Buy downs?

[supersonic]

Theres been a lot of talk around VR 's recently, im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose. Please don't judge me and throw accusations at me re: protecting full time jobs. In all honesty ive been feeling it of late with the longer deliveries etc. I'm just curious, is there a reckoner similar to the one used to work out VR payments.

46 years old
16 years service
wanting to reduce from 39 to 25 hrs.

Thanks in advance

[hatetheboss]

Theres been a lot of talk around VR 's recently, im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose. Please don't judge me and throw accusations at me re: protecting full time jobs. In all honesty ive been feeling it of late with the longer deliveries etc. I'm just curious, is there a reckoner similar to the one used to work out VR payments.

46 years old
16 years service
wanting to reduce from 39 to 25 hrs.

Thanks in advance

If you buy down your hours there is a real possibility you will still be doing the longer deliveries, it will be the indoor hours which will be reduced.

[supersonic]

Theres been a lot of talk around VR 's recently, im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose. Please don't judge me and throw accusations at me re: protecting full time jobs. In all honesty ive been feeling it of late with the longer deliveries etc. I'm just curious, is there a reckoner similar to the one used to work out VR payments.

46 years old
16 years service
wanting to reduce from 39 to 25 hrs.

Thanks in advance

If you buy down your hours there is a real possibility you will still be doing the longer deliveries, it will be the indoor hours which will be reduced.

Yeh that's fine

[dvbuk55]

Theres been a lot of talk around VR 's recently, im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose. Please don't judge me and throw accusations at me re: protecting full time jobs. In all honesty ive been feeling it of late with the longer deliveries etc. I'm just curious, is there a reckoner similar to the one used to work out VR payments.

46 years old
16 years service
wanting to reduce from 39 to 25 hrs.

Thanks in advance

If you buy down your hours there is a real possibility you will still be doing the longer deliveries, it will be the indoor hours which will be reduced.

Yeh that's fine

The pay is less, the allowances are less and the pension is less and at 46 I'd consider that very carefully.

[supersonic]

Theres been a lot of talk around VR 's recently, im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose. Please don't judge me and throw accusations at me re: protecting full time jobs. In all honesty ive been feeling it of late with the longer deliveries etc. I'm just curious, is there a reckoner similar to the one used to work out VR payments.

46 years old
16 years service
wanting to reduce from 39 to 25 hrs.

Thanks in advance

If you buy down your hours there is a real possibility you will still be doing the longer deliveries, it will be the indoor hours which will be reduced.

Yeh that's fine

The pay is less, the allowances are less and the pension is less and at 46 I'd consider that very carefully.

I know all that and appreciate the advice, really. I just want to consider my options and would like to know is there a formula?

[supersonic]

Also there may be others who are looking at the VR option who may want to consider a buy down instead?

[dvbuk55]

Also there may be others who are looking at the VR option who may want to consider a buy down instead?

I took buy down almost 10 years ago but I was 59 and had only a few months left before the pension changed to a career average and not a final salary consequently the loss was very tiny but in your case it would be considerable. There was a number of us applied for VR but only two us was given buy down the other was the unit rep and nobody got VR. I got the lump sum of course and also the lump sum for my pension and my pension so it was financially beneficial to me. However if I was 46 I doubt I would have considered it. Oh I didn't pay any tax either.

[supersonic]

Also there may be others who are looking at the VR option who may want to consider a buy down instead?

I took buy down almost 10 years ago but I was 59 and had only a few months left before the pension changed to a career average and not a final salary consequently the loss was very tiny but in your case it would be considerable. There was a number of us applied for VR but only two us was given buy down the other was the unit rep and nobody got VR. I got the lump sum of course and also the lump sum for my pension and my pension so it was financially beneficial to me. However if I was 46 I doubt I would have considered it. Oh I didn't pay any tax either.

Thanks for the reply, in all honesty I'm considering my future with RM and have no doubt I wont reach retirement with the company, I want to stay for a few more years (pay off my mortgage) and then I'm looking to move on. I'm firmly in the 'Jobs fooked' camp, and I don't mean to upset or antagonise anyone with that comment its just the way I feel, I know I'll still be doing delivery but that means less time I have to spend in an office listening to dom's and lino's spouting there crap on a daily basis, and also means less danger of me being booted out of the business for saying or doing something that may get me into bother.

[dvbuk55]

Also there may be others who are looking at the VR option who may want to consider a buy down instead?

