conduct invite advice

[pilch]

so where do i stand ?

over the last couple of years i've fallen out with a few managers once or twice due to not wanting to work over on the odd occasion
all this and I'm normally first to do extra
and had a bit of a heated argument with out earlier in the year over working over

anyway, i've been pulled up for 3 mis-deliverys since
first one was for a house that has been built around 3 years but its still not been put on the frame, the house in question also had no number at the time
i didn't realised i had mis delivered

when asked about it i mentioned about the frame and the number and that was that, no coaching or advice

2nd one was for a round that i had had to come of for personal reasons shorting after taking it in december
i was already stressed that they had made me go back on it and this was the first time since i came off it mid december
i'd asked for a count but told i would be able to finish on time
i was adamant i would be an hour over and asked for a phone call but was refused
my union rep advised me to ask what i should do with the mail i cant deliver within my time but was told , i had to deliver it, end of conversation
i was an hour over and even used to helpline after my shift as i was really annoyed and stressed by what had happened

i knew i had mis delivered and tried to get the mail back but owners were out

the complainant had also said it had happened many times in previous few weeks ( when someone knew was on it)
turns out this was a repeat problem and i hadn't been made aware or this ( only found out when i mentioned it to the previous regular man)

this occasion a different manager (who i do get on with) gave me a bit of advice and pointed out i could have posted a mis delivery card and showed me where they were ( never seen or heard of them before)

last mis delivery was for two adjacent streets, both 11 letters long with just 1 letter different , pretty easy when the sequencer gets them mixed up too several times a day which i pointed out

this time when i was made aware of it all i was told was 'sign here, its conduct now"

fact finding

as above gave my argument

after being handed the minutes
i added the bits that were missed

new minutes given to me by manager in addressed sealed letter
i put this on my frame with the aim of sorting it after my shift
but my manager thought different and proceeded to open my letter and read out extracts to me at the frame, overheard by at least two colleagues
he then asked me 3 times before i left the office if i'd signed them
i gave them back next day

its obvious they are chasing me because this is now a conduct case

had letter in post monday for a meeting today
but this morning i said i'm not prepared to do it today as i've not have enough notice

before i left the office i had a new letter, he said "its saturday now"

i explained thats still not enough notice as 2 working days is required
not sure if saturday is classed as working day but i know friday this week cant be
he insisted it will go ahead as he only needs 48 hours
( i know its 2 working days notice, i've been on the management course in the past, acting manager, short lived, didn't want it)

there are also no notes or evidence in the letter ( just the minutes )

i feel like a kangaroo court is being planned for me so they can build up a dismissal case slowly but surely

seems like managers can not follow procedure anytime they like
but we fall into mistakes waiting to happen and its 'gotcha'
even if its partly due to their own incompetence


help!

[Jpro747]

Get your rep involved if you haven't already, and if they're in the managers pocket go to area rep. Sounds like management are taking the p1ss and not following correct conduct procedure. Some of the actions by your manager are completely out of order, especially opening your letter which i assume was addressed to you.

[General Mannerheim]

It does sound like they are out to get you.
But I hope you didn't go into the fact finding without a rep or at least a colleague, as these turds have a nice way of making bullshite up, which it sounds as if they did because you had to amended the minutes....all they will do is deny what you've amended if you didn't have a witness present to back you up...which is why people need to always go in with SOMEBODY it doesn't have to be a rep.

As for the manager to open your letter then no he shouldn't have done it and IF you can get the two witness to back you up that this happened then you could be in with a shout,...but colleagues are well known to say feck all when push comes to shove.

The whole conduct s**t for misdelivery is just that... s**t, what they are attempting to say is that your inept at your job but have they given you the proper training? Have they when your performance slipped below standard come up with an improvement plan or coaching?

[pilch]

latest on this farce

insited on giving me the conduct on the saturday saying it was enough notice ( it clearly says on the doc that its 2 working days )

at the hearing he produced another complaint mis-delivery for one of the same address's as the other 3
and says it was on the same day as my fact finding mission (the tuesday)

as if i was going to mis deliver there an hour after my fact finding mission,

now the householder says she wasnt sure if the wrong letter arrived monday or tuesday
and guess what , my manager didnt even speak to the person who was on the delivery on the monday

last week i was on leave, and heard nothing all week
when i got back monday he soon asked me if i signed the letter
i explained i hadnt had it ( i hadnt) but he said, ho that is strange isnt it because i posted it over a week ago

anyway, it left him saying he'd print another off

i got back late from delivery and was just going when he shouted me
i explained im already late but he say it will only take a minute
i said its 9 minutes past 2 now and i'm already 19 minutes late
he joked that you'll only be 20 late then
very funny yeah

( he also mentioned the letter had been sat on his desk for over a week as he forgot about it)



now what is annoying is
after my first misdelivery, a different manager mentioned it to me and i said, thats not only not on the frame but those houses dont have numbers on them
' oh i'll have to look at that he said, and that was all i heard

i mentioned this at the meeting and got no response

low and behold the minutes arrive and he's claimed he replied at the meeting saying i was given coaching as per the sheets

pretty obvious to me he's gone back after the meeting and dragged out the sheets to see what is on them

theses sheets i should have been given a copy of before the meeting
and how can he introduce a fresh complaint at conduct meeting without informing me, or fully investigating it)

i've left this with my rep who agrees this wasnt said at the meeting

how do i go about getting a union rep who knows what he's doing rather than a yes man who doesnt seem to care ?

its bad enough they are being petty about mis delivery never mind having to lie and presume and cover their own failings to get me

[TheTrolleyMan]

Always take a rep / witness /friend in with you , always ask for everything in writing so it'll protect all parties concerned

[postslippete]

The whole idea around counselling and conduct is to try and improve our standards; it should not be used by managers as a disciplinary tool to force staff into completing their duties with or without any overtime. Unfortunately, you do get one or two 'bent' managers that like to to be authoritarian and punitive in their measures, probably because they can't be ar*ed to take any of the work that staff leave behind.

So back to the case for the prosecution.....wow, 3 mis-sorts in the space of when? A week? 3 months? What is so significant about these 3 mis-deliveries - were they all Special Deliveries or something? Is there any particular manager that is the root cause of the conduct case? A dodgy DOM perhaps? From the stage of where you are I would suggest going down the bullying and harassment route - try the helpline first and the fact that it is stressing you out and then fill out the B&H forms if necessary. That would stand better than any grievance in this case.

[pilch]

The whole idea around counselling and conduct is to try and improve our standards; it should not be used by managers as a disciplinary tool to force staff into completing their duties with or without any overtime. Unfortunately, you do get one or two 'bent' managers that like to to be authoritarian and punitive in their measures, probably because they can't be ar*ed to take any of the work that staff leave behind.

So back to the case for the prosecution.....wow, 3 mis-sorts in the space of when? A week? 3 months? What is so significant about these 3 mis-deliveries - were they all Special Deliveries or something? Is there any particular manager that is the root cause of the conduct case? A dodgy DOM perhaps? From the stage of where you are I would suggest going down the bullying and harassment route - try the helpline first and the fact that it is stressing you out and then fill out the B&H forms if necessary. That would stand better than any grievance in this case.

i've not had any for years but the first of these was in Jan ( the one where the house isnt on the frame)
the 2nd was mid feb ( the one which was a repeat complaint that i wasnt made aware of, and the one where i was forced to go an hour over to complete)
the 3rd was in march 2 adjacent street where there is only 1 letter different between the 2

lol he tried to pin one on me for last week until i reminded him i was on A/L
you couldnt make it up