Procedure for not having time to complete?

[stuarthosepipe]

Hello all,
First post, I am also going to speak to union rep (If I can find him).
Today, my delivery frame has been changed, and 'absorption' has been added to the start of the delivery.
This 'absorption' is all even numbers, and about 50 calls, whoever did it is so stupid they don't understand the concept of dead walking. So it means walking all down one side of the road and qa dead walk back, when it should be looped.
It is extra delivery which I have no time for and haven't been doing anyway, a handful of people are doing it, but the majority not, and it ends up being done on overtime by someone else.
Most people are claiming 30mins -2 hours OT a day without the absorption. But now they are putting it on frames they are going to say its your duty.
That isn't all. Despite my requests for the frame to be totally re-ordered falling on deaf ears, they have totally messed up my actual delivery. There are several houses that get on average 1 letter a day, which are bigger than firms which get a trayful every day.
Obviously they think this is all do-able and is the best order to do it in.
My view is now, to follow the frame, even though the order is a joke, going back on yourself several times.
I know I wont complete, so I need to know the best procedure for informing the management It can't be done.
If it was letters only and no packets I could probably just about do it.
Is it best to take out what you can do and leave the rest? Or take it out and bring it back?
Or just take the letters trackeds and specials and leave packets /bring packets back when I run out of time?
If anyone can advise that would be cool.
Cheers
Stuey

[ihatedogs]

/

[Lincox]

Not your call Stuey. Down to your manager. Your only liability is to inform your manager before you go out that you are unable to complete within your time. It is then the call of the line manager whether you leave behind or bring back at the end of your time. If you start trying to estimate how much to take out you will leave yourself open to accusations of being slow, wilful delay, taking insufficient out, etc etc. Don,t get bamboozled by management neglecting their responsibilities. As Fishtank has said on another thread, a manager has several methods available to him to make sure all of the work is completed on a daily basis. He is paid to do that. You are not.

[makingsounds]

Cut Off Procedure Guidelines
Following numerous phone calls into the department during the last few
months on the procedure for Cutting Off, the below is the wording taken
directly from the agreed appendix within the Conduct Code. Discussions are
scheduled to take place at national level to review this procedure and agree
a simple, clear and concise set of words covering this and absorption.
PRIOR TO COMMENCEMENT
Where an employee feels that on completion of preparation he/she may
experience difficulty in completing his/her delivery within the authorised
time allotted, he/she should approach his/her manager as soon as possible
before setting out on delivery. It will be for the manager to discuss any
problem and advise the employee what particular action should be taken.
AFTER COMMENCEMENT OF DELIVERY
If an individual is prevented from completing their delivery for any reason, it
is essential that this is reported immediately either by returning to the office
or by telephone (telephone costs will be refunded). A written record will be
kept. All employees should be informed of the local authorised
arrangements, in writing, preferably in plastic card form if available.

[SF]

Just tell them before you go out as soon as you realise you may not be able to complete. Then let the managers decide what they want you do to.

Managers at our place seem to not want to do any managing lately. Let them decide how to handle your cutoff .

[stuarthosepipe]

Thanks!
I can't believe the way they have done this.
All the talk about modernisation/ revisions, what happened to the computer software that was meant to revise all the jobs so they were more efficient and fair.
Instead they have just cut up the absorption jobs and lumped them on the start of others. 10 vans diverting off route to go to the same estate to do 20-30 mins each. Then driving back to start their own deliveries.
You couldn't make it up, really.
Stuey

[stuarthosepipe]

Can I also ask about overtime, in the past, in other offices, I've worked over my time and then when I've arrived back at the office there has been an overtime sheet, so you can claim exactly the right amount of time.

However, in my current office, the manager lists any overtime down BEFORE you go out, and always queries it (questions why you need so much, even if it's just an hour). This usually leads to people not claiming enough overtime and no way of correcting it when you get back late, because by that time it's already been submitted.

Surely you can't be expected to know exactly how much time you will go over?

Add to this the many occasions overtime has been crossed off the sheet, due to people not signing their van back in, or not signing the time they left for delivery etc... basically any reason they can find to not pay.

