Agreement on lapsing duties

[incogneeeto]

Are there any national agreements covering the lapsing of duties?
I assume it is contained in one some where, can someone point me in the right direction.

Thanks

[Martin Walsh]

The agreement is covered in the Pay and Mod agreement in annex a and b.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Pay and Modernisation Agreement - The Flexibility One http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 36&t=12462" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Absorption advice http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 36&t=17905" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[NWpostie]

Do not however expect the management to follow the lapsing agreement to the letter in good faith, the entire office will have to stand together behind this.

[dvbuk55]

Generally the agreement goes something like "we are lapsing a,b,c and d duties 6 days a week for the forseeable future" and the opportunity for extra leave - pretty slim if people who have left and long term sick haven't been replaced and managers are coming in from all around just to clear SOME of the backlog, but hey there's the agreement

[incogneeeto]

Thanks for the info

In the MC I work in they have decided to lapse a duty and then cover part of it on ot while also having pressure overtime as well, can they do this?

It doesn't seem right to me to lapse an 8 hour duty and pay out 6-7 hours ot.

[hans solo]

still will save them 1 hour which will be fed into office savings to boost their bonus pool
the more work you do less hours used more pennies for mgmt
work your prop hours and dont start before time usually scares them re lapsing

[not me]

Generally the agreement goes something like "we are lapsing a,b,c and d duties 6 days a week for the forseeable future" and the opportunity for extra leave - pretty slim if people who have left and long term sick haven't been replaced and managers are coming in from all around just to clear SOME of the backlog, but hey there's the agreement

yup,pretty much how it is.
union reps roll over and say nothing(in our office)
staff are too dense to see the big picture
they now have staff going out at 8am to lapse(break is 8.20am),then lasping again when they go out on delivery

[incogneeeto]

yup,pretty much how it is.
union reps roll over and say nothing(in our office)
staff are too dense to see the big picture
they now have staff going out at 8am to lapse(break is 8.20am),then lasping again when they go out on delivery

What can the union reps say though? If people are willing to do it and there is nothing to say overtime can't be used to cover it.

[not me]

yup,pretty much how it is.
union reps roll over and say nothing(in our office)
staff are too dense to see the big picture
they now have staff going out at 8am to lapse(break is 8.20am),then lasping again when they go out on delivery

What can the union reps say though? If people are willing to do it and there is nothing to say overtime can't be used to cover it.

well for starters. how about questioning the fact staff are harrassed to lapse and many end up working over or failing packets as a result of lapsing?
suppose given neither of them are under pressure on the duties they have,it isnt a worry.
BTW this is from someone who stands their ground and doesnt work over. lapsing or no lapsing.
however why should work be a fight every day?

[clashcityrocker]

I assume every office is different but as part of the weekly IR meeting any opportunities for lapsing should be identified.
Whether this is due to an excess of indoor hours (and this will vary from week to week depending who is on holiday and who is off sick) or the pseudo-science of decreased call-rates due to lower traffic forecasts this should be communicated to the staff.
Despite the weekly IR meeting being an obligatory part of the BT agreement I get the impression they don't always happen and if they do, any discussions are not relayed to the staff.
While it might look like your rep has just rolled over, this may not be the case.

And it is very difficult to make any argument against lapsing when you know certain of your colleagues are finishing early.
We don't ask them to start before their time. We don't ask them to prep their D2D in their own time. We don't ask them to use their cars on delivery.We don't ask them to carry overweight bags or fail to weigh them before leaving the office.
Every minute that they think they are saving, RM identifies as a lapsing opportunity.

[dvbuk55]

There is supposed to be a formula for lapsing duties and identifying the areas where lapsing can take place I think its called the Delivery Resourcing tool but of course it requires managing and understanding and if that isn't there it's back to plan B..............lapse 4 duties 6 days a week regardless of capability: and the resource meeting doesn't really address any of the problems.

[not me]

I assume every office is different but as part of the weekly IR meeting any opportunities for lapsing should be identified.
Whether this is due to an excess of indoor hours (and this will vary from week to week depending who is on holiday and who is off sick) or the pseudo-science of decreased call-rates due to lower traffic forecasts this should be communicated to the staff.
Despite the weekly IR meeting being an obligatory part of the BT agreement I get the impression they don't always happen and if they do, any discussions are not relayed to the staff.
While it might look like your rep has just rolled over, this may not be the case.

And it is very difficult to make any argument against lapsing when you know certain of your colleagues are finishing early.
We don't ask them to start before their time. We don't ask them to prep their D2D in their own time. We don't ask them to use their cars on delivery.We don't ask them to carry overweight bags or fail to weigh them before leaving the office.
Every minute that they think they are saving, RM identifies as a lapsing opportunity.

the what?
we lapse every day
around 6-8 walks mon/tue
then 2-6 the rest of the week
somoeone phones in sick,suddenly theres another lasped walk.
we have the usual large staff shortages and asking for days off is a joke(unless you are in the 'gang')

[incogneeeto]

Are there any agreements for lapsing in mail centers? you all work in delivery's and I can see the argument for not lapsing if you can't complete your own delivery but I think this is a different situation, there is no way to cover the last part of the duty they are lapsing. The lapsed duty is a night duty and has a final mgv run to a delivery office, at that time everyone is on there own final runs to do's and no one can cover it within there duty so OT is the only way to cover it.

[not me]

Are there any agreements for lapsing in mail centers? you all work in delivery's and I can see the argument for not lapsing if you can't complete your own delivery but I think this is a different situation, there is no way to cover the last part of the duty they are lapsing. The lapsed duty is a night duty and has a final mgv run to a delivery office, at that time everyone is on there own final runs to do's and no one can cover it within there duty so OT is the only way to cover it.

well its not being lapsed then IYKWIM