A few on here need a reality check

[Martin Walsh]

Lets be clear lots of reps and members are frustrated with the lack of Comms and details of the agreement.

My own opinion is that in these days of different options for most carriers and big posters the threat of a strike is often more of a threat then the actual strike. years ago we would go out on strike and return to work and still have all the Mail we started with. Not anymore , there are over 20 major other parcels carriers along with the major suppliers from the internet like Amazon. The CWU were right to use the threat but the continued extensions overplayed our hand and the threat of a strike became an idle threat as the pause meant many members would be difficult to now get out if strike action was called as they had believe there would be a deal.

The CWU negotiators believed they have got a very good deal , which no other company in the UK has given to any union following a share offering or privatisation. It is legally binding and therefore has been written by lawyers which unless your a legally trained individual needs to be explained by the same lawyers to what each section means in lay terms. But it covers the normal threats from privatisation , no break up of the company , no franchising a real threat , no outsourcing an even bigger threat , no two tier workforce.

Other then MPs the pay rise on offer is the best one around of a unionised workforce.

Pensions is subject to a separate deal including some improvements for the scheme set up for new recruits after 2008.

On workplace issues yes there is a new process for dealing with Mail Centre , RDCs and Voc closures. There also a joint statement on the outstanding Mail centre and RDC Voc Closures.

Now on delivery there is an agreement which will review the problems of delivery offices. But let's be clear if anyone is expecting the review to return delivery working to pre methods , job and finish , no absorption and a 3.5 hour delivery span is living in dreamland.

The solutions in delivery are not the same as they were pre 2007. Parcels are growing and so are the advertising mails both unaddressed and addressed. Traffic is not the same during the year but the amount of reserves and walks are which is why you have lapsing. Unless we tackle this then the problems with continue and I understands there will be incentive. Schemes from April. Remember when absorption was first agreed staff got a share via the 50 / 50 scheme.

The review will cover all the issues and will have joint visits.

B&H is covered but if I am honest the only way we can ever eliminate B&H completely is if offices walk if they or any member are targeted.

my understanding is that all the amendments were accepted by the negotiators.

It should not surprise anyone that both parties want to publish it at the same time and for Royal Mail the stock exchange announcement is also in their mind.

No doubt I will get a lot of negative comments but my advice is read the agreement before deciding whether it's a sale out.

[Badwolf]

Thanks for your post dingo. Well spoken mate. I have been reading some of the posts on here and find it amazing how little faith some have got in our union. I say if you don't want to be in the union get out or better still try to change things by becoming a rep yourself. (The hardest job I have ever done).

[Lounge Lizard]

Information that's much appreciated, Dingo, and as usual I tend to agree with all you've posted. Thanks.

[OnAFlyer]

Good post Dingo, all delivery offices are NOT the same and issues in individual offices need to be addressed separately.

I hope there is something in the agreement about staffing to workload instead of to a budget as is currently the case, however when most of the CWU's own members start early, and some work over without claiming, hiding the actual hours used then how can that be sorted until they stop doing it and show the real hours needed.

The job is nowhere near as crap as some of the people on here make out, that's why 99% have no intention of leaving.

For me personally a 5 year deal on T&C's, the pension issue being addressed and a decent pay rise is all I'm looking for, I have no issues with the job as a whole, I work my hours and go home. I read about the B&H in other offices though and hopefully the visits will address these issues because it isn't acceptable.

[fishtank]

I say if you don't want to be in the union get out or better still try to change things by becoming a rep yourself. (The hardest job I have ever done).

The hardest job I have done is the job of delivery postman.
If I'm honest being a rep doesn't even come close.

Traffic is not the same during the year but the amount of reserves and walks are which is why you have lapsing.

No we have lapsing to produce budgetary savings,How many offices are running well below their proper staffing levels and still being asked to lapse duties?

Unless we tackle this then the problems with continue and I understands there will be incentive. Schemes from April. Remember when absorption was first agreed staff got a share via the 50 / 50 scheme.

If the solution to lapsing is just to pay members an incentive to lapse we are in real trouble,If Royal Mail pay half of their savings to us they will simply attempt to double their savings targets.Instead of fighting cuts we are now to embrace,incentivise and encourage headcount reduction?
Where in the union's code of principles is that little nugget located?

If we think about this clearly most offices using lower model weeks are staffed to the level of lower summer traffic already,It's not lapsing these offices require but flexing up.Is there a part of this agreement that addresses the need to resource upwards?, Will those offices receive a lower level of incentive bonus because they are far more efficient already than areas that have had bogus "light touch" revisions or have refused to transform at all?

Once more it seems by your opinion and post alone that we may have winners and losers again.
Quelle surprise!

