Dismissed Wilful Delay

[thehulk76]

I have been dismissed after nearly 5 weeks suspension for wilful delay of mail. A bag containing 30 items of mail for various calls covering 60% of a rural delivery was found on a Monday morning so I have been accused of failing to deliver them on the previous Saturday. My manager thinks I they were late mis-sorts that I forgot about so I dumped them on the Saturday when I returned to office or Monday morning when starting. He says there is no other reasonable explanation for the mail getting there other than me doing it, which of course I didn't do this I've been in the job long enough not to do this.

I have of course asked for an appeal and also asked for the office cctv to be looked at. How long will it take for the appeals process to happen and should I think about getting a lawyer involved or would the union assist me in this. Does anyone on here have any experience in a similar case, how likely do you think it would be for me to win my appeal ? My local rep seems confident as three other cases in my office were dismissed for wilful delay and admitted doing it but still won there appeal.

I am on a 25hr contract but have been covering a full time duty for well over a year plus a regular 5 hours a week on top of that so an extra 20 hrs a week every week for a long period of time I take there is no way if I win my appeal that I would be some way compensated for the loss of earnings.

Any help would be great.

[flaminmoses]

What was the reason why they were not delivered?

[thehulk76]

The items were never delivered as I never had them in my possession even though my DOM doesn't believe me despite saying that he'd was sure that I have not lied during his interviews.

[fishtank]

He says there is no other reasonable explanation for the mail getting there other than me doing it.

Is there another reasonable explanation?
If the due date of delivery can be nailed down to the Saturday and they were found on the following Monday that only leaves you and somebody maliciously setting you up.
I'm not judging but you can see where reasonable assumption comes into this.
I would advise you to get the union involved at a higher level than your local rep...despite his optimism.

[flaminmoses]

so basically these items you were not aware about before you went out?

take it you didnt go out before the missorts?

[Tamsky]

I've sent you a PM. I'll be in touch when I get back.
Cheers

[graffi]

Wilful delay has to be a deliberate action that delays the mail ... Surely if you deny any involvement with said mail and RM have no evidence to prove that it was you and nobody else then dismissal has to be questioned !! Get your Area Deliver Rep to do your appeal (no disrespect to your delivery rep)

[stokes11eg]

I have been dismissed after nearly 5 weeks suspension for wilful delay of mail. A bag containing 30 items of mail for various calls covering 60% of a rural delivery was found on a Monday morning so I have been accused of failing to deliver them on the previous Saturday. My manager thinks I they were late mis-sorts that I forgot about so I dumped them on the Saturday when I returned to office or Monday morning when starting. He says there is no other reasonable explanation for the mail getting there other than me doing it, which of course I didn't do this I've been in the job long enough not to do this.

I have of course asked for an appeal and also asked for the office cctv to be looked at. How long will it take for the appeals process to happen and should I think about getting a lawyer involved or would the union assist me in this. Does anyone on here have any experience in a similar case, how likely do you think it would be for me to win my appeal ? My local rep seems confident as three other cases in my office were dismissed for wilful delay and admitted doing it but still won there appeal.

I am on a 25hr contract but have been covering a full time duty for well over a year plus a regular 5 hours a week on top of that so an extra 20 hrs a week every week for a long period of time I take there is no way if I win my appeal that I would be some way compensated for the loss of earnings.

Any help would be great.

I have known that in our office if a 'workmate' had accidentaly cleared the wrong box from IPS-,quite simply dump them on his way out!

[patrickstar]

advice- do not rely on your internal appeal with royal mail to get your job back-the clock has already started ticking on you submitting an employment appeal.you have 3 months to submit an appeal to an employment tribunal from the date of the letter you were dismissed.if the union are supporting you with your internal appeal then they will be aware that you may have to submit an et just in case.royal mail are notorious for deliberately dragging out an internal appeal just so you run out of time to submit an et.a good union rep will know when to put in an et .i hope you are successful with your rm appeal but please cover yourself by an et application.there is plenty of people that can help you with this if you are supported by your local branch

thanks

[charlie1]

Hi, as Patrickstar has already stated, do not rely on Royal Mails own appeals process to get your job back. You may have similar previous cases at your office. However, recently Royal Mail appear (at some offices) to be resorting to this kind of behaviour more often, to reduce numbers of staff.

An employment tribunal will most likely concentrate on if Royal Mail made a fair decision based on the evidence it has at the time. It does not operate like a normal court whereby you have to be proved guilty. Therefore at your Royal Mail appeal try and bring in as much new evidence as you can and do your best to discredit what they have already used against you. This will aid you should you have to resort to an employment tribunal.

Good luck.

[haddie]

once missed flats on ips frame and went out. it was a genuine mistake and DOM saw it as that

[hans solo]

surely wilful means just that its got to be intentional
how many deliberate acts of wilful delay can be caused by mgmt every day and they get away with
business requirements the usual excuse for them lying barstewards

[hans solo]

Wilful delay has to be a deliberate action that delays the mail ... Surely if you deny any involvement with said mail and RM have no evidence to prove that it was you and nobody else then dismissal has to be questioned !! Get your Area Deliver Rep to do your appeal (no disrespect to your delivery rep)

with the chaos in this office in getting people out door as fast as poss it maybe someone lifted wrong bag and returned it later

[Militantdave]

right what to do.

First ,as you are no longer an employee you can instruct a solicitor if you wish and file papers for an employment tribuneral.

Second, on said forms claim for ALL the hours you currently do regularly.This is because they can reasonably assume the change of hours is perminant after a certain length of time (length varies from panal to panel but 6 months plus)as such you should then claim for all the benifits differance you have not been payed .ie delivery suplliment,pension and holiday pay.

Third .this cannot be wilful delay unless they can prove you purposly didnt bother to deliver the mail.At worst it unintentional delay ,more likely somebody got the wrong packets and stuffed um somewhere for the weekend.

this will be such an easy rap to beat ,especially with cctv.

[blackadder]

has any of the post got a post date on them ?