I am happy to go over if I am paid but with all the incidents of people not being paid I think I'll stick to my hours from now on.

[krussel]

I find this thing about adding extra onto a frame a bit suspicious to be honest. If you are absorbing a delivery to allow you to work your full hours then the delivery still exists and receives its own meched mail etc and has a frame. If you remove its frame and lump the roads onto other walks on a permanent basis then what do you do with the sequenced meched mail.

To get the mail in sequence to the new walks you would have to delete it in Aplus so that the mail was meched to the new frames. Therefore you have completely removed a duty ? Did your rep agree to this or have they pulled a fast one. ? I hope that makes some sense

As far as cutting off goes then the advice above is all good. I understand about the dead walking problem and this is normally caused by managers splitting up a walk which they have no actual knowledge about.

[krussel]

Add to this the many occasions overtime has been crossed off the sheet, due to people not signing their van back in, or not signing the time they left for delivery etc... basically any reason they can find to not pay.

This is totally wrong and the manager is liable. You cannot stop OT payments as a means of discipline. Where is your rep here

Surely you can't be expected to know exactly how much time you will go over?

Nope you cant. This is why its normal to tell them when you get back.

[stuarthosepipe]

You make sense Krussel,
What they have done is taken a delivery that used to be a full job with a permanent member of staff, and divided it up.
Initially it was absorption, but eventually they started sending the pre sorted tray mail to different frames.
Still, most people were not taking their absorb because of no time and threw the pre sorted mail back on the absorb frame.
Now they are getting rid of the absorb frame completely and have added extra onto the other deliveries, even though they weren't taking it due to lack of time.
Going to be a right mess tomorrow!

[Silly Sarah]

Can I also ask about overtime, in the past, in other offices, I've worked over my time and then when I've arrived back at the office there has been an overtime sheet, so you can claim exactly the right amount of time.

However, in my current office, the manager lists any overtime down BEFORE you go out, and always queries it (questions why you need so much, even if it's just an hour). This usually leads to people not claiming enough overtime and no way of correcting it when you get back late, because by that time it's already been submitted.

Surely you can't be expected to know exactly how much time you will go over?

Add to this the many occasions overtime has been crossed off the sheet, due to people not signing their van back in, or not signing the time they left for delivery etc... basically any reason they can find to not pay.

I am happy to go over if I am paid but with all the incidents of people not being paid I think I'll stick to my hours from now on.

Yes, where is your rep! The bottom line is your DOM is stealing your O/T. I have been in a similar situation with a DOM. I put in a grievance. Unfortunatly the grievance procedure is also crooked as DOMs look after their own.

[stuarthosepipe]

I hardly ever see our rep. A situation we had recently, was every member of the section walked off sorting at 8am as this is supposedly the time we should be able to finish doing it, in reality it takes until at least 8.30-9am!
Straight away there were calls for the union rep and the office manager to go to the office, but our rep was nowhere to be found.
The DOM came round and gathered everyone together trying to get everyone to go back sorting, eventually we did, but in this whole 10 minutes there was no sign of the union rep.
I do wonder what the union is actually doing right now!
Also back to what I mentioned earlier, whatever happened to the mapping software (was it pegasus?) which RM must have invested heavily in? It appears it has been scrapped in our office.

[Judgee]

Also back to what I mentioned earlier, whatever happened to the mapping software (was it pegasus?) which RM must have invested heavily in? It appears it has been scrapped in our office.

Pegasus is useless. If your office has stopped using it then it is in a better positon than other offices going through a revision.

[POSTMAN]

You have lost a duty,a job has been taken away from you,hrs have been scammed out of the office.
Also if you guys have to cut off/leave the absorption then that affects QOS and that is a no no.

You seriously need to get hold of your rep (who doesn't seem to be covering himself in any glory here) or your area rep,you've obviously been had over.

[iamnotadoormat]

this happened on my duty too. 100 extra calls. frame redone. houses that get little or no mail mysteriously disappeared. To now I haven't done the extra. but I hate the harassment of management everyday!!! my daily quote to them is "if you think I can get this delivered within my time, you come out with me"