Seniority and Holidays

[capricorn1959]

I'd like a bit of imput from other posties about a situation that occurred in our office today.
Our holidays have always been picked on seniority, but the new boss we have said that is illegal and discriminates against those who haven't been here long. We are an office of about 64/65, and the way he has it planned it starting midway down the list.

I have no qualms about his, although I am about 9th I never choose the school hols as I like to leave those for staff with children,
and on the whole I do think I should be able to get the weeks I want, but I am just perplexed as to why it's suddenly become 'illegal'

My brother in law works at another office, with many more staff, and they are doing theirs on seniority,
so I'd like to ask about other offices nationwide,
and see if this is correct, or is our new boss just flexing his muscle, just because he's in charge.

We all started at the bottom of the rung, and will all gradually make our way up this list,
but it seems that seniority and loyalty counts for nothing.

Be interesting to read replies

[Pickle]

My office was the same till 3/4 years ago. We are an office of 50 and were now split into groups. If your 1st pick the 1st year your 2nd pick the next, then 3rd..... It did away with seniority.

[arnold cheshire]

senior to junior one year then next junior to senior in our office

[rehabron]

http://www.cwu.org/assets/_files/docume ... eement.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Have sent you the link for the way forward agreement.
The selection of annual leave is based on the principles of fairness to ALL employees and not on seniority unless a local agreement has been agreed but the principles of fairness should remain.

[Lou84]

I had an interesting chat with someone who said why should it be done on senority, when they've already picked the best walks, why should they then get the best holidays !

Ours are in three groups which rotate round each year so a different group gets first pick etc

Some offices just do it as one, anymore than three people wanting the same week then names goes in a hat and lucky dip !

[postmandick]

Hi some good points in my office we have done two weeks down and then two weeks up with the last week and days down and give each postman two days to pick there holidays or they are bypassed and then next year we reverse it...
so last one in gets to pick four weeks and in the reverse years the most senior gets to pick a four week slot.

our manager stated that he would pick them if we cannot get our act together ......... which galvanised the staff

Holidays should be a local agreement don't let your manager dictate

[dounome]

Seniority for Annual leave is definately not allowed in Royal Mail and hasnt been for years since way forward agreement.

[korky]

seniority should be there for duty picks, they earn their right after years of been treat like crap, (or even crappier)
holidays should be done on a yearly rotation like we have to keep it fair especially when it involves kids, i've had a few years where nothing going mid july & august, its just tough luck.
i was talking to someone today whose already booked a 2 week holiday in the 6 weeks holidays, and they're last pick for next year!

[bustedflush]

My office was the same till 3/4 years ago. We are an office of 50 and were now split into groups. If your 1st pick the 1st year your 2nd pick the next, then 3rd..... It did away with seniority.

This is what our office is starting next year 2015. It seems a happy compromise.

Using seniority is not illegal, merely questionable as to whether it would be acceptable when viewing it in the context of E-USSR rules, previous court/tribunal cases etc.

[Kings Norton]

Few years ago the DOM told us they are bringing in a new method in called "Absorption" or "Lapsing" as some may know it, this way nobody will have problems booking holidays, what bullshit that was they then never replaced staff that left so its a scramble now, i'm taking the six weeks i want or i will take two unpaid or three if i have to. plus 4 sick...

[dave72]

My office was the same till 3/4 years ago. We are an office of 50 and were now split into groups. If your 1st pick the 1st year your 2nd pick the next, then 3rd..... It did away with seniority.

We've done this for about 5 years now, works well

[capricorn1959]

Thankyou all for the comments.

I agree totally with the fairness of the lists being moved yearly,
but it was the managers use of 'illegal'
that made me question things.

If he'd have just said it was in the way forward agreement, it wouldn't have sounded quite so bad.

Thankyou rehabron for the link to the way forward agreement,
I didn't know half of what was in there!

For a communication business, the WTL sessions don't seem to tell us half of what we need to know.

[Patti-Ann]

As far as I know holiday's in my office are allocated on a 'first come first serve' basis - nothing to do with seniority?

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

Thankyou all for the comments.

I agree totally with the fairness of the lists being moved yearly,
but it was the managers use of 'illegal'
that made me question things.

If he'd have just said it was in the way forward agreement, it wouldn't have sounded quite so bad.

Thankyou rehabron for the link to the way forward agreement,
I didn't know half of what was in there!

For a communication business, the WTL sessions don't seem to tell us half of what we need to know.

Manager is actually correct, using seniority would be discriminatory and thus under equality act would be deemed illegal

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

http://www.cwu.org/assets/_files/docume ... eement.pdf

Have sent you the link for the way forward agreement.
The selection of annual leave is based on the principles of fairness to ALL employees and not on seniority unless a local agreement has been agreed but the principles of fairness should remain.

Local agreement to allow seniority is not allowed in this case