[exetererica]

.

[janitor]

Yep the shareholders will be the winners, the workforce will be the losers.

[janitor]

Thank you dingo if only the CWU hierarchy were this forthcoming with information, unfortunately we had all this with the BT2010 agreement, and that was the biggest pile of rubbish I have every known a union to capitulate to, what ever safeguards the union think they have, RM will drive a team of coach and horses through it sideways. It will be accepted, after all there is no plan b.

[POSTMAN]

B&H is covered but if I am honest the only way we can ever eliminate B&H completely is if offices walk if they or any member are targeted.

Have you really posted that!

[whisperstar24]

Dingo,

With regard to the current mtsf agreement, I believe it runs out in april 2014.
Does this new agreement include extentions to the MTSF?

I say this with regard to the further threat of mail centre closures and delivery office closures.
Can we expect the same terms for people leaving the business after april?

[wf]

B&H is covered but if I am honest the only way we can ever eliminate B&H completely is if offices walk if they or any member are targeted.

Have you really posted that!

That's what i was thinking !
The main thing the Ballot was about in my eyes
7 months of talks and that's it !
Offices are so split with last agreement
Union reps are in bosses pockets
What chance would the guy hated by the reps and managers
A like have of causing a walk out?
It will be the same ones getting pissed on again
What that pec needs is to get down and work in these
Offices .see what it's all about
Instead of ignoring the biggest issue
Thanks for the info
But I feel sick and don't think it's us here
That need the reality check !!!

[The_Wax_Man]

B&H is covered but if I am honest the only way we can ever eliminate B&H completely is if offices walk if they or any member are targeted.

Have you really posted that!

That's what i was thinking !
The main thing the Ballot was about in my eyes
7 months of talks and that's it !
Offices are so split with last agreement
Union reps are in bosses pockets
What chance would the guy hated by the reps and managers
A like have of causing a walk out?
It will be the same ones getting pissed on again
What that pec needs is to get down and work in these
Offices .see what it's all about
Instead of ignoring the biggest issue
Thanks for the info
But I feel sick and don't think it's us here
That need the reality check !!!

If forum threads can be voted on, then I vote for all of the above responses



+1

[Puppetmaster]

Can some one please explain one of the Unions key issues pre agreement ,"A fairs days wage for a fair days work" The PEC is I understand dominated by non delivery officers .

The size of rounds we are doing now ,in reality just means one thing sickness levels are increasing all the time with many serious illness and injuries occurring in younger people .When will the Union wake up and see the size of rounds these days on a daily cycle is crazy and pushes up stress levels even higher.

A union that was concerned about their members would look at the size of the rounds and the affects on ill health .They could if they chose put a number of studies in place to look at this, but always like the Courier focus on Mail centre issues not delivery issues .

I am sure the senior RM management really like the present CWU Leaders ,and must be so grateful to them that they accept their recommendations .Many people in delivery's see this agreement ,just like the deal of the Century last time a complete failure to look at the real issues on delivery.

Its about time everybody on all sides at the top and went back to the floor for 2 weeks to understand the real issues!

[newtimes]

I am not shooting the messenger
"has been written by lawyers which unless your a legally trained individual needs to be explained by the same lawyers to what each section means in lay terms." has our CWU negotiators ever heard of books, or does our union think we are thick. I am not shooting the messenger, I am raging. If its got to be explained by the same lawyers it shows that another lawyer can pull it apart,

[UNION JACK]

I say if you don't want to be in the union get out or better still try to change things by becoming a rep yourself. (The hardest job I have ever done).

The hardest job I have done is the job of delivery postman.
If I'm honest being a rep doesn't even come close.

Traffic is not the same during the year but the amount of reserves and walks are which is why you have lapsing.

No we have lapsing to produce budgetary savings,How many offices are running well below their proper staffing levels and still being asked to lapse duties?

Unless we tackle this then the problems with continue and I understands there will be incentive. Schemes from April. Remember when absorption was first agreed staff got a share via the 50 / 50 scheme.

If the solution to lapsing is just to pay members an incentive to lapse we are in real trouble,If Royal Mail pay half of their savings to us they will simply attempt to double their savings targets.Instead of fighting cuts we are now to embrace,incentivise and encourage headcount reduction?
Where in the union's code of principles is that little nugget located?

If we think about this clearly most offices using lower model weeks are staffed to the level of lower summer traffic already,It's not lapsing these offices require but flexing up.Is there a part of this agreement that addresses the need to resource upwards?, Will those offices receive a lower level of incentive bonus because they are far more efficient already than areas that have had bogus "light touch" revisions or have refused to transform at all?

Once more it seems by your opinion and post alone that we may have winners and losers again.
Quelle surprise!