Compulsory Deliver to Neighbour - an end to lapsing???

[steve1873]

Now that we are being told DTN is now pretty much compulsory I guess this will make it much harder for any OPG on any given day to estimate how long they will be out on delivery. With that in mind, surely this gives us an open goal to reject outdoor lapsing? When the manager comes round asking if you will manage your lapsing for the day, simply point out to him your parcels, inform him that as you are now expected to perform deliver to neighbour then you estimate that you will not have the time to carry out the lapsing as you MAY have to attempt a neighbour for every single attendance call. Tell him however that you are happy to take any work that he/ she requests you to take, ask if they would like it done first or last, but that you MAY, depending on your attendance calls, have to bring back work and will be calling them later in the afternoon to confirm...

If this procedure is followed by a majority of OPG's up and down the country then lapsing will soon be a thing of the past. How can they possibly expect you to take more work out when the work on your own delivery has now become literally impossible to judge?

[Hitcher]

According to a recent LTB it's still down to the postie whether to do it or not.

EDIT: http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 15&t=63125" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[steve1873]

According to a recent LTB it's still down to the postie whether to do it or not.

EDIT: http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 15&t=63125" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yes, but here is the important bit in the agreement...

The process

Delivery OPG’s will continue to have the sole responsibility to decide if, when, and where, it is appropriate to deliver to a neighbour. However alternative delivery addresses should always be attempted except where the delivery OPG has reviewed or risk-assessed the alternative neighbour delivery options and has significant concerns over either their own safety, or the security of the item.
Any complaints arising as a consequence of the delivery OPG’s decision will be brought to the attention of the individual and CWU rep to find a mutually acceptable solution. Both parties recognise that there will be some additional walking involved in a second attendance call and returning to the original address with the P739, where this is not possible within existing duty time this may result in individuals having to extend beyond their scheduled finish time. Any extended delivery as a consequence of providing this service will be dealt with using normal local procedures.

Note the part where it says alternative delivery addresses should ALWAYS be attempted unless it has been risk assessed and deemed not appropriate. So basically, any items we bring back could in theory lead us to be interrogated as to whether or not an alternative address attempt was made!

[bustedflush]

Now that we are being told DTN is now pretty much compulsory I guess this will make it much harder for any OPG on any given day to estimate how long they will be out on delivery. With that in mind, surely this gives us an open goal to reject outdoor lapsing? simply point out to him your parcels, inform him that as you are now expected to perform deliver to neighbour then you estimate that you will not haWhen the manager comes round asking if you will manage your lapsing for the day,ve the time to carry out the lapsing as you MAY have to attempt a neighbour for every single attendance call. Tell him however that you are happy to take any work that he/ she requests you to take, ask if they would like it done first or last, but that you MAY, depending on your attendance calls, have to bring back work and will be calling them later in the afternoon to confirm...

If this procedure is followed by a majority of OPG's up and down the country then lapsing will soon be a thing of the past. How can they possibly expect you to take more work out when the work on your own delivery has now become literally impossible to judge?

What??? Your managers ASK if you can do the lapsing, not assume you will until you request otherwise? First I've heard of that!

About half of the stuff I bring back is those f*cking stupid recorded deliveries, most of which would easily go through the letterbox. Why oh why do the PO counters not push the tracked no signature service??

[clashcityrocker]

Because tracked is a business service and not one the general public can access.

To use Royal Mail Tracked 24™ and Royal Mail Tracked 48™, the minimum annual volume is 1,000 parcels a year per site across both services.

[Straight4ward]

Now that we are being told DTN is now pretty much compulsory I guess this will make it much harder for any OPG on any given day to estimate how long they will be out on delivery. With that in mind, surely this gives us an open goal to reject outdoor lapsing? When the manager comes round asking if you will manage your lapsing for the day, simply point out to him your parcels, inform him that as you are now expected to perform deliver to neighbour then you estimate that you will not have the time to carry out the lapsing as you MAY have to attempt a neighbour for every single attendance call. Tell him however that you are happy to take any work that he/ she requests you to take, ask if they would like it done first or last, but that you MAY, depending on your attendance calls, have to bring back work and will be calling them later in the afternoon to confirm...

