Abandonment of Duty?

[Mezza]

A colleague who has been off all week on holiday was asked to come in today on O/T,to cover his own indoor duty, which he was happy to do.

The office was a right mess this morning in the callers office, packets were still piled up everywhere from yesterday waiting to be booked in and so the callers office duty refuse to open to the public at 7am. At around 7.10 management asked my colleague to go into the callers, open up and serve - he refused as he had already been booking packets in for over an hour and was in effect already helping the callers office. He pointed out to management that at 7.30 he had to get on with his own work or would fail to complete his duty today.

Following a small disagreement with management he was told to go home at 7.30am - a line manager covering for DOMS day off told him to go home.

As he was in on what should have been holiday and sent home by management (probably without pay for the day) can this be classed as abandonment of duty in any way?
He has tried to contact area Union Rep, but had no reply as yet.

Could his action in refusing to comply with a so called 'reasonable request' be classed as insubordination?

Are there any things to be concerned about when he returns to work on Monday?

Any advice appreciated.

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

He was sent home so definately not abandonment of duty, abandonment of duty is leaving without permission, which in this case he clearly had if he was sent home.

However yes he could get a conduct charge of failing to follow a reasonable request from what u have said

[Bahia Feliz]

Moral of story - Don't come in whilst on Annual leave

[arnold cheshire]

Moral of story - Don't come in whilst on Annual leave

Well said

[Mezza]

Moral of story - Don't come in whilst on Annual leave

Not the point though is it?


Only came in to cover his own indoor duty, for which nobody else could cover. Meant his duty would have otherwise gone uncovered and that work would have been waiting for him on Monday.
To then come in and be made to fail his own duty and still have the work to do on Monday made no sense. He stood up for himself and was sent home.

Yes, that work is still going to be sitting there on Monday now, but the real issue here is no adequate provision for booking items in with SPS.
There are other issues regarding the cover of indoor duties by staff who don't want to do it - but that's for another thread.

If this were one of those repeating threads about someone on delivery who was forced to go over his duty time in order to complete, you'd soon be saying stand up for yourself, cut off etc etc.
As soon as it's indoor staff it's a case of 'don't come in on annual leave'.
Difference is a delivery will normally be covered under the threat of the USO and it will get cleared up.
An indoor duty is often seen by management as perfectly ok to leave and ignore and let the duty holder clear it all up as and when - should that really be the case?

[Spedley]

I don't know, this is a tricky one. If it was a normal day then technically he should do what he is told. But if he is on overtime for a specific duty then he should have the option to refuse if the duty is significantly changed.

[trythat]

Moral of story - Don't come in whilst on Annual leave

Not the point though is it?


Only came in to cover his own indoor duty, for which nobody else could cover. Meant his duty would have otherwise gone uncovered and that work would have been waiting for him on Monday.
To then come in and be made to fail his own duty and still have the work to do on Monday made no sense. He stood up for himself and was sent home.

Yes, that work is still going to be sitting there on Monday now, but the real issue here is no adequate provision for booking items in with SPS.
There are other issues regarding the cover of indoor duties by staff who don't want to do it - but that's for another thread.

If this were one of those repeating threads about someone on delivery who was forced to go over his duty time in order to complete, you'd soon be saying stand up for yourself, cut off etc etc.
As soon as it's indoor staff it's a case of 'don't come in on annual leave'.
Difference is a delivery will normally be covered under the threat of the USO and it will get cleared up.
An indoor duty is often seen by management as perfectly ok to leave and ignore and let the duty holder clear it all up as and when - should that really be the case?

It is the point though, because if everyone came in when they should be on leave then RM will not need reserves. Plus as usual someone else might of wanted the day off but couldn't because the leave was supposedly booked.

Regarding indoor work not being done or provisions being made, then I'm afraid the only way to change things is when failures happen. As others will say, we are paid for a number of hours, you work them and if you want OT then all well and good and if you don't then all well and goood and pop off home, knowing you've done a goods day work.

[aiden01]

think anyone who works while due on annual leave is

[wannabeek]

You're on AL (unless you're on a wally week system) for 5 of the 6 working days of the week. Surely you can come in on the one day as you're not on AL for that day, just working your day off. That's how I've always seen it, anyway.

