Can someone enlight me on this one please

sharktc · Post by **sharktc** » 25 Oct 2016, 05:53

Hi Guys,

can you be accused of willfull delay by not returning to the office after finishing your duty? bear in mind he didn't return cause he had a immediate family emergency he still completed his duty but used about a hour of RM time.

Someone got any ideas on what i can do to give him sound advise?

Regards

hans solo · Post by **hans solo** » 25 Oct 2016, 06:12

did everyone return to office and work to time
wilful is exactly that intentional delay mgmt do it every day operational needs
so wouldnt expect to be placed under wilful delay

sharktc · Post by **sharktc** » 25 Oct 2016, 15:16

yes everyone stayed till time he returned to depot as well but manager allegedly waited by his van the hour he was away....

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 25 Oct 2016, 15:38

As no items of mail appear to have been delayed by him I think this at the very worst case would be abandonment of duty but as he returned it would be a long shot.

On delay of mail, at worst its an "unintentional delay of mail" charge, in that he went off his duty without permission.

http://www.cwu.org/assets/cwu/legacy-as ... re_Agr.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Delay to mail
Delay to mail can be treated as:
• Unintentional delay
• Unexcused delay
• Intentional delay
Unintentional delay
Royal Mail Group recognises that genuine mistakes and misunderstandings do
occur and it is not our intention that such cases should be dealt with under the
Conduct policy beyond informal discussions for the isolated instance.
Unexcused delay
Various actions can cause mail to be delayed, for example carelessness or
negligence leading to loss or delay of customers’ mail, breach or disregard of a
standard or guideline. Such instances are to be distinguished from intentional
delay (see below), although they may also be treated as misconduct and dealt
with under the Conduct Policy, outcomes may range from an informal discussion
to dismissal.
Intentional delay
Intentional delay of mail is classed as gross misconduct which, if proven, could
lead to dismissal. The test to determine whether actions may be considered as
intentional delay is whether the action taken by the employee knowingly was
deliberate with an intention to delay mail.
Where proven, such breaches of conduct can lead to dismissal, even for a first
offence; indeed intentional delay is a criminal offence and can result in
prosecution

k979aaa · Post by **k979aaa** » 25 Oct 2016, 16:56

sharktc wrote:yes everyone stayed till time he returned to depot as well but manager allegedly waited by his van the hour he was away....

That just shows up the manager has one hour too spare if the guy did his duty and went over and did not claim overtime for it why was a manager stalking him and why did he hit him with a charge seams the manager is victimising the individual.

datasaint · Post by **datasaint** » 25 Oct 2016, 21:39

Wilful delay? What got delayed exactly if the duty was completed.

Sounds like a trumped up charge if ever there was one.

sharktc · Post by **sharktc** » 25 Oct 2016, 22:29

They are claiming that because walks failed he could've performed some of them on the time that he was at the family emergency.

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 26 Oct 2016, 14:30

sharktc wrote:They are claiming that because walks failed he could've performed some of them on the time that he was at the family emergency.

In that case he must get the Area Delivery Rep involved, through his local rep if he can.

It sounds like a kangaroo court. If the family emergency was real and genuine then he is entitled to be absent from work (with permission) to deal with it.

http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/mrm/Time ... ummary.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

His only mistake was he didn't contact the manager and explain what had happened, and then get the managers permission/agreement to break off. For that an informal warning would be about the worst I would accept, not a charge of wilful delay.

With guidance from the reps, his best chance would be to apologise for not contacting the manager, but that he was in a panic at the time etc.

FFS - Lurking managers - why is a postie showing you what the difference between Leadership and Management is, try and learn Leadership and the posties will follow to the gates of Hades if you only trusted and supported them. Rules are for the guidance of the intelligent, and adherence of fools.

jetblack · Post by **jetblack** » 26 Oct 2016, 17:43

TrueBlueTerrier wrote:..why is a postie showing you what the difference between Leadership and Management is, try and learn Leadership and the posties will follow to the gates of Hades if you only trusted and supported them. Rules are for the guidance of the intelligent, and adherence of fools.

Slightly off topic but I reckon that RM could be unique in that oftentimes the IQ of the rank and file exceeds that of those in positions of authority over them.
In my experience all sorts of clever people choose the simple life of the humble postie, and for various reasons.
In practice this leads to all sorts of absurdities - many of which only seem to be apparent to the postie