I took buy down almost 10 years ago but I was 59 and had only a few months left before the pension changed to a career average and not a final salary consequently the loss was very tiny but in your case it would be considerable. There was a number of us applied for VR but only two us was given buy down the other was the unit rep and nobody got VR. I got the lump sum of course and also the lump sum for my pension and my pension so it was financially beneficial to me. However if I was 46 I doubt I would have considered it. Oh I didn't pay any tax either.

Thanks for the reply, in all honesty I'm considering my future with RM and have no doubt I wont reach retirement with the company, I want to stay for a few more years (pay off my mortgage) and then I'm looking to move on. I'm firmly in the 'Jobs fooked' camp, and I don't mean to upset or antagonise anyone with that comment its just the way I feel, I know I'll still be doing delivery but that means less time I have to spend in an office listening to dom's and lino's spouting there crap on a daily basis, and also means less danger of me being booted out of the business for saying or doing something that may get me into bother.

If they offer it to you then you can take it and after two years apply for any full time post that crops up. Good luck.

[supersonic]

Thanks, I guess i'll just have to wait see if it's up for offer

[aposter]

Thanks for the reply, in all honesty I'm considering my future with RM and have no doubt I wont reach retirement with the company, I want to stay for a few more years (pay off my mortgage) and then I'm looking to move on. I'm firmly in the 'Jobs fooked' camp, and I don't mean to upset or antagonise anyone with that comment its just the way I feel, I know I'll still be doing delivery but that means less time I have to spend in an office listening to dom's and lino's spouting there crap on a daily basis, and also means less danger of me being booted out of the business for saying or doing something that may get me into bother.

+1

[plaguelift]

Your line manager should be able to pop your details into his computer and give you an instant quote. I'm not interested in buying down hours, but he did a quote for me as an example for others in our office. I'm 43, have done 20 years and was quoted £20,000 for buying down from 39 hours to 20. I think you would pay tax on this lump sum. I wouldn't consider it at all because in the long term your pensionable pay is down, and your holiday/sick pay is down. If I was 10 or 15 years older I would have given it serious thought (voluntary redundancy might be a better option) but I feel, for me, it's not the right time for it. Each individuals situation is different though, and some may be glad of the instant cash.

[baldrick]

Theres been a lot of talk around VR 's recently, im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose. Please don't judge me and throw accusations at me re: protecting full time jobs. In all honesty ive been feeling it of late with the longer deliveries etc. I'm just curious, is there a reckoner similar to the one used to work out VR payments.

46 years old
16 years service
wanting to reduce from 39 to 25 hrs.

Thanks in advance

Hi supersonic. I don't think there is a Ready Reckoner for Buy Downs as there are too many variables, but there is a formula set out in the MTSF2 2010 agreement which I think still applies. Fishtank has posted that agreement in the Downloads section. This is the relevant paragraph:
....................................................................................................................................................................
Managing the Surplus Policy - Appendix 4
Buy Down (hours) Policy

5.4 The Compensation Payment will be an amount equivalent to the compensation otherwise payable
to the employee in accordance with the Voluntary Redundancy Terms multiplied by A/B where

A = the employee's contracted hours immediately following the Buy Down and

B = the employee's contracted hours immediately prior to the Buy-Down
....................................................................................................................................................................

So, at 46 years old with 16 years service, according to the MTSF2 VR Ready Reckoner your VR payment would be 69.375 weeks.
It would be multiplied by A (your contracted hours after Buy Down) = 25, divided by B (your contacted hours before Buy Down) = 39.
Putting that in a calculator to get decimal figures, 25 divided by 39 = 0.6410.

So your VR payment of 69.375 weeks is multiplied by 0.6410.

Again using a calculator (my maths isn't good!) : 69.375 x 0.6410 = 44.469 weeks Buy Down.

I think that sounds about right, but I'm not an expert on buy down so don't take it as gospel.

Edit: I don't know about the tax position on Buy Downs. For VR tax isn't payable on the first £30k, but I think you do now pay tax on Buy Down payments, though I think I remember seeing somewhere on here that RM will pay half the tax amount.

[baldrick]

im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose.

I'm not sure about this, but I thought you could ask for a Buy Down of hours at any time, not just when VRs are being offered.
Anyone know?

[TrueBlueTerrier]

im in a position where I would consider buying down my hours if the opportunity arose.

I'm not sure about this, but I thought you could ask for a Buy Down of hours at any time, not just when VRs are being offered.
Anyone know?

Not in deliveries unfortunately. If there is a preference exercise because of an impending revision then thats usually when people first hear about the possibility.

We had a postwoman here who went down from 40 - 30 hours - as it was voluntary and outside of a revision, she did not get anything.