Had pay stopped

max power · Post by **max power** » 27 May 2015, 14:45

Hello i need some advice about Absorption

i do a walk that is exempt from any absorption (new delivery points opening every week and new builds)
so i do a bit of indoor stuff when i can

anyway this morning my dom said i had to take a bit of Absorption out today
and i refused as my walk (along with 3 others are exempt)

he then told me i was having my wages stopped ?

my union rep is not very good and doesn't seem to know much about agreements ?

can he do this ??

motherhubbard · Post by **motherhubbard** » 27 May 2015, 15:02

If you had time to do it within your contracted hours and you refused, then yes he can stop your wages ,,,,and for a very long time.
He could simply sack you for failing to follow a reasonable request.
You are not exempt from working all your paid hours.

If you didn't have time, then no he can't.

Decky Boy · Post by **Decky Boy** » 27 May 2015, 15:10

Your manger has gone completely mad my friend. First and foremost I'd contact the local Psychiatric Nurse and let her know she has to visit your unit. Absorbtion (or lapsing) is only done if your conditioned hours (daily contracted hours) allow. Sanctions such as stopping pay are criminal if you attend work as per your contract. Quite honestly some of these so called "managers" need to get an education ....

Post by **halfull** » 27 May 2015, 15:14

max power wrote:Hello i need some advice about Absorption

i do a walk that is exempt from any absorption (new delivery points opening every week and new builds)
so i do a bit of indoor stuff when i can

anyway this morning my dom said i had to take a bit of Absorption out today
and i refused as my walk (along with 3 others are exempt)

he then told me i was having my wages stopped ?

my union rep is not very good and doesn't seem to know much about agreements ?

can he do this ??

simple answer is no & you should put a grievance in immediately ,but its gets complicated as you have refused a reasonable request. You cannot just refuse to carry out tasks such as absorption if manager asks you to do it! You can tell him your stance on the situation ie if you will not work over. Our contracts state we turn up for work for however many hours your contracted to & its as directed! ie whatever they choose us to do.
The choice we have is if we believe we are going to go over our finish time we do not have to as overtime is not compulsory, so you should have said to your dom- if i take this extra work i will be going over my finish time & do not want to so i will bring it back or leave some of my own walk, he then has to make a decision what he wants you to do.
To flat out refuse to carry out a task we cannot do unless it clearly puts your safety at risk. If your rep is not of any help id contact your branch or area rep asap.

max power · Post by **max power** » 27 May 2015, 15:27

Thanks guys for responding

yes it would have taken me over my time

so i will see what happens tomorrow

thanks again

Decky Boy · Post by **Decky Boy** » 27 May 2015, 15:41

Hallfull wrote : You cannot just refuse to carry out tasks such as absorption if manager asks you to do it!

Yes you can my friend , if you cannot manage the extra in your contracted hours.

Post by **halfull** » 27 May 2015, 16:01

Decky Boy wrote:Hallfull wrote : You cannot just refuse to carry out tasks such as absorption if manager asks you to do it!

Yes you can my friend , if you cannot manage the extra in your contracted hours.

you are wrong, if your manager says you must take it out with you you cannot refuse this! You then just follow the mail's over running procedure. You have to be very careful flat out refusing to carry out requests from your manager, you can end up with no job at all! Seen it happen. There are agreed ways of doing things & refusing to do anything & storming out after that onto your delivery can get you in a sticky spot real quick. try it out my friend.

Post by **35wayno** » 27 May 2015, 16:25

Quite right, the manager has the right to instruct you to do anything if it's reasonable.
In future never refuse to follow a reasonable request, there have been cases of staff, who thought they were being picked on, refusing a request and promptly being suspended and eventually dismissed. Failing to follow a reasonable request is normally dealt with a gross misconduct.

The golden rule is never make a decision yourself that may affect the completion of your workload. Let your gaffs do that, that is what he is paid to do. If ever you wish to challenge his decision make sure a colleague is there to witness the conversation.

Good luck

Post by **Judgee** » 27 May 2015, 17:20

RM bosses can get you to do whatever they like as they have a reasonable request policy and they are the ones that determine what is reasonable so it's easier just to agree to it. That being said you do not have to work over your time and you do not have to bust your balls trying to get everything completed, just work at a reasonable pace. So in future just agree but point out that you will not be going over your time, so they will need to make some arrangements to cover your cutoff, that normally gets them thinking!

At the end of the day we are all slaves to the RM, but only within our working hours!

Decky Boy · Post by **Decky Boy** » 28 May 2015, 21:01

Max Power's duty is exempt from extra work ie there is a local agreement regarding lapsing and it has been agreed, by the CWU and Royal Mail, that Max need not be involved in the delivery of unforeseen workload. I would therefore argue that the manager's request is unreasonable ? ? ?

He could,of course, take some work out with him.... and then take it back. In doing this he has refused to deliver the extra mail because a) he's exempt and b) there was not enough time in his day to deliver the extra workload. The manager was informed by the employee that the workload wasn't manageable before leaving the office.

Employment Tribunals have ruled that regularly giving employees unmanageable workloads is a form of harassment. Managers beware

motherhubbard · Post by **motherhubbard** » 28 May 2015, 22:09

Decky Boy wrote:Max Power's duty is exempt from extra work ie there is a local agreement regarding lapsing and it has been agreed, by the CWU and Royal Mail, that Max need not be involved in the delivery of unforeseen workload. I would therefore argue that the manager's request is unreasonable ? ? ?

Since when did a local agreement take precedence over a national agreement?

Post by **coxie** » 29 May 2015, 11:23

motherhubbard wrote:
Decky Boy wrote:Max Power's duty is exempt from extra work ie there is a local agreement regarding lapsing and it has been agreed, by the CWU and Royal Mail, that Max need not be involved in the delivery of unforeseen workload. I would therefore argue that the manager's request is unreasonable ? ? ?
Since when did a local agreement take precedence over a national agreement?

You're right it doesn't. Managers request was reasonable, if you didn't have time you should share that concern and agree to do whatever the manager asks but just state you'll do whatever you can up until your time. Basically refusing to work. No duty is ever exempt, if a manager thinks you can do more work and asks that of you then you're best off agreeing, if you cut off because the manager misjudged it then that's his problem.

Decky Boy · Post by **Decky Boy** » 29 May 2015, 14:38

motherhubbard wrote: Since when did a local agreement take precedence over a national agreement?

I'd suggest they (local agreements) trump national agreements everytime as they are local or "specific" to a particular Delivery Office. Are you suggesting the DSM and the Area Rep who agreed the local deal have no authority ?

motherhubbard · Post by **motherhubbard** » 29 May 2015, 15:08

Decky Boy wrote:
motherhubbard wrote: Since when did a local agreement take precedence over a national agreement?
I'd suggest they (local agreements) trump national agreements everytime as they are local or "specific" to a particular Delivery Office.

You can suggest whatever you like but I suggest you would be wrong.
If the traffic was down 75% and the postie was finishing 2 hours early do you honestly believe he is exempt from working all his paid hours because of some local agreement?
Local agreements can only be built on national agreements. They can't exist in isolation.
Some local reps have ideas far above their stations.

Post by **aiden01** » 29 May 2015, 21:39

motherhubbard wrote:
Decky Boy wrote:Max Power's duty is exempt from extra work ie there is a local agreement regarding lapsing and it has been agreed, by the CWU and Royal Mail, that Max need not be involved in the delivery of unforeseen workload. I would therefore argue that the manager's request is unreasonable ? ? ?
Since when did a local agreement take precedence over a national agreement?

when it suit,s royal mail.

ROYALMAILCHAT

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