If this procedure is followed by a majority of OPG's up and down the country then lapsing will soon be a thing of the past. How can they possibly expect you to take more work out when the work on your own delivery has now become literally impossible to judge?

When was the work on your own delivery ever possible to judge?

We can all hazard a reasonable estimate to say within 15-30 minutes but beyond that is almost impossible. Some days you get lucky, everyone is in and answers the door quickly. Another day it seems that no one is in and you’re plagued by people wanting directions.

If delivery to neighbour is used as RM suggest then it’s unlikely to add a great deal more to our time.

Quoting from a reply in The Courier from one Andy Hughes, operations customer experience manager (yep, that’s his title, apparently).
“We fully understand that it is not practical to try multiple delivery attempts, so we simply ask that you look at neighbouring properties to the right, left or straight ahead. You can look for the obvious signs that someone is at home, such as cars in the drive or an open window.”

That’s clear enough for me, immediate neighbour only or it comes back.

As for it sounding the death knell of lapsing, wishful thinking but it ain't gonna happen.

[dvbuk55]

Amazon logistics now state on their parcel notification they will leave it at a neighbours or in a safe place. The solely at the OPGs discretion hasn't lasted long, it looks as though it's every parcel every time. The difference being of course is that these guys are in vehicles and ours are on foot. I've never quite understood how Royal Mail and the CWU for that matter seem to think that time is elastic.

[raikky]

we have 2 managers in a 70 strong office. you think they will interrogate every postie who brings back parcels. at best we have 1 manager stay till 2pm. im happy to try to nrighbour if that's what they want. common sense tells me to deliver to a neighbour if I can see they are in or know they will be in and happy to take it. I can spend an extra 5 minutes walking to the next house (the driveways in our area are looong).

the look and disappointment on the neighbours faces says it all. they think you have a parcel for them and instead your asking can they take it in.

whatever RM wants from me now I couldn't care less, ill do what they want. they know my finish time end of.

[Lincox]

According to a recent LTB it's still down to the postie whether to do it or not.

EDIT: http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 15&t=63125" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yes, but here is the important bit in the agreement...

The process

Delivery OPG’s will continue to have the sole responsibility to decide if, when, and where, it is appropriate to deliver to a neighbour. However alternative delivery addresses should always be attempted except where the delivery OPG has reviewed or risk-assessed the alternative neighbour delivery options and has significant concerns over either their own safety, or the security of the item.
Any complaints arising as a consequence of the delivery OPG’s decision will be brought to the attention of the individual and CWU rep to find a mutually acceptable solution. Both parties recognise that there will be some additional walking involved in a second attendance call and returning to the original address with the P739, where this is not possible within existing duty time this may result in individuals having to extend beyond their scheduled finish time. Any extended delivery as a consequence of providing this service will be dealt with using normal local procedures.

Note the part where it says alternative delivery addresses should ALWAYS be attempted unless it has been risk assessed and deemed not appropriate. So basically, any items we bring back could in theory lead us to be interrogated as to whether or not an alternative address attempt was made!

And what might that be? How many local procedures for this are there across the country, and how do they vary from area to area?

[bustedflush]

Because tracked is a business service and not one the general public can access.

To use Royal Mail Tracked 24™ and Royal Mail Tracked 48™, the minimum annual volume is 1,000 parcels a year per site across both services.

I see. Thanks, didn't know that.

[dave72]

Sod that, never have tried a neighbour. Just say they were out too

[steve1873]

Sod that, never have tried a neighbour. Just say they were out too

This is, of course the obvious answer. It does however carry its own dangers. If the customer complaints start to pile up regarding neighbours being in and not delivery to them was attempted then I believe RM have the tools in the form of the PDA's to identify if a neighbour was tried.

[Sidley]

Wrap your PDA in tin foil.

[steve1873]

Wrap your PDA in tin foil.

Or leave it in van, carry around the old bit paper with you and just claim the thing froze/ battery died whatever.

The only thing with this is - if you have to do a special delivery on paper you need to call the office prior to 1pm so that they can confirm it 1 way or another!

[eastie]

Tell your DOM that you will come back to take out your lapsing if you have time.
When you come back at your official finish time say "sorry can't do it" that's what we do, don't take it out with you with your own walk