Surely he should have made it clear what the deal was before he came in? i.e. that he was only coming in to do such-and-such, not this-that-and-the-other. He should make that clear in future if he didn't this time, otherwise it probably falls into the 'work as directed' category and he could be asked to do anything reasonable.

[SpacePhoenix]

You're on AL (unless you're on a wally week system) for 5 of the 6 working days of the week. Surely you can come in on the one day as you're not on AL for that day, just working your day off. That's how I've always seen it, anyway.

Surely he should have made it clear what the deal was before he came in? i.e. that he was only coming in to do such-and-such, not this-that-and-the-other. He should make that clear in future if he didn't this time, otherwise it probably falls into the 'work as directed' category and he could be asked to do anything reasonable.

Doesn't matter if it's normal duty, SA or docket, managers can use the "as directed" at any time, just work your hours, if what the manager has directed you to do results in your normal duty content failing, it's his problem, not yours.

[Spedley]

Most of my annual leave is allocated because I can't get the holidays I want. I have often come to work because I didn't know I had the week off. I have no objection to working the week on O/T (for the £350+) as long as that isn't the reason I can't book the weeks I want.

I admit we are slightly short staffed which now [with the new annual leave system] means we have less holiday slots but I think most of the problem is down to people booking excess. Why would you offer to do extra on top of your duty after an 8 hours shift for a lower rate? I just don't get it?

[Biker Mouse]

You're on AL (unless you're on a wally week system) for 5 of the 6 working days of the week. Surely you can come in on the one day as you're not on AL for that day, just working your day off. That's how I've always seen it, anyway.

Surely he should have made it clear what the deal was before he came in? i.e. that he was only coming in to do such-and-such, not this-that-and-the-other. He should make that clear in future if he didn't this time, otherwise it probably falls into the 'work as directed' category and he could be asked to do anything reasonable.

No, you are off for 7 days, Monday-Sunday, even if you work 3 days a week its still 7 days off.

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

You're on AL (unless you're on a wally week system) for 5 of the 6 working days of the week. Surely you can come in on the one day as you're not on AL for that day, just working your day off. That's how I've always seen it, anyway.

Surely he should have made it clear what the deal was before he came in? i.e. that he was only coming in to do such-and-such, not this-that-and-the-other. He should make that clear in future if he didn't this time, otherwise it probably falls into the 'work as directed' category and he could be asked to do anything reasonable.

No, you are off for 7 days, Monday-Sunday, even if you work 3 days a week its still 7 days off.

leave is booked in days not weeks it is only 3 days leave the rest is days off, doesn't matter too much as it's not illegal to work annual leave anyway just against the way forward agreement

[Groundpounder]

Packets piled up not booked in long line of customers all complaining and shouting at you because of this, Managers not bothered Union not interested. SPS system taking longer such as the to do list now requiring details for rts but no extra time to do it ,trying to do three jobs or more at a time like booking in packets while putting them away while trying to move packets up because you don't have space and at the same time dealing with customers who come in seven at a time wanting service straight away. I too have thought many times about refusing to open up because your just not ready and this happens because it's you that has to face the public and not the managers.

[Mezza]

Packets piled up not booked in long line of customers all complaining and shouting at you because of this, Managers not bothered Union not interested. SPS system taking longer such as the to do list now requiring details for rts but no extra time to do it ,trying to do three jobs or more at a time like booking in packets while putting them away while trying to move packets up because you don't have space and at the same time dealing with customers who come in seven at a time wanting service straight away. I too have thought many times about refusing to open up because your just not ready and this happens because it's you that has to face the public and not the managers.

Absolutely spot on with every word there Groundpounder.

It amazes me that the Union have done nothing to address the issue.
In our DO - classed as medium sized it's added at least 3 hours to the average working day for the callers duty - with no provision for it from management or Union - it's disgraceful and come the point when christmas really kicks in will only lead to many more issues. We warned our management about it weeks ago and still absolutely nothing is done.
The easy answer would be to file a disagreement or a bullying case under an unfair workload - but as the indoor staff in my DO have had a grievance up to level 3 refused and 2 disagreements that weren't even followed through correctly your left thinking well what's the point. Let it pile up, let the customers complain. When we refuse to open our callers hopefully customers will start walking into the actual DO looking for someone to complain to.