Entitled Annual while sick

[Harv12]

Can some one point me in the right direction as to where it says im entitled to my annual leave back while on sick please.

just want some kinda proof to show my boss

thanks

[TrueBlueTerrier]

https://www.gov.uk/taking-sick-leave" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Sick leave and holiday
Statutory holiday entitlement is built up (accrued) while an employee is off work sick (no matter how long they’re off).

Any statutory holiday entitlement that isn’t used because of illness can be carried over into the next leave year. If an employee is ill just before or during their holiday, they can take it as sick leave instead.

If the employer agrees, employees can choose to take paid holiday while on sick leave. For example, because they don’t qualify for sick pay. Any rules relating to sick leave will still apply.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-18534028" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The ECJ says "the point at which the temporary incapacity arose is irrelevant".

"Consequently, a worker is entitled to take paid annual leave, which coincides with a period of sick leave, at a later point in time, irrespective of the point at which the incapacity for work arose."

According to an earlier ECJ ruling, workers who fall sick before a period of annual leave can also reschedule that leave period so that it does not clash with their sick leave.

The UK's opt-out from the Working Time Directive only applies to the directive's clause setting a 48-hour limit on the working week.

The UK government says "no-one can opt out of any other part of the directive".

[TrueBlueTerrier]

http://www.aboutemployeebenefits.co.uk/ ... leave.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Employee Holidays Coinciding With Sick Leave

In the past, if an employee’s sick leave coincided with annual leave the attitude of most employers was ‘too bad’. But a recent ruling by the European Court of Justice (ECJ) found in favour of an employee who took legal action against his council employer. The outcome of this case has caused much controversy, especially among employers. The ECJ ruling means that employees can now reclaim holiday entitlement that would have been lost while on sick leave.

European Court of Justice Employee Holiday Ruling

Madrid council worker Francisco Pereda took legal action against his employers when they refused to change his annual leave entitlement. Mr Pereda suffered an injury just before he was due to take annual holiday leave. His employers refused Mr Pereda’s request to change his leave dates but the European Court of Justice decided otherwise. The ECJ found that Mr Pereda should have been given the option to postpone his leave entitlement. The ECJ also found that Mr Pereda should have been given the ability to add the leave onto the following year’s entitlement.

[Harv12]

thanks, is there any thing in the royal mail guide lines ??

was off sick last year for a few month and in that time i had 2 weeks leave. i had to get a doctors note to say i could fly, which i paid for. i didn't sign off sick for a couple of weeks after i returned,

asked my line mananger he had a look and said he had put me down as on leave, ( how can he do that when i hadn't sign off sick ),

he's now questioning that im entitled to these two weeks and said he has to contact HR,

Other folk at my office who have had leave while on sick have claimed there's back don't know why he's questioning my claim, if im entitled to it i want it

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

Have you got fit notes covering the entire period you were off sick? Including the time you were on holiday?

[TrueBlueTerrier]

thanks, is there any thing in the royal mail guide lines ??

was off sick last year for a few month and in that time i had 2 weeks leave. i had to get a doctors note to say i could fly, which i paid for. i didn't sign off sick for a couple of weeks after i returned,

asked my line mananger he had a look and said he had put me down as on leave, ( how can he do that when i hadn't sign off sick ),

he's now questioning that im entitled to these two weeks and said he has to contact HR,

Other folk at my office who have had leave while on sick have claimed there's back don't know why he's questioning my claim, if im entitled to it i want it

Nothing in Royal Mail guidelines as to be honest there is no point. Its a statutory entitlement that you can't be both on sick and annual leave at the same time. However, they can ask you, and you can accept if you wish, to use Annual Leave whilst on sick. That may be the point of confusion so hopefully they will clear it up.

BTW as an aside a Statutory entitlement means you are entitled to something by Law, no matter what other agreements you have entered into. This trumps it.

[Harv12]

yes i had doctors sick note that covered me, also a letter stating i was ok to fly which dom requested

[Harv12]

Update,

spoke to line manager and dom today, enventually got an answer,

Because i was left the country im supposidly classed as on leave even tho i didn't sign off the sick untill a week or so after i returned, Dom stated that i can get my holidays back but he would have to put down as i had signed off sick and back on again when i returned, and it would trigger another stage interview, 3rd.

he stated i can't be on the sick and on holiday at the same time, also said that if i can sit on a plane for 3 hrs i can come into work even tho my doctor and ATOS told me to stay off.

He said my case was different from other staff that have got their leave back as i had actually left the country even tho i followed protocal and got a doctors note to cover me,

Anyone know where i stand. i'll be contacting my area rep to discuss the matter tomorrow just wanted a heads up to what i can expect

[rhino49]

I you went on holiday on a plane, even whilst having put in a sick note, why are you trying to get another holiday? Isn't that a bit like ghosting overtime where someone is paid twice for working over the same period of time? I would have thought that the reclaiming of leave was designed for people who were too ill to enjoy a holiday when off sick!!!

[clashcityrocker]

As you stated earlier you can't be off sick and on holiday.
As you were sick, you weren't on holiday, even if you were out of the country.

Fairly rare as the case may be, I don't see there is any difference and I would argue that you are still owed the holiday.

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

They are trying to scare you off by saying that coming off sick the on holiday then sick again will trigger a further stage. Ask dom to put that in writing then lodge a grievance if he is stupid enough to put it in writing

[Harv12]

If im entitled to the leave back i want it back even if i was away or not, not trying to pull a fast one or anything but there's lads at my office that have claimed 5 weeks back, if the law states im due the time back no matter what the circumstances why shouldn't i claim it,

[fishtank]

The only problem you might run into is the sick pay conditions policy.

Conditions on which Sick Pay is payable
Entitlement to sick pay is always subject to strict observance of the following conditions:

Self-certificates or medical certificates, including ‘fit notes’, must be received by the business for all sick absences

The business must be satisfied that an employee's absence is necessary and due to genuine illness

The business reserves the right to refuse sick pay if an absence is due to, or is aggravated by, causes within the employee's control, or if the employee has neglected instructions given by a Doctor

An absent employee shall remain at their normal home address (other than to receive in-patient treatment) unless they have consent of their line or local personnel manager

Employees who are sick immediately before they are due to go on holiday must confirm to their Line Manager that they are going on holiday on the due date (unless sick absence continues and the employee remains at home)

If you didn't inform them you were going on holiday even with a doctor's note they may try to take back the sick pay but it would still be your choice whether you took it as unpaid leave or annual leave.

[Harv12]

i informed them over a week before, the Dom requested a doctors note to say i was ok to fly which i paid for my self,

line manager even brought that up saying id breached sickness protocals by not being at home, i hadn't i followed the rules to the letter