GUILTY until reluctantly proved innocent !

[neilfair]

It would be suicidally naïve to think Royal Mail adopts the same approach to justice as does the legal system. I'm not saying British law is perfect, far from it, but at least it tries to pretend it is. RM doesn't pretend, it WANTS you to be guilty and tries very hard to ensure that is the outcome.

A colleague in Merseyside was driving to his round yesterday. He was on a slip road and the traffic was bumper to bumper as it always is at that time of the morning. A queue jumper drove as far as he could down the main carriageway and then signalled to move onto the sliproad. Not content with advancing every inch he could ahead of people who'd dutifully done the right thing, he then tried to bully his way onto the sliproad by aggressively edging over without being invited to do so.

Unfortunately he was parallel to the RM van and because he wasn't allowed to queue jump he's wound his window down and called the driver a loser, a dipstick and a retard. He hasn't had the desired response so he's moved onto threats. The driver has took it for the nonsense it is and said, while yawning, “whenever you're ready, see you at the next pull off”. Which has turned out to be a throwaway and dismissive remark he's regretted. The aggressor has indeed exited at the next pull off ….......... to use his mobile phone to report the RM employee for intimidating and threatening behaviour.

Not sure if the queue jumper is delusional, vindictive, thick or a combination of all three with other character flaws thrown in. But it's quite hard to be genuinely scared of a bloke in a (boxed in) Royal Mail van on his way to do his job when you're in a much faster vehicle on open road. Especially when it's obvious who is the bl**dy rude and selfish bully and who is treating the situation with the scorn it deserves.

But as I say, this is Royal Mail. The guy thought no more of it, went back to the office four hours later …...... and was suspended. Now I know there'll be people on here who think “Come on pal, that's not plausible, there must be more to this than you're telling us”. And I don't blame you, it does sound preposterous. It sounds ridiculous to me and I'm trying hard to tell it simply and without a load of histrionics. But that is how it happened. The guy has an outstanding record, is calm and level headed and certainly has nothing in his record to suggest a volatile attitude. Quite the reverse, he's seen as very calm and a peacemaker.

So by this criteria I could spot a BT engineer at a green box tomorrow, ask him the time …...... and then phone his bosses and say he's been abusive and insulting and I want him suspended. If he was suspended it'd be astonishing and unjust. But that's what has happened here. A guy has been removed from the office by virtue of a malicious allegation from a bad tempered and ill intentioned lout. No witnesses, no corroboration, no circumstances that indicate his version of events is true. Had I been the manager who received his ridiculously one-sided, untruthful and indignant call I'd have asked for the name of onlookers or the recording he made on his mobile ….......... and when I was told there was neither I'd have advised him that just like in the judicial system, there isn't sufficient to proceed with. Because quite obviously there isn't is there, it's the word of one person against the other.

But they have proceeded. A suspension is a tool and would be worrying to many people no matter how certain they are of their innocence. And it's unnecessary, the employee could have been 'confined to barracks' to keep him out of harms way until investigations are complete. But what investigations ? Go to the complainant's house, tell him you should have asked for witness' names at the time of his phone call but you were remiss. So you're asking now. When he replies he hasn't got any, apologise, but tell him it'll be going no further. As he wouldn't expect it to go any further if an allegation was made against him with no evidence or witnesses.

Then phone the postman and get normality and commonsense restored. Not to mention justice and a bit of appreciation for the bloke's efforts down the years in the face of this sort of contempt from some members of the public. You could even apologise for his short suspension. Sorry, got carried away there, it's me who is getting delusional now.

[superports]

Remove any mention of RM/post office and it would be unbelievable.

[houseoflords]

This is just typical how Comanies believe People they've never met over a Worker who they have known for years etc, just shows you what Firms & especially RM think of you and that is Dog Shite!

[PhilthyPhil]

We have had conduct code used several times on drivers when someone has phoned up to complain, even though no other evidence is given

[ebbzie]

This is a joke ,what kind of crap manager has he got????

[hantsman]

Is this said RM driver a full timer on 40 hours?

[neilfair]

No, he's part-time. I know there's a school of thought that full-timers are focused on even more harshly because the potential dismissals save a greater amount of money. But we shouldn't get divisive (not saying you are doing that or even suggesting it, I know you're making a valid point).

My point is that management have got so confrontational, have been employed and instructed to be confrontational, that the obvious truth no longer matters. They are so focused, obsessed, motivated as to your guilt that facts are irrelevant. It doesn't matter how clear the evidence is, they can't even allow themselves to believe you may be in the right. It's called insanity.

[fmrPOSTIE]

he's been suspended for bringing RM into disrepute?

I think the charges will be thrown out but keep us informed...

[fishtank]

he's been suspended for bringing RM into disrepute?

I think the charges will be thrown out but keep us informed...

Problem is these things can spiral.
Depending on how much of a prick this guy is...suddenly his wife was with him and she heard everything...and one of his mates was in the car behind and he saw everything...etc,etc.

[steven100]

Personally to suspend is ott. Sadly rm don't have managers more like little hitlers. Is the manager a ex-postie?????

[neilfair]

You are so right fishtank, and this is his greater anxiety. Once he's exonerated he fears he'll lose his round, either now or fairly soon afterwards. Because he is one and they are many. He thinks the guy is off a round fairly near to the one he does (which explains them being on the same stretch of road). So if he wins the battle he's anxious a war looms. And who wants that.

RM, if legally possible, should send a message to these people that if you are anti-social and make malicious allegations you will pay a price ....... like going without a delivery for three months. Small price to pay when you could have cost a bloke his job. But of course that's wishful thinking. They, RM, have sway over employees and none whatsoever over customers. So as is the way of the world, and these managers who want to exert control, they will seek the path of least resistance and target the employee.

All you ever hope for as an employee in these situations is damage limitation, winning is slightly more difficult to quantify.

[neilfair]

Steven, manager is an ex postie. But not a popular one, big surprise eh !

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

Sorry but there are three sides to every story, in this case the RM side, the Civillian side and the Truth, niether party will admit to fabricating anything so quotes like:

RM, if legally possible, should send a message to these people that if you are anti-social and make malicious allegations you will pay a price .......

RM cant prove its and anti social or malicious complaint, end of day its his word against complainants, so if postie has been suspend with pay for duration until a;; facts that can be established have been then unfortunately thats the way its going to go

[NWpostie]

Do your front locker window have a sticker like mine that says

"Royal Mail will not accept any abuse and threats to any employee, we have a zero tolerance to any abuse" or words to that effect, I can't recall the exact word, but you do get my meaning, this is exactly what has happened in this case, the employee of RM has been abused and threatened by this member of the public, where is RM zero tolerance in that ?

This will not stick, threaten a grievance procedure and if threatened with the sack tell him you will put an ET1 in and make his day hell, then claim compo I wonder if you can also claim compo directly from the Manager as well as the company ? it was set an interesting precedence if you can sue a manager or Lino personally as well as the Company ?


Bullies are coward when victims fight back and they don't like it

[fishtank]

I would advise members to report any incidents like this as soon as possible to both your manager and your rep.
It may seem trivial and not worth the bother at the time but it's pretty obvious how easily it can escalate and if you've already reported the incident it makes your position far stronger.