their own contributions from 9% to 10%.

Still a difference to those who've been in the DC for 4 + 1yrs you quote for whom RM will pay 15.6%. Same work - different RM contributions.

By all means vote no but let’s clarify what else do you want in an agreement and are you willing to strike to get more and what exactly is more ?

Clarity and equality in the interim scheme no matter how long the interim schemes might be in place for.

[IloveMYredTROLLEY!]

Anything in this agreement about unconditional holiday pay and sick pay based on an average of the hours worked in the previous 12 weeks?

Isn't it about two years now since other UK companies had to change their position on this after the EU ruling, yet as far as I'm aware, RM are burying their head in the sand and still relying on part timers that beg for overtime to boost their wages?

If RM had to backpay part timers according to the 12 weeks rule, the wages bill increase would be massive, they have exploited part time staff for years to clear depots daily.

[slinder123]

and they will keep on doing it till the dave wards of this union put the boot in but i cant see any movement there as its part timers

[rogersh]

I don't think the problem is words dingo, we've got plenty of those but until the union holds Royal Mail to the words members will rightly be sceptical.

It can't be left to local reps, unfortunately some of them aren't up to it but are the branches? Sadly with some of them I doubt it so what mechanisms are their in the agreement for part-time members getting screwed over by their own office/manager/rep/branch because that's exactly what's been happening.

I agree entirely fishtank, it's words; The AFG stipulates what is supposed to happen regarding part time hours, recruitment & use of agency & casual staff.

The following joint letter relating to resourcing identifies failings.

2016 A joint letter between rm & cwu resourcing & recruitment recognised concerns.
signed by Royal Mail Chief Operations Officer Sue Whalley and Terry Pullinger, DGSP, which is designed to relaunch the Joint Statement agreed in November last year.
The Joint Letter recognises that, whilst there has been some progress, last year’s Joint Statement was not fully embraced in the field and further action was therefore necessary to restore confidence and stability around resourcing.

The latest pre- ballot agreement
8. Resourcing in line with current agreements.
Both parties agree that the aims, principles and detail contained in our agreements and recent joint statements will be re-affirmed and fully applied.

It then specifies what will apply to part time workers with immediate effect.

[rambo1]

Here is what I don't understand....... (1 of many things)

Imagine postie A breaks his leg. He is a rest day cover and the 4 part timers whose duties he covers are all asked to work their day off to cover the absence.
They are paid 7 hours overtime each so they are working a 32 hour week.

Postie A has a bad break followed by an infection (like Cazorla) and is off for over 6 months.
Do those 4 posties get a temporary increase in their contracts or after 6 months will they (as I believe most of them expect) get a permanent increase to their contract?

One of the 4 has 3 weeks annual leave after the third month.
Will he get the 32 hours in his holiday pay?
Whereas another has his 3 weeks after Postie A returns, so he won't get any increase in his holiday pay?

What happens?

Or question 2.
If they are guaranteeing to cover the overtime will it be paid as SA?
How do you pay a part timer SA and still maintain his correct delivery supplement?

Look, my full time duty takes 45hrs on average to complete. Do I get my contract upped to 45hrs? No. Part time is part time, full is full and anything over is overtime. They can't make you do 39 hrs on a 30 contact just as they can't make me do 45 on a 39. It may not be right but I'm sick of part timers on here thinking they are so hard done to.

[regalia25]

[quote="dingo"]Have you read the agreement ?

Additionally a part timer stands to get 12.3 % pay rise over the three years of this agreement whereas a full time gets 7%.

Why is this spin used so often ?
EVERYONE's hourly rate will be going up by 12.3% !!
Why is it portrayed as being better for part-timer's ? That would only be the case if they only worked their contracted hours.
The vast majority at our place work full time hours, so the SWW will mean they are just being slightly less ripped off with holiday and sick pay !!

[panch1989]

Here is what I don't understand....... (1 of many things)

Imagine postie A breaks his leg. He is a rest day cover and the 4 part timers whose duties he covers are all asked to work their day off to cover the absence.
They are paid 7 hours overtime each so they are working a 32 hour week.

Postie A has a bad break followed by an infection (like Cazorla) and is off for over 6 months.
Do those 4 posties get a temporary increase in their contracts or after 6 months will they (as I believe most of them expect) get a permanent increase to their contract?

One of the 4 has 3 weeks annual leave after the third month.
Will he get the 32 hours in his holiday pay?
Whereas another has his 3 weeks after Postie A returns, so he won't get any increase in his holiday pay?

What happens?

Or question 2.
If they are guaranteeing to cover the overtime will it be paid as SA?
How do you pay a part timer SA and still maintain his correct delivery supplement?

Look, my full time duty takes 45hrs on average to complete. Do I get my contract upped to 45hrs? No. Part time is part time, full is full and anything over is overtime. They can't make you do 39 hrs on a 30 contact just as they can't make me do 45 on a 39. It may not be right but I'm sick of part timers on here thinking they are so hard done to.

Try working 5 weeks straight as a full time cover then on your week off only getting your part time hours and then tell us we aren't hard done by... Don't worry though, full time jobs are all the union is bothered in keeping

[maisymoo04]

Here is what I don't understand....... (1 of many things)

Imagine postie A breaks his leg. He is a rest day cover and the 4 part timers whose duties he covers are all asked to work their day off to cover the absence.
They are paid 7 hours overtime each so they are working a 32 hour week.

Postie A has a bad break followed by an infection (like Cazorla) and is off for over 6 months.
Do those 4 posties get a temporary increase in their contracts or after 6 months will they (as I believe most of them expect) get a permanent increase to their contract?

One of the 4 has 3 weeks annual leave after the third month.
Will he get the 32 hours in his holiday pay?
Whereas another has his 3 weeks after Postie A returns, so he won't get any increase in his holiday pay?

What happens?

Or question 2.
If they are guaranteeing to cover the overtime will it be paid as SA?
How do you pay a part timer SA and still maintain his correct delivery supplement?

Look, my full time duty takes 45hrs on average to complete. Do I get my contract upped to 45hrs? No. Part time is part time, full is full and anything over is overtime. They can't make you do 39 hrs on a 30 contact just as they can't make me do 45 on a 39. It may not be right but I'm sick of part timers on here thinking they are so hard done to.

[bigal383]

If you lads are sick of part timers thinking there hard done by why dont u drop your hours and give them your contracts and lets see hiw u lads like it. Theyll be a big no vote